HTTPS and VPN

mike-s wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:
A VPN is no more "secure" than an open wifi, period.

A lot of people don't get that, though. I'm assuming the current popular use of "VPN", which is a simple attempt at disguising where you're geographically located.

VPNs are just fine, if they connect to the endpoint's network. Otherwise, they add exactly zero additional security (or perhaps less than zero, since they introduce an new "choke point").

I’ve never used a commercial VPN provider. You’re saying IPSec tunneling is not enabled? Makes it kind of pointless, doesn’t it?

Gdetrailer wrote:
A VPN is no more "secure" than an open wifi, period.

A lot of people don't get that, though. I'm assuming the current popular use of "VPN", which is a simple attempt at disguising where you're geographically located.

VPNs are just fine, if they connect to the endpoint's network. Otherwise, they add exactly zero additional security (or perhaps less than zero, since they introduce an new "choke point").

The thing with those pay as you go VPN services is that you are being routed thru their servers and they can log, track, control all of your internet activities..

You can choose the country you want your VPN ip address to be coming from, so say you are connected to an open wifi in the US, but if you choose a VPN connection to come out of say Canada, that's really the only thing that's happening with that VPN connection.

No additional "security" from that same open wifi.

Your computer is still using an IP address to that open wifi connection it gave you to connect in the first place. The VPN connection you have is just changing the IP address that the web sites you are going to sees..

Anyway, I looked at the Nord VPN and tried it, but cancelled it a couple of days later, as I found out that it simply does not make an open wifi any more secure than just using the open wifi.

When you connect to a new network, your computer should prompt you to select the type of network you are connecting to. At that point, you should select the "public network" option, as that will set your computers firewall to be not let your computer to be visible on the open network.. Nothing is ever 'secure' as such, but I still would not conduct my banking or other password entered web sites from an open wifi, even using a so called "VPN" connection..

Good luck!

Mitch

Bachelor wrote:
I guess, as some of you mentioned, you're more safe using your own hotspot, such as cell phone, your own router, etc.

You're fine with that. If you weren't the banking and shopping industries would be collapsing.

Thanks for all the replies and explanations. I always thought that you were pretty safe using HTTPS, even on a public connection because everything is encrypted. I guess, as some of you mentioned, you're more safe using your own hotspot, such as cell phone, your own router, etc.

Edit: I was just investigating VPN's online and all the big nemes, such ax Nord, Express,PIA and others all offer strong encryption. So it would appear to me that usage of these VPN's on an unsecured network would provide good protection. Comments?

garry1p wrote:
No matter how secure YOU are the business you shop at bank with or have any transaction with will be a target of hackers they get millions of individual accounts such as Target, Home Depot or any site that clears your CC information is more at risk than the individual. You have no control

Using an open WIFI is normally a one one attract and yes there are many bad actors praying on open WiFi's you just never know until it is to late. You have some level of control use it or....

V{N is point to point encrypted and better than not having it but nothing is totally secure on the internet.

A VPN is no more "secure" than an open wifi, period.

You are DEPENDING AND TRUSTING on a faceless, unreachable, untouchable THIRD PARTY VPN software to make this "encryption" happen..

Much of these third party VPNs are based outside of the US, ever wonder why?

What if that third party VPN you chose is ACTUALLY one of the BAD GUYS?

What if that third party VPN has one of their servers hacked and compromised?

Your data integrity and security is only as good as all of the moving parts between your computer and your data's final destination..

As someone else has mentioned, VPNs are more about HIDING YOUR IP LOCATION than they are for making your connection more secure..

IF you are wanting to do general Internet browsing, open wifi OR secured wifi should not pose any real threat.

IF you are BANKING or putting other personal info onto the Internet and are over the top privacy concerned then skip wifi and move to WIRED connection.

Alternately, while less secure than a wired connection, bring your own wifi (cell based) would be the better method over depending on a third party VPN on a public wifi..

ljr wrote:
I can’t give you a number of cases I helped untangle but it would be in the hundreds..

Hundreds sounds ominous until you compare that to the number of wifi users in total.

garry1p wrote:
No matter how secure YOU are the business you shop at bank with or have any transaction with will be a target of hackers they get millions of individual accounts such as Target, Home Depot or any site that clears your CC information is more at risk than the individual.

That is a more significant risk because that's where the real gold mine is.

We've had this conversation many times over the years and it ends up being like driving with the propane on. Is it risky? No, but if you THINK it's risky then don't do it.

No matter how secure YOU are the business you shop at bank with or have any transaction with will be a target of hackers they get millions of individual accounts such as Target, Home Depot or any site that clears your CC information is more at risk than the individual. You have no control

Using an open WIFI is normally a one one attract and yes there are many bad actors praying on open WiFi's you just never know until it is to late. You have some level of control use it or....

V{N is point to point encrypted and better than not having it but nothing is totally secure on the internet.

2oldman wrote:

ljr wrote:

2oldman wrote:
So much is possible, but whether it's even in the realm of probability that someone's sitting in Starbucks waiting to steal my information is what I focus on.

.....and that’s why it works.

We all have a different tolerance for risk. It's possible I could be in a plane crash too.

Maybe someone will come on here and tell us their experience getting hacked on public wifi.

I spent 30+ years in government, corporate and higher education IT. I can’t give you a number of cases I helped untangle but it would be in the hundreds. With very few exceptions the victims were in complete agreement with you before it happened to them.

You don’t need to surrender to paranoia but you would be well served by taking the threat seriously.

PS: I was in a plane crash once.

2oldman wrote:

ljr wrote:

2oldman wrote:
So much is possible, but whether it's even in the realm of probability that someone's sitting in Starbucks waiting to steal my information is what I focus on.

.....and that’s why it works.

We all have a different tolerance for risk. It's possible I could be in a plane crash too.

Maybe someone will come on here and tell us their experience getting hacked on public wifi.

That could be a really long wait.

But if you ask someone to come on here and tell about the time their data was stolen from a supposedly secure credit card repository or department store repository, it won't take very long at all.