Caravans

I do not know how long they stay in one place at a time, this is not well defined

Two of their caravans came through Roca Azul at the west end of Lake Chapala while we were there. There were 24 units in each caravan. They stayed for 6 days each. They had trip/tours on two of those days but did not appear to have much else to do the other days. We met up with them on another occasion maybe 6 or 7 years ago when they came into Teotihuacan with 22 rigs (in 18 spaces) and had an organized bus trip to Mexico City when they were gone a couple days (not everyone went). I forget how long they were there. They had Green Angel years ago but did not see any this year. That's about all I know.

Yes Alaska is far from being unsafe, I went twice and I can not imagine going with a bunch of other people and not be able to stop whenever I want to admire the scenery, shorten or extend a stay if desire. Reason for me for a caravan is that I don't think I would venture off the main highways being scared to end up in a Dead End, or dead at the end! and I would miss some. Safety is sure one of the reason for me as I do not know exactly what to expect. But I am very tempted to try it alone and maybe tie up with someone I meet on the way down and stay on main roads for the first trip. I have been on many trips across USA, Canada and Europe and was never scared to a point to turn around, common sense prevail and I would probably do fine in Mexico as well.

I know Caravan Soleil does not cover the long stay in PV, this is explained in the brochure, you do not have to stay there and you do not have to return with them, which I would not anyway, once I know my where abouts, I am ok on my onw, especially to go back on a the main road.

Their tour is about 26 days from Texas to PV. I do not know how long they stay in one place at a time, this is not well defined, or at least I did not see it in the brochure nor did I saw it in other caravan, this seems to be a gray area. They do have presentation to explain everything so I could go and ask questions.

I would not mind an English speaking caravan but my wife is not fluent in english so it would make a long trip for her, beside bonjour and good morning exchanges with others. I plan on learning basic spanish before I go, I think it is just common sense for me.

Caravanes Soliel does not cover their long stay in PV. Neither does Horizon Lussier in Lo de Marcos, or DPL in Melaque or Amigos Rodantes in the Yucatan. I know, we sell their customers bus tours in French while they are there to keep them busy. It is a captive market for the company I wagon master for, who also operate in French. The Quebec caravan model is a relatively fast trip down and back, and a long stay at a destination at the customers expense. This makes the trips seem cheaper, and they can avoid paying the wagon master for long periods of time. This works well with most French Canadians. Being from Quebec, I am sure you know Quebecers like to stick together in tight groups where they can communicate in French. If you only speak French you are automatically isolated in Mexico. To each, their own. My boss wanted to try this formula with English Canadians & Americans and it was an abysmal failure, as I told him it would be. They get bored after a couple of weeks in one location, so teh current formula, while still long term trips, is to keep stays at 10-14 days maximum in any one spot. This is the formula used by most companies, and like all other caravan companies serving Americans & Anglophone Canadians, we include RV Park fees. Those can vary from $10 US a night for dry camping to $35 US a night for full hookups. We figure an average of $24 a night US over a long trip. There are lots of other expenses, like wagon master pay, paying a mechanic tailgunner or Green Angels, hiring buses for tours, tour guides, etc. Most companies provide excellent meals with tours, I know in our case you are looking at $20 pp with drinks on average on a tour, I know, because as Wagon Master I pay them. I don't think other high quality companies like Adventure or Fantasy are any different. An experienced wagon master is paid $100-$125 US a day and they deserve it. It's a tough job. They get paid for knowledge, how to handle breakdowns and other unexpected situations, do minor RV repairs for customers (I have fixed a convertor board, an oxygen genetator and a fridge so far this trip) and arrange social activities, and deal with the odd pain in the butt customer. I had one of those on a past a caravan and I had to pretend i liked him. If it was survivor, he woudl have been the first voted off. I was lucky, the other customers said things to him I could not say. Dan Goy of Baja Amigos had one last year and he told me if it had happened his first trip he would have thrown in the towel.

As with most things in life, you get what you pay for.

Anyway you should by now have a pretty good idea of whether or not to use a caraavn or go forth on your own. Ther are plus & minus's to both.

Some people should never take a caravan and they probably already know who they are. Trouble is that people take mexican craavans for the wronng reasons. How many poeple have you heard tell you they are taking an Alaskan caravan for safety? Probably none, and yet its probably the primary reason people take a Mexican one. It happens to be the wrong reason.

Tequila wrote:

John & Angela wrote:
We are independent travelers and have seen the majority of Mexico US and Canada on our own BUT we had a great time on the Caravan we took thru the Baja. It was our first time in Mexico, didn't speak the language or the culture and wanted to get our feet wet a litle at a time. It was a fantastic experience and although we are now experienced Mexican travelers on our own having done 27 of the 31 Mexican states in our RV, we wouldn't hesitate to do the Caravan again just because IT WAS A BLAST. We made great friends and saw so much more than what we would have done by ourselves. Always something to do and we learned how to adapt to the Mexican Culture under the tutelage of our guides. We went with BAJA WINTERS. Becky and John are awesome and you will have a great time.

Have a good time.


John

My preference for Baja caravan would be Baja Amigos out of Vancouver. Not that Baja winters is not good, the issue is they do not have their own RV, so head off to a hotel for the night. (Unless that has changed) Baja Amigos runs small groups of 6 rigs down there. I know the owner Dan Goy well, we often do joint seminars at RV shows on RVing in Mexico. Another cheaper alternative for Baja is Vagabundos del Mar who run more bare bone trips down there. You have to join that club (you also do for Caravanas de Mexico's Mainland trips as they are loosely associated with them).

Whatever company is used, you have to be careful and check closely. Some use pretty deceptive advertising. If they advertise "events" rather than tours, you can bet they are counting 3 stops on one tour as separate tours to make it sound like a better deal. Make sure you know what you are getting and ask if any stuff is optional, or if you can even opt out of things you may have already done, like Copper Canyon for a cheaper price. (That is a very expensive portion of some trips). Also make sure RV park fees are included. There are caravans out there that make you pay your own parking for some longer stays, you can get blindsided by that. Figure out the average per day cost, keeping in mind that tours that involve hotels & special transport, like Copper Canyon will raise the average. What currency are they charging in, US or Can, or Pesos?. If you are Canadian,that is a big factor. You may have to pay the price up front, if you don't want to take a chance on the Can dollar tanking, and you have to remember you will be paying an extra 3% on buy/sell rates. Another question to ask is can you go down with day a Fall trip & return with a later trip in Spring. Some companies may allow that, if they are not full up, or even allow a one way caravan. Ask them what they do if you break down. That one is a big potential problem. Do they have an infrastructure in place to stay back with you and assist you in gettign the problem dealt with and helping you catch up later? You might also consider taking out some sort of cancelation or trip interuption insurance. You can buy that from 3rd party's.

Here are 2 incidents I have encountered on Caravans I have led.

1) A participant had his home invaded while on a caravan & had to return in a hurry 1/2 way through. No insurance, no rebate

2) Somebody decided to polish his RV the day before departure. He fell off a ladder & broke his heeel in 4 places. Had to cancel. No refund but the company generously offered to apply 90% of it to the following season. They did not have to.

As you get older, stuff happens.

This is what I find with tours, it is not allways up front what your expenses will be. Like if camping fees are not included, it is hard to figure out what they are. I try to put everything on a Excel Spread sheet and stuff adds up pretty fast. Some offer reduced insurance cost, some include many meals paid for or bus tours included. Caravan Soleil, a french one, have been doing caravan for many years, their price seems to be well explained in their information page, toll, camping, tours, meal, tips while on tours, ect.

Sure, you pay for a tour to avoid the hassles and not have to worry. Same with caravans. There is a couple from Quebec in our park right now who did not get either visas or vehicle permits. They just drive across the border & south. They did not know they needed them. Naive, maybe, but there are language barriers as well in the picture. Now they are in big trouble. I am going to have my boss, who is Mexican, speaks French fluenty, and has connections with officials to try & resolve it for them. He will do it for nothing just for the PR value, but it does show why some people should use a Caravan for their first trip. There are gators out there waiting to bite you if you do not know the ropes.

Tequila wrote:

Kidoo wrote:
I am thinking of taking a caravan but have not decided yet, I know I could get to many more places but the being on a schedule has never been the way I travel, normally, I like I stay, don't like I go.

I was thinking of going down by myself and staying in one place, Puerto Valarta or Ixtapa for example, and take organized bus tour instead of touring by my own. This way I can go wherever I feel is interesting for me.

Caravanas de Mexico does bus tours out of PV and several other Mexican cites in either English or French. Just remember you are goign to be payign for Hotels in the prices.

I guess it is like Cancun or cruise ship, there is the hotel / ship tour and there are independent people selling the same tour for half the price. You may not be pempered or baby sit like the tour from the hotel, but everytime we took an independent tour it was OK for what we wanted to see. Once you get to know the places, you find good info. from people who took it.

Kidoo wrote:
I am thinking of taking a caravan but have not decided yet, I know I could get to many more places but the being on a schedule has never been the way I travel, normally, I like I stay, don't like I go.

I was thinking of going down by myself and staying in one place, Puerto Valarta or Ixtapa for example, and take organized bus tour instead of touring by my own. This way I can go wherever I feel is interesting for me.

Both methods are good. The larger hotels usually have someone that speaks English and they work with many tour companies that charter buses and often have an English speaking guide. We've done that an enjoyed it. However, your traveling companions may only speak Spanish. . .
Whereas on a Caravan, everything is done for you. It's far more "vacation" like than doing it on one's own. Plus you have your own casa rodante. Both are good to try.

John & Angela wrote:
We are independent travelers and have seen the majority of Mexico US and Canada on our own BUT we had a great time on the Caravan we took thru the Baja. It was our first time in Mexico, didn't speak the language or the culture and wanted to get our feet wet a litle at a time. It was a fantastic experience and although we are now experienced Mexican travelers on our own having done 27 of the 31 Mexican states in our RV, we wouldn't hesitate to do the Caravan again just because IT WAS A BLAST. We made great friends and saw so much more than what we would have done by ourselves. Always something to do and we learned how to adapt to the Mexican Culture under the tutelage of our guides. We went with BAJA WINTERS. Becky and John are awesome and you will have a great time.

Have a good time.

John

My preference for Baja caravan would be Baja Amigos out of Vancouver. Not that Baja winters is not good, the issue is they do not have their own RV, so head off to a hotel for the night. (Unless that has changed) Baja Amigos runs small groups of 6 rigs down there. I know the owner Dan Goy well, we often do joint seminars at RV shows on RVing in Mexico. Another cheaper alternative for Baja is Vagabundos del Mar who run more bare bone trips down there. You have to join that club (you also do for Caravanas de Mexico's Mainland trips as they are loosely associated with them).

Whatever company is used, you have to be careful and check closely. Some use pretty deceptive advertising. If they advertise "events" rather than tours, you can bet they are counting 3 stops on one tour as separate tours to make it sound like a better deal. Make sure you know what you are getting and ask if any stuff is optional, or if you can even opt out of things you may have already done, like Copper Canyon for a cheaper price. (That is a very expensive portion of some trips). Also make sure RV park fees are included. There are caravans out there that make you pay your own parking for some longer stays, you can get blindsided by that. Figure out the average per day cost, keeping in mind that tours that involve hotels & special transport, like Copper Canyon will raise the average. What currency are they charging in, US or Can, or Pesos?. If you are Canadian,that is a big factor. You may have to pay the price up front, if you don't want to take a chance on the Can dollar tanking, and you have to remember you will be paying an extra 3% on buy/sell rates. Another question to ask is can you go down with day a Fall trip & return with a later trip in Spring. Some companies may allow that, if they are not full up, or even allow a one way caravan. Ask them what they do if you break down. That one is a big potential problem. Do they have an infrastructure in place to stay back with you and assist you in gettign the problem dealt with and helping you catch up later? You might also consider taking out some sort of cancelation or trip interuption insurance. You can buy that from 3rd party's.

Here are 2 incidents I have encountered on Caravans I have led.

1) A participant had his home invaded while on a caravan & had to return in a hurry 1/2 way through. No insurance, no rebate

2) Somebody decided to polish his RV the day before departure. He fell off a ladder & broke his heeel in 4 places. Had to cancel. No refund but the company generously offered to apply 90% of it to the following season. They did not have to.

As you get older, stuff happens.

Kidoo wrote:
I am thinking of taking a caravan but have not decided yet, I know I could get to many more places but the being on a schedule has never been the way I travel, normally, I like I stay, don't like I go.

I was thinking of going down by myself and staying in one place, Puerto Valarta or Ixtapa for example, and take organized bus tour instead of touring by my own. This way I can go wherever I feel is interesting for me.

Caravanas de Mexico does bus tours out of PV and several other Mexican cites in either English or French. Just remember you are goign to be payign for Hotels in the prices.

We are independent travelers and have seen the majority of Mexico US and Canada on our own BUT we had a great time on the Caravan we took thru the Baja. It was our first time in Mexico, didn't speak the language or the culture and wanted to get our feet wet a litle at a time. It was a fantastic experience and although we are now experienced Mexican travelers on our own having done 27 of the 31 Mexican states in our RV, we wouldn't hesitate to do the Caravan again just because IT WAS A BLAST. We made great friends and saw so much more than what we would have done by ourselves. Always something to do and we learned how to adapt to the Mexican Culture under the tutelage of our guides. We went with BAJA WINTERS. Becky and John are awesome and you will have a great time.

Have a good time.

John