Bicyclist/RV Death

myredracer wrote:
What if the cyclist swerved onto the road and didn't hear a vehicle coming up behind him?

Hmmmmm ... now I wonder who's fault that would be that caused someone's death?

At 64, I still ride quite a bit. Montana 2 is listed as one of the more dangerous roads in America. High speed limit, sharp curves with small shoulders.

Not blaming the cyclist, just saying for me, would not be a road I would ride. Risk avoidance

Ductape wrote:
There’s no excuse for running down a cyclist in your lane traveling the same direction. Vehicular homicide open and shut case.

I 100% agree with this. Negligent driver. Inexperienced, incompetent or distracted driver. Driving too fast for the conditions. Not enough facts to know for sure. What if the cyclist swerved onto the road and didn't hear a vehicle coming up behind him?

I used to bike race once upon a time and have ridden many thousands of miles on all sorts of roads and have seen a lot of things. There's no reason an RV driver should be able to whack a cyclist with a mirror. It sounds like it may have been a Class C MH for a mirror to be at the height to hit a cyclist. There's a lot of Class C's on the roads this time of year are rentals and many drivers will have little to no experience driving one. Even experienced RV drivers sometimes don't know how to judge clearance on each side of a MH or trailer.

Recently met a couple in a gas station visiting from Korea. They were driving a rental Class C. They had no idea to even use the gas pump and put fuel into it. They were heading to Banff in Alberta where there's some pretty twisty mountain roads.

What I do know is that there's a lot of cyclist haters out there who think that vehicles own the road no matter what. But there are also a lot of cyclist who don't know how to safely ride on the roads. In Europe for ex., cycling education starts at a young age in school.

pnichols wrote:

westernrvparkowner wrote:
This is a time I wish I knew of a good Cycling forum so I can read all the posts that are the polar opposite of these. The one thing that is inarguable is that the laws of physics win against the laws of government. 150lb biker vs 30,000lb RV is not a fair fight. Doesn't really matter to the biker who was legally at fault, physics won.

Outstanding point and well stated!

That reminds me of what I do whenever walking in town, during which of course the law reads that "pedestrians have the right of way": I never "assume my right of way" when walking around traffic, and as such always do my best to let the multi-thousand pound vehicle(s) keep moving while I stop and wait for the vehicle(s). It's way, way easier for me to stop than a vehicle.

IMHO, cyclists should ride around traffic the same way and with the same attitude - I know I did when I used to ride my bike across town to college centuries ago.

It's called defensive driving, motorcyclists practice it all the time.

westernrvparkowner wrote:
This is a time I wish I knew of a good Cycling forum so I can read all the posts that are the polar opposite of these. The one thing that is inarguable is that the laws of physics win against the laws of government. 150lb biker vs 30,000lb RV is not a fair fight. Doesn't really matter to the biker who was legally at fault, physics won.

Outstanding point and well stated!

That reminds me of what I do whenever walking in town, during which of course the law reads that "pedestrians have the right of way": I never "assume my right of way" when walking around traffic, and as such always do my best to let the multi-thousand pound vehicle(s) keep moving while I stop and wait for the vehicle(s). It's way, way easier for me to stop than a vehicle.

IMHO, cyclists should ride around traffic the same way and with the same attitude - I know I did when I used to ride my bike across town to college centuries ago.

Airdaile wrote:

mich800 wrote:

Airdaile wrote:

whjco wrote:

azdryheat wrote:
When you step foot in the ocean you become part of the food chain. Kind of the same on a roadway.

Like it or not, as aggravating as they can sometimes be, a cyclist has the same legal rights to most roads as we do with our RVs.

And I will afford them their rights as soon as I see one of them stop for a stop sign.

Case closed. I also have never seen someone in an automobile not obeying traffic laws. But I assure you. If I see someone in a car fails to stop, game on time to run them down.

Nice try. If a motorist runs a stop sign and a cop sees it, there's at least a chance that someone will get a ticket. Nothing ever happens to a biker - NOTHING. Never seen or even heard of a cop busting a cyclist. Scofflaws pure and simple.

Well BTDT. Back in the day (1972) when I was 19 and riding my bike to work one morning I came to a red light. It was early in the morning and zero traffic. As a young rebellion I thought why do I need to just sit here for no one. So I rode through the red light. A cop pulled up behind me lights flashing. He gave me a ticket for running a red light. He said I was under the same rules as vehicles.
So yes people do get tickets on bikes.
I will add though that was then and today I highly doubt a cop cares all that much about bicyclists.

This is a time I wish I knew of a good Cycling forum so I can read all the posts that are the polar opposite of these. The one thing that is inarguable is that the laws of physics win against the laws of government. 150lb biker vs 30,000lb RV is not a fair fight. Doesn't really matter to the biker who was legally at fault, physics won.

Tvov wrote:

JRscooby wrote:
Many postes talk of bikes being careless. And yes, it does happen. But many drivers are irrational about bikes. I'm commuting, probably 12-15 MPH, traffic passing me at 40, no issue. Light turns red, cars stop. Now I'm passing them at 15, and you would think I was slapping their face as I go by.
If a cyclist is not obeying the law/rules of the road, and gets hit, that is on him. But if he is just riding along, obeying the rules with regard to lights and reflectors, and you run into him, it is you that is wrong

Just to be clear, you aren't just going through a red light "passing them at 15mph"? Because THAT is what pisses off car drivers, it happens all the time, and that is why they are giving you the stink eye.

No, as I get close to the intersection I adjust my speed, want to go across intersection near middle of green. This section of state highway has 2 travel lanes each direction, plus 2 left turn, and a right turn at the intersections. Near the major intersections, it has walls to seperate cars going different directions, but between there is 2 wide lanes to use for turning left into business driveway.

At a red light, you bicycle up towards the intersection on the right hand side, correct? Fine, but... if the first car has its right hand blinker on, do you go right up next to it, blocking it from turning? Especially after the light turns green, do you start out right away -- preventing the car, who was at the intersection before you, from turning?

When I'm passing cars I always look for turn signals. I will not pass one unless I'm sure that I will not interfere. At the start of a right turn lane, I will move left until I'm at the right edge of thru lane. And yes, at that point I may have cars on both sides of me. Double handful of seat and both hands on the bars.

I was stopped by a worker on the road where construction was going....

You don't want to hear of all the stupid I have seen around construction sites, but it is enough that I do not think a ticket should be issued for speeding thru one. A better idea, is soon as you are stopped, while still in hurry, blindfold you, tie you so you can't move, stand you in a barrel, and set you on the line to protect the workers for a few hours.

Just another day of dealing with rude bicyclists who ignore "rules of the road".

I am always a little surprised at the "bicycle advocates" who seemingly never see any bicyclist ignoring road laws and just being a jerk in general on the road.

And always a little surprised when a RVer gets all upset at the thought of taking a test to prove he knows the difference in the "rules" between car and a larger vehicle. Or my marker lights don't work, what should I do when I get home?
It is not just the cyclist that think the rules don't apply...

Love all the back-seat, after the fact "I know" comments. Since none of us were there we cannot say for certain who was right and who was wrong. If there's any real "fault" involved it's the fact we have too many people trying to share too few roads. It appears it was a hard choice-stay in your lane and potentially hit the cyclist or move over and potentially hit another vehicle head-on. There's no right answer.

For those who say "this will never happen to me" arrogance goeth before the fall. Stuff happens. Sometimes you do your best and you still fail.

JRscooby wrote:
Many postes talk of bikes being careless. And yes, it does happen. But many drivers are irrational about bikes. I'm commuting, probably 12-15 MPH, traffic passing me at 40, no issue. Light turns red, cars stop. Now I'm passing them at 15, and you would think I was slapping their face as I go by.
If a cyclist is not obeying the law/rules of the road, and gets hit, that is on him. But if he is just riding along, obeying the rules with regard to lights and reflectors, and you run into him, it is you that is wrong

Just to be clear, you aren't just going through a red light "passing them at 15mph"? Because THAT is what pisses off car drivers, it happens all the time, and that is why they are giving you the stink eye.

At a red light, you bicycle up towards the intersection on the right hand side, correct? Fine, but... if the first car has its right hand blinker on, do you go right up next to it, blocking it from turning? Especially after the light turns green, do you start out right away -- preventing the car, who was at the intersection before you, from turning?

I was stopped by a worker on the road where construction was going on while they were moving equipment. Two bicyclists come up... do they stop with the traffic until given the okay to go? No, of course not (at least where I live). They see a gap behind the back of the traffic control guy and shoot through the construction scene. Traffic guy just grimaces, sees me and we both just shrug our shoulders. Just another day of dealing with rude bicyclists who ignore "rules of the road".

I am always a little surprised at the "bicycle advocates" who seemingly never see any bicyclist ignoring road laws and just being a jerk in general on the road.

For all the bicyclists out there who obey the law and the rules of the road, thank you!! Keep it up! And please make an effort to educate other bicyclists.