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NorCalTim's avatar
NorCalTim
Explorer
Oct 27, 2015

I almost lost my gas tank! (Lippert fail / pic heavy)

So, we really don't use the fiver much now days, starting when the kids got in high-school. (2008 Sierra fifth-wheel toy hauler that doesn't really haul toys.) We take it out a couple times a year... once a year up the Klamath (though this was the first time in 4-5 years) and a yearly music festival.

After the last music festival I got home and was chocking the wheels and first noticed this:



No prob, I wanted to reinforce with extra tank bars and also add some hardware to the mix rather than just welds.

Then I noticed this:



Upon further inspection revealed the following:



and this...



And more... but basically all of the things holding the gas tank had failed. I had a whopping $40 in gas in the thing (which isn't much.)

This is also not the first problem. Within a year (though I couldn't find the post by searching) I had this too...





So called "frame flex".

Over all we've had less than 10-12k on this trailer *easily* and without repairs I can't even tow it from the driveway. I'd be terrified to think what would of happened if I took it to Baja next month like I'd planned and these hadn't failed beforehand.

I have contacted Forest River who handed me over to Lippert who initially told me my warranty was only one year. After uttering some magic words about it being "on the Forest River list" as instructed by the guy from FR, they assigned me a number and told me to e-mail pictures.

We'll see what happens. Worst case I put in fasteners for all the cross supports under the tanks with some extra angle iron and then engineer some new brackets for the gas tank. Best case they make it right on their dime. Either way I don't think I'll ever have much trust in this rig again. Sad thing is it's still like brand new inside!
  • laknox's avatar
    laknox
    Nomad
    Oct 30, 2015
    NorCalTim wrote:
    minnow wrote:
    Don't know if I'd share that info with anyone. If they find out the frame was altered for the 2nd tank, you I'm afraid are s c r e w e d. As they will claim the RV was modified and that is what caused the defects.


    *THEY* did that, not me. It came with two fresh water tanks brand new. They cut it and re-welded it. I'm presently getting a little bit of runaround so I'm probably going to have redo all this myself costing me for fasteners, angle iron, flat iron, and some rods & wire.

    I hate to say it, but I've seen much finer construction on high-school ag-shop projects. This was all "pride free" work, meaning that they were just pushing it out to get it on the road not caring about what it looked like. Sloppy welds, gaps, crooked pieces, cheap metal, etc. To say it was "poorly constructed" is an understatement.


    Create a "project book", with detailed documentation and lots of pictures. When you're done, send it directly to the president of the company. Don't forget to make d@mn sure that they know that you nearly lost a GAS TANK from underneath the trailer. How would they have liked that to have happened and scattered X gallons of gasoline all down a freeway somewhere? Can you say "major lawsuit"? Sure, I knew ya could... Oh, start a "fixit" thread here, and include a link to it... :B

    Lyle
  • azrving's avatar
    azrving
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2015
    Norcal, "so I'm probably going to have redo this myself". Now that's the spirit!!

    They aren't going to go in there and fix all that stuff! I'd start stripping everything out of the way and evaluate the whole project. Pull the panel under the pinbox and everything else in the way. I wouldn't trust it until I had seen everything and welded and reinforced it. Yes, it will be a pita if you aren't into it but that thing is absolute trash that shouldn't be on the road. Not your fault but just like a lot of the other junk products we have now days you will end up making it right yourself.

    A couple years ago I was looking at a 2012 Dutchmen TT at Copart junk yard that was only a few months old. I dont know exactly what they did to it but the spring hangers were folded over and bent the cheap "I" beam sheet metal frame. It was repairable but needed extensive reinforcement and additional cross members. it was just a cheap trash design with fast welds but it could be fixed. The worst part will be to not burn the bottom of the floor membrane. Wet rags and water sprayer. Little at a time.
  • Tequila's avatar
    Tequila
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2015
    Not to let Northwood completely off, I have had issues with them as well. However, they were good about resolving them and the frame or structural integrity was not the issue. Biggest complaint I have is a fading nose cap which seems to plague all dark colored ones. I also had some sloppy drainage plumbing (one bad employee, I suspect). However, that prompted me to design a leak detection system,(it shuts off pump & city water if one is detected anywhere in the RV) that I have a company looking at right now. So something good came out of it.

    BTW on the subject of Northwood roofs, last year I had a heavy coconut hit it last year at 3AM. No sign of damage. I supect it hit a roof truss. I now lookup when I park to make sure I am not under a coconut palm that is loaded.
  • NorCalTim's avatar
    NorCalTim
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2015
    Tequila wrote:

    Good point, but I have seen several (more than I can count is an exageration, but it's more than a few) down here complain of cracked welds and none were Northwood or Lance products. So by process of elimination.


    I was checking out the Northwood site. They are very proud of their construction and it looks like they don't cut corners, they reinforce them. When I had to change out vents on the roof of this unit I was nimble as a cat as it felt so cheap up there. They on the other hand had over 30 folks on the roof of one of their units as an example. They use actual *trusses*. I am so bummed thinking I could have spent my hard earned money on something that would have lasted the long haul (literally) instead of this cheap trash I ended up with.

    BTW, re: your username... big time Corralejo fan here, haha.
  • NorCalTim's avatar
    NorCalTim
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2015
    minnow wrote:
    Don't know if I'd share that info with anyone. If they find out the frame was altered for the 2nd tank, you I'm afraid are s c r e w e d. As they will claim the RV was modified and that is what caused the defects.


    *THEY* did that, not me. It came with two fresh water tanks brand new. They cut it and re-welded it. I'm presently getting a little bit of runaround so I'm probably going to have redo all this myself costing me for fasteners, angle iron, flat iron, and some rods & wire.

    I hate to say it, but I've seen much finer construction on high-school ag-shop projects. This was all "pride free" work, meaning that they were just pushing it out to get it on the road not caring about what it looked like. Sloppy welds, gaps, crooked pieces, cheap metal, etc. To say it was "poorly constructed" is an understatement.
  • Tequila's avatar
    Tequila
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2015
    fj12ryder wrote:
    Tequila wrote:
    I spend 6 months a year in my RV in the land of a million speed bumps (Mexico). I have seen more Lippert Frame failures than I can count. More than once I have seen people in RV parks having them repared & reinforced by a visitng welder. This was the rpimary reason I bought a Northwood product. They manufacture their own frames and they are noticibly heftier.
    I'm not saying that you're not seeing a lot of Lippert frame failures but one tends to see what they expect to see. You buy a black Ford truck and suddenly notice lots of other black Ford trucks.

    Maybe you see more Lippert frame failures because that's what you're looking for. Maybe you tend to overlook any other frame failure because it doesn't fall in your framework. And it could be that Lippert had lots of frame failures because they make lots of frames, and a certain percentage are poorly made, or understrength frames.

    And maybe people who buy Lippert frames, because of the models involved, put more miles on their frames than people of other brands. I dunno. Just seems simplistic to say "All Lippert frames are poop."


    Good point, but I have seen several (more than I can count is an exageration, but it's more than a few) down here complain of cracked welds and none were Northwood or Lance products. So by process of elimination.

    Before I bought my RV, I crawled under them all, knowing I was going to be taking it into mexico each year. Frame quality was more important to me than layout. Northwoods frame quality was noticeably better than most of the others I looked at. Lance was also good, I do not know who does their frames. They do not make 5ths, however, only trailers & campers.
  • azrving's avatar
    azrving
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2015
    Maybe they can just JB Weld those loose bolts in. :) Ummm Hummm, she's a beauty
  • minnow's avatar
    minnow
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2015
    Don't know if I'd share that info with anyone. If they find out the frame was altered for the 2nd tank, you I'm afraid are s c r e w e d. As they will claim the RV was modified and that is what caused the defects.
  • NorCalTim's avatar
    NorCalTim
    Explorer
    Oct 29, 2015
    So, they are giving a bit of back and forth over a serial number I can't locate. My guess is it's up under the skin if it is there.

    But I figured I'd get to looking for it while they're ignoring my e-mails asking where exactly it should be other than "on the left side" I got under the unit on a creeper with a flashlight looking for any more labels and now I'm utterly amazed at what I have discovered.

    Found welds that had let go, including both ends of a lateral support beam that was cut with what appears to be oxy-acetylene (very rough and jagged cut) and relocated (jagged edge and all) to make way for the second fresh water tank. Not to mention, frame pieces that were not long enough to butt up against both surfaces welded anyway leaving 1/8 in. gaps.

    I took pictures of them all so I could look at them better on the computer with my glasses, but here are a couple examples of questionable quality:





    If I ever buy another rig, I'm taking a creeper and a flashlight!
  • NorCalTim's avatar
    NorCalTim
    Explorer
    Oct 29, 2015
    Tequila wrote:
    I spend 6 months a year in my RV in the land of a million speed bumps (Mexico). I have seen more Lippert Frame failures than I can count. More than once I have seen people in RV parks having them repared & reinforced by a visitng welder. This was the rpimary reason I bought a Northwood product. They manufacture their own frames and they are noticibly heftier.


    I appreciate that feedback and will look into Northwood. Baja towing is good experience. The thing is, I never did anything crazy with this rig which is so scary. I could only imagine what one set of unanticipated topes would have done!

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