SRW vs DRW

From what folks in BC says (rv forums and commercial haulers forums) they have to register their trucks at a GVWR.......which may be the truck makers GVWR or up to the sum of the vehicle mfg axle ratings.
BC still uses the same "weight scales" regulation which says in part;
**The gross weight of any vehicle or combination of vehicles shall be the sum of the individual gross axle weights of all the axles of the vehicle or combination of vehicles.**

The best way to find out how much weight your vehicle can carry is to subtract the net weight of the vehicle from the GVWR
(located on the driver’s door post). The number remaining is
the maximum weight your vehicle can carry.

Some of the new gen 1/2 ton....3/4 ton gas vs diesel....350/3500 SRW with those high gvwr numbers gvwr based payloads can over load the trucks RAWR if its all used in the bed over the rear axle when we look at actual weight numbers.

And a F350srw owners with a 11500 lb gvwr and a 3686 lb payload sticker isn't any safer than the same exact/same mechanical specs F350srw with a 10000 gvwr carrying the same 3686 lb payload.

Lots of reasons a truck mfg gvwr doesn't tell a trucks actual load carrying story or thats its some how the safe method.

Delete

Exactly. You would need to be grossly overloaded before most police officers would bat an eye. Then your GVWR would be used as the mark to guage by.

4x4ord wrote:
How British Columbia views weight ratings.

Basically:
What are the penalties for driving a
vehicle loaded above its GVWR?
Regulations in BC were recently changed to
address consumer and industry concerns about
the GVWR. If a vehicle, with a GVWR of
5,500 kilograms (kgs), or less, that is
manufactured before January 1, 2001 is loaded in
excess of its GVWR and enforcement officer
deems it to be unsafe, the driver of that vehicle
may be given a Notice and Order. Most light
trucks and RVs have a GVWR of less than
5,500 kgs. If a vehicle with a GVWR of more than
5,500 kgs, regardless of the date it is
manufactured, is loaded in excess of its GVWR,
the driver of that vehicle may be given a violation
ticket. Driving a vehicle loaded above its GVWR
creates a potential safety hazard because the
vehicle’s frame, suspension, brakes and tires are
not designed for weights above the rating the
manufacturer has set.

I find interesting the method used to determine if a vehicle is "Overloaded".
Q. How does a Peace/Police Officer decide if a vehicle is unsafe?
Peace/Police Officers will use visual cues to
determine if a vehicle is obviously overloaded.
These cues include vehicles:
• that look unstable when moving
• that have a front end higher than the back end (the vehicle is not level)
• with tires that appear deflated

Q. How can I find out if my vehicle is overweight or unsafe?
The easiest way to know your vehicle is safe is to
ensure you do not exceed the GVWR. You can
also use the same visual signs used by Peace/
Police Officers to determine if your vehicle is unsafely loaded.
The best way to find out how much weight your vehicle can carry is
to subtract the net weight of the vehicle from the GVWR
(located on the driver’s door post). The number remaining is
the maximum weight your vehicle can carry.
If you cannot locate the net weight of your vehicle in your
owner’s manual or if you have added accessories that increase the net
weight, you can have your unloaded vehicle weighed at a weigh scale.

This is the same way an Oregon LEO described if they would stop someone for being over weight.
This tells me that I likely would have never been stopped for a weight violation, and even if stopped for another, violation would not likely been weighed. When the picture below was taken the TV was about 1,700# over it's GVWR, NO BAGS! Just the stock Camper Package springs.




This is an issue in the past, as we now have a new TV.

How British Columbia views weight ratings.

Basically:
What are the penalties for driving a
vehicle loaded above its GVWR?
Regulations in BC were recently changed to
address consumer and industry concerns about
the GVWR. If a vehicle, with a GVWR of
5,500 kilograms (kgs), or less, that is
manufactured before January 1, 2001 is loaded in
excess of its GVWR and enforcement officer
deems it to be unsafe, the driver of that vehicle
may be given a Notice and Order. Most light
trucks and RVs have a GVWR of less than
5,500 kgs. If a vehicle with a GVWR of more than
5,500 kgs, regardless of the date it is
manufactured, is loaded in excess of its GVWR,
the driver of that vehicle may be given a violation
ticket. Driving a vehicle loaded above its GVWR
creates a potential safety hazard because the
vehicle’s frame, suspension, brakes and tires are
not designed for weights above the rating the
manufacturer has set.

MFL wrote:

Wadcutter wrote:

twodownzero wrote:


I can't get into an argument with you about the law because I am a lawyer and I wouldn't want anyone to interpret any of this as legal advice.

I'm sure you have extensive training in truck weight laws. Obviously not from the rest of your response. Please, show one state law in any state where GVWR is a legal weight limit. I'll save you some time - there isn't any.
Manufacturers don't make the law or set legal weight limits.
Maybe you should stick with whatever field of law you practice, divorces, family law, estates, whatever it is. Obviously it isn't anything to do with truck weight laws. Even a poor attorney knows to stay in his own lane when he doesn't know anything about a particular area. At least most do.

While many do not understand the GVWR legalities, I do like the comparison of standing under the 12K lb load hanging from a 10K RATED rope. :E

Jerry

While you may not stand under a 12K load on a 10K rope, it is not illegal to do so. He is professing things to be illegal, that he can't back up. So he resorts to slight of hand, obfuscation, smoke and mirrors.

twodownzero wrote:

Wadcutter wrote:

twodownzero wrote:


I can't get into an argument with you about the law because I am a lawyer and I wouldn't want anyone to interpret any of this as legal advice.

I'm sure you have extensive training in truck weight laws. Obviously not from the rest of your response. Please, show one state law in any state where GVWR is a legal weight limit. I'll save you some time - there isn't any.
Manufacturers don't make the law or set legal weight limits.
Maybe you should stick with whatever field of law you practice, divorces, family law, estates, whatever it is. Obviously it isn't anything to do with truck weight laws. Even a poor attorney knows to stay in his own lane when he doesn't know anything about a particular area. At least most do.

Again, I cannot respond to you and tell you what the positive law is in any given jurisdiction because I cannot give legal advice on the internet. I feel comfortable saying that your assertion is not correct and that you should consult someone licensed in the relevant jurisdiction if you want to know what the law is. I am personally aware of at least one state where your assertion is not correct because of the interaction between two laws that you might not realize create precisely the situation you describe--GVWR becomes the relevant limit. And for all I know, there may be more, or it may be an outlier. Either way, traffic laws are not the only thing in play here, and if you hurt someone by operating a vehicle outside of its design limits, you are tempting fate to say the least.

Posting a link to a section of the law on the internet for someone else to read is not giving legal advice.

I think your blowing smoke, big blue clouds of it. You ain't no lawyer I'd ever want representing me. If I can see through the smoke, a judge would be rolling over laughing. Put up or shut up.

Wadcutter wrote:

twodownzero wrote:


I can't get into an argument with you about the law because I am a lawyer and I wouldn't want anyone to interpret any of this as legal advice.

I'm sure you have extensive training in truck weight laws. Obviously not from the rest of your response. Please, show one state law in any state where GVWR is a legal weight limit. I'll save you some time - there isn't any.
Manufacturers don't make the law or set legal weight limits.
Maybe you should stick with whatever field of law you practice, divorces, family law, estates, whatever it is. Obviously it isn't anything to do with truck weight laws. Even a poor attorney knows to stay in his own lane when he doesn't know anything about a particular area. At least most do.

Again, I cannot respond to you and tell you what the positive law is in any given jurisdiction because I cannot give legal advice on the internet. I feel comfortable saying that your assertion is not correct and that you should consult someone licensed in the relevant jurisdiction if you want to know what the law is. I am personally aware of at least one state where your assertion is not correct because of the interaction between two laws that you might not realize create precisely the situation you describe--GVWR becomes the relevant limit. And for all I know, there may be more, or it may be an outlier. Either way, traffic laws are not the only thing in play here, and if you hurt someone by operating a vehicle outside of its design limits, you are tempting fate to say the least.

Wadcutter wrote:

twodownzero wrote:


I can't get into an argument with you about the law because I am a lawyer and I wouldn't want anyone to interpret any of this as legal advice.

I'm sure you have extensive training in truck weight laws. Obviously not from the rest of your response. Please, show one state law in any state where GVWR is a legal weight limit. I'll save you some time - there isn't any.
Manufacturers don't make the law or set legal weight limits.
Maybe you should stick with whatever field of law you practice, divorces, family law, estates, whatever it is. Obviously it isn't anything to do with truck weight laws. Even a poor attorney knows to stay in his own lane when he doesn't know anything about a particular area. At least most do.

States' weight rules are =mostly= for =registration=, not for what a specific truck/vehicle can carry/tow. Yes, when you get into commercial stuff with high/wide/heavy, then you do have limits, but you also have to have permits and, I'd be willing to bet, certified documentation of =actual= heights/widths/weights, before you can move an inch.

Now, where GVWs come into play, are more on the civil =liability= side of things, so if an accident =does= happen, then the lawyers have something to argue about. I'd be surprised, though, that insurance company lawyers are smart enough to know that if an entire axle assembly from a 1t truck is also used in a 3/4t truck, he'll have a much harder time proving an overloaded condition just because the mfr says one has a higher limit than the other. Hell, the way a trailer comes apart in an accident, I'd bet that they couldn't find enough of the trailer to weigh to show that it was overloading the truck. :B

FWIW, I've known more than one person who was ticketed for towing a trailer that exceeded the truck's =registered= weight limit, but was nowhere close to the truck =or= trailer's GVWs.

Lyle

Me Again wrote:

laknox wrote:

klr650goldwing wrote:
Thanks everyone. There is a wealth of information here. I checked the weight tag on my truck and found the following information: GVWR 9900, FRONT GAWR 5200, REAR GAWR 6830. I don't know how to calculate total towing capacity from those numbers. I bought this truck new. When new it had 3.73 differential gearing. I had those gears changed to 4.56. That increased the towing capacity of the truck, but I don't remember how the truck shop calculated those numbers. Can anyone determine the maximum weight 5er this truck can tow?

It's not what you can TOW, it's what you can CARRY, i.e. PAYLOAD, that's the critical number. Sure, you can tow more, but you can't CARRY any more than you could when that truck rolled off the line. First thing you need to do is to load up your truck as if you were going camping. You, passenger(s), hitch, full fuel and "stuff", then hit the scales to see what your truck weighs. Subtract that from the 9900 lb GVW from your placard. THAT is the PAYLOAD capacity that you have left to CARRY the pin of a FW (or GN). If you =really= want good #'s, then take the FW with you to the scales and weigh =all= axles, steer, driver and trailer, both with and without the FW hitched up. Do it ready to camp to get =real= #'s.

Lyle

Lyle, you missed a very important item. That is weighing the individual axles. Pin weight goes almost 100 % on the trucks real axle.

One wants to get that rear axle weight and subtract it from the RGAWR. That number will tell you how much pin weight the truck can handle. Once hooked up a person should return to the scale and get three readings, Front and rear TV weights and the trailer axle weights. Add all three together to and compare that to the trucks combine weight rating.

Compare the TV rear axle weight to trucks RGAWR and assure the tires weight ratings add up to or exceed the RGAWR. Add the two TV axle weights and if you are in a state that licenses tonnage assure that you have purchase enough for the weight the truck is carrying.

Hmmm... Did you miss the last 2 sentences above? "If you =really= want good #'s, then take the FW with you to the scales and weigh =all= axles, steer, driver and trailer, both with and without the FW hitched up. Do it ready to camp to get =real= #'s."

Lyle