Siping?

Yup but they became very popular on tires in the Nordic countries long before they came here. Yup the fellow took a great idea and put his ideas to work but the Bandatrac cap pushed it nationwide on commercial vehicles. Nokia built ice tires using the concept long before Michelin, Bridgestone & Goodyear etc. in North America. The Europeans are so far ahead of us in tires, lighting and everyday performance driving it is unreal but a lot of inventions came from our people too we just don't use it.

P Kennedy wrote:
Siping tires originally came from the Nordic countries where ice is a standard condition for a large part of the year. Bandag brought it to the trucking industry on a cap they named Bandatrac for increased winter ice performance allowing the blocking more flex to bite the ice and were successful. A trailer tire will benefit from the same process under those identified conditions however the down side is reduced tire wear and tires that are prone to free wheel skip wear will faster. Marathon, Marathon, Marathon........are not used for any purpose in commercial applications nor are the proprietary tread designs so highly regarded on the tire. A siped tire is only going to squirm as much as any other tire with a flexible block design like winter grip tires. If you are used to driving a sports car and change out to a set of winter tires and rims it will not perform the same on dry pavement as much as the summer tires won't do as well on the snow and ice. Alignment is the #2 reason for bad tire wear, improper inflation is #1. You can follow the Goodyear choir or investigate the successes of those who have worked past the ST stigma. It is your money and your choice. I run R250's 1 of which after 20k miles is starting to feather on the edge which means I need to check that bearing and rotate the tires again this year. Nothing I haven't done on my semi over 30 years.

You might want to read this about John F. Sipe!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siping_%28rubber%29

nomad297 wrote:

Me Again wrote:

nomad297 wrote:
Siping will help with heat dissipation which might be a good thing for an ST tire.

Bruce

I think that is wrong!

Not according to Les Schwab

Bruce

There is no way I would bank on ANYTHING Les Schwab has to say.

Siping tires originally came from the Nordic countries where ice is a standard condition for a large part of the year. Bandag brought it to the trucking industry on a cap they named Bandatrac for increased winter ice performance allowing the blocking more flex to bite the ice and were successful. A trailer tire will benefit from the same process under those identified conditions however the down side is reduced tire wear and tires that are prone to free wheel skip wear will faster. Marathon, Marathon, Marathon........are not used for any purpose in commercial applications nor are the proprietary tread designs so highly regarded on the tire. A siped tire is only going to squirm as much as any other tire with a flexible block design like winter grip tires. If you are used to driving a sports car and change out to a set of winter tires and rims it will not perform the same on dry pavement as much as the summer tires won't do as well on the snow and ice. Alignment is the #2 reason for bad tire wear, improper inflation is #1. You can follow the Goodyear choir or investigate the successes of those who have worked past the ST stigma. It is your money and your choice. I run R250's 1 of which after 20k miles is starting to feather on the edge which means I need to check that bearing and rotate the tires again this year. Nothing I haven't done on my semi over 30 years.

From Les Schwab "SIPING will not adversely affect your tires performance in any way"!

So why did they have to replace my friend new pickup tires and their Prius tires after siping them? For the truck it created a handling issue and for the Prius it create a MPG decrease!

Chris

nomad297 wrote:

Me Again wrote:

nomad297 wrote:
Siping will help with heat dissipation which might be a good thing for an ST tire.

Bruce

I think that is wrong!

Not according to Les Schwab

Bruce

So lets hear from sources that do not profit from siping!

http://www.komonews.com/news/archive/4168146.html

Cooper Warranty
What Isn't Covered
Adjustments will not be made for:
Altered in any manner (additional siping, buffing, stud pin holes, re-grooving, truing, etc.).
http://us.coopertire.com/Customer-Care/Warranty-Information.aspx

http://www.goodyeartrucktires.com/pdf/resources/service-manual/Retread_S12_V.pdf

https://www.tirerack.com/images/pdf/warranty/CO0912.pdf

And I guess you failed to read what happen with my friend Prius when LS siped new tires on it. That is a true test that they do not roll down the road as well. Do you really think someone did an engineering test on the heat issue?

Chris

Me Again wrote:

nomad297 wrote:
Siping will help with heat dissipation which might be a good thing for an ST tire.

Bruce

I think that is wrong!

Not according to Les Schwab

Bruce

closurdo wrote:
So then why does the Goodyear Marathon's have the siping on the edge?

Because ST tires in general have not changed for years. Goodyear labels the Marathon as a economical offering! ST tires were design for local service on low use utility type trailers, and have found there way to large tall trailers that travel at freeway speeds for hour after hour!

Chris

So then why does the Goodyear Marathon's have the siping on the edge?

nomad297 wrote:
Siping will help with heat dissipation which might be a good thing for an ST tire.

Bruce

I think that is wrong!

Sipes in tires are there for one reason, traction! A tire with a lot of siping will experience tread squirm, which is not good for trailer tires. Breaks in outer ribs and sipes are not what you want for a good trailer tire. Fuel mileage will be less with a tire with a higher rolling resistance. Sipes lines rubbing against each other will create heat not reduce it.

Here is a picture of the Goodyear G614 high quality/cost Regional Service Trailer tire. It has a tread pattern similar to what over the road trailer tires have. Tires with tread patterns like this and steel carcass have a lower rolling resistance and create less heat(RIB and R250) and provide better fuel mileage.



Les Schwab siped Toyo LT for a friends Chevy D/A, and he could not keep it on the road as heavy vehicles do not do well with a lot of siping, and they replaced them. Then LS siped new tires for their Prius and mileage went in the toilet, and again LS had to replace them.

Retail tire stores tend to sell what they stock! If you want better service as Jimnlin says go to a commercial tire shop that deals with people that make a living with their vehicles.

Here is the Bridgestone Duravis R250 all steel ply tire. I am currently using this tire on my trailer.



For 6.5 years and 40K+ miles I ran Michelin XPS RIBs, then sold them on CL for 200 bucks.



Will other LT tires work? Sure, people run the FS Transforce HT, Michelin LTX M/S and now M/S2 etc. Are they good choices? That depends what you want to do with them. Cross the SW desert in hot weather? Then you want the tire that run the coolest! Which is a tire like the G614, Rib or R250.

Here is the Michelin LTX M/S2. I is design for smooth ride in a pickup and good wet and snow traction in an A/S type tire. People do not normally tow trailers in the snow. Is has a lot more traction than is required for a trailer tire and has breaks in the outer ribs.



I still think the BS Duravis R500HD is the best POLY carcass LRE 16" available for trailer. It has a two ply poly carcass were most others have a single poly ply sidewall. They have very dense rubber compounds similar to the Rib and R250.



Chris