Is GM missing the Boat

mlts22 wrote:
Thanks for the info. I didn't know that VW actually had to stop selling TDIs completely. From what I recall, all VW had to do was a ECM reflash, but apparently that changed. I still see a ton of them on the road though.

They can be modified to no longer be illegal but achieving the pollution standards is still not doable with the current crop. They also have a bad name everywhere in the world as the lawsuits continue to be resolved. As well diesel particulate and general pollution standards continue to be tightened everywhere in the world. VW has also signaled they will concentrate more (a lot more) effort on playing catch up for the electric vehicle market as european cities begin to disallow diesels of any type within city limits. They have a few years of leeway but the writing is on the wall. If the EPA is disembowled in the USA there may be a temporary market for a few years but it is a relatively small market although they are looking at it as a possible dumping ground to keep the factories going until new products are developed. If you are a German speaker do some googling on the future of the diesel in europe and you'll get an idea of where things are heading in the next 10 years. Lots of infighting though and things could change quickly depending on who runs the company. Interesting times.

I still believe that if GM put the 2.8 diesel in a cab/chassis with a 12000 Gvwr , they could dominate the 25-27 class C market.

Thanks for the info. I didn't know that VW actually had to stop selling TDIs completely. From what I recall, all VW had to do was a ECM reflash, but apparently that changed. I still see a ton of them on the road though.

lc0338 wrote:
probably not if there is any work involved. GM (government motors) is looking for hand outs.

Best do a little homework and the innuendo (government motors) is ancient history.

GM Reports Record Third-Quarter Net Income of $2.8 Billion, Up 104 Percent.

Go figure!

mlts22 wrote:
Diesels are not going anywhere in NA. People buy the little Volkswagen TDIs left and right, and RAM has a diesel half-ton pickup.
.

HAHAHAHAHA

The only one buying VW TDIs anymore is VW, so they can be sent to the crusher. All those new TDIs sitting on dealer lots? Those can't be sold, and will also be crushed, unless VW can figure out a cost effective solution to swap in a gas power-plant.

Diesels are not going anywhere in NA. People buy the little Volkswagen TDIs left and right, and RAM has a diesel half-ton pickup.

I think part of the "dirty" aspect is a push to get all vehicles except EVs out of countries. This works for Europe because they such a small area, but not for most of the world.

GM seems to have missed a lot of boats. I don't think RVs are a big thing, but they really need a Euro style van, and not just to stuff a small engine into an existing model. Even if they just rebadged something like the Hyundai Hg350, that is a lot better than losing a market.

I used to like GM... but it gets me wondering what they are doing. Only Cadillac seems to be doing innovations these days, it seems, within GM.

Diesel is facing difficulties in some countries because many see it as "dirty". I'm from the province with the Athabasca Oil Sands so I worry about this labelling. Anyway, some EU cities and possibly countries are set to ban Diesel vehicles. How will this affect makers and buyers of diesel vehicles in North America. Expected resale value?

The early Navions and Views used the 2.7L 5 cylinder, which as far as I can find was 156 HP. Torque n/a. And people loved them. So the 2.8L Duramax might not be so bad.

Although it begs for a lighter chassis, I would sure think.

Edit: I see you own one of those 5 cylinders, Charles! :)

A brief comparison.

The GM 2.8L 4 cyl diesel produces 181 hp and 369 lb/ft of torque

The Mercedes 2.1L 4 cyl diesel used in the Sprinters (and yes, motorhomes have been built with this engine) produces 161 hp and 265 lb/ft of torque

The Mercedes 3.0L V6 diesel used in the Sprinters produces 188 hp and 325 lb/ft of torque.

So while the Sprinter powered motorhomes are somewhat underpowered, a GM Savannah cutaway cab/chassis with the diesel would have similar performance and probably do as well.

The auto makers are intent on going to smaller engines, and the market suffers the consequences. This is why some manufacturers are beginning to build large C's and super C's on the F450/550 and Dodge 4500/5500 chassis's. People want something rock solid and with performance that will get them there, despite the terrain.

Charles

The little 2.8 Duramax in the Express is certainly an interesting move. It might be good for package delivery but eliminates another van option for those who want to tow. Like the Transit and Sprinter it will have little towing capacity when loaded close to GVWR.

On a related note I see that the 6.6 Duramax is no longer offered in the cutaway chassis, which means that there will no more diesel type 3 ambulances on the market.