How much will this cost us?

Chicago is easy to avoid tolls and not be in the constant wild zoo of truck and cars in the mind numbing traffic. Go south of Chicago when going east to west and go west of Chicago when going north or south. We have the Chicago jams in our way everytime we go west and never take the toll roads when towing an RV etc. Going past Chicago is simply truck choked toll roads almost all the time. Rattles your nerves as it's almost 60 miles of cars jutting wildly in and out between constant starting and stopping or slow moving trucks and near misses often. Always had backups for constant wrecks and that makes it even worse. They are crazy!

To make bad even worse is huge Lake Michigan that creates a funneling of vehicles in the 10 million population area because vehicles don't do well crossing water with no roadway.

Last about 15 years, we usually go north over the Big Mac Bridge at the Straits and take US-2 west. So much more pleasant, relaxing, and fun with real scenery. Adds about 50 miles distance to the long trip but takes less time than going south and west past Chicago. It's also a money saver on fuel going the extra 50 miles VS the tolls and the stop and go driving wasting fuel.

chevor wrote:
Isn't it obvious? They have to pay back who funded their election in the first place.

:B :B

It seems to me that tolls have no effect on quantity/quality of interstate road repairs. Almost all toll interstates I have driven have been worse roads than those that are not toll. You have to look no farther than I-80 and I-70 in PA or I-95 in NJ/NY - some of the worst roads ever.

Take the vacation money and use it on roads then acquire a presidential RV to use for vacations on the new roads. Two birds, one stone, "free" roads.

We are freakin doomed!

SOS

None of them have ever seen a TAX they don't like. Sheeples, have never seen a TAX they don't mind Paying!

naturist wrote:
Nobody I know LIKES paying taxes. Wait, check that: nobody I know LIKES paying for ANYTHING. But if you want the goods, you have to pay for them. That's just how it is.

And I for one want the roads, so I'll grit my teeth and pay my share of maintaining them. Personally, I'd rather they just increased the fuel tax, rather than make toll roads. But every time a legislator proposes doing that, the screaming gets deafening and the anti-tax nuts come out of the woodwork.

I know we've cut our fuel purchases from the days the main ride got 16-20 mpg and the current one gets 50. This suggests that we should be in line for something like a tripling of our gas tax rates just to get us back to par supporting those roads we use so much. In our state the gas tax is set as a percentage, rather than a cents/per gallon, and it currently is 3.2%. I can't imagine an immediate jump to 9% making it through the Republican-dominated legislature, can you?

So, yeah, if the number of toll roads increases, I am not going to like it. But ya gotta do what ya gotta do, and that applies to gub'mint as much as to you and I. And I note that OVERALL, TAXES ARE AT A 70 YEAR LOW in the US.

Naturalist has several points, but some of what he knows is just Wrong.

He is only partly correct that if you what the product or service, you have to pay for it. Many in this country don't. They are now wards of the state and their needs (wants and desires) are funded by the tax payers. (My son, his wife and all their children now are in this class.)

He stated (without reference) that "OVERALL, TAXES ARE AT A 70 YEAR LOW in the US." There is a book he should read called "How to Lie with Statistics (ISBN 0-393-31072-8)". The taxes collected are low because the countries economy is so far in the tank and so much less is being earned by wage earners and corporation, that taxes paid has also dropped (IHS.com). The actual fact is that tax rates have gone up and are soon to go up again. But, as usual, when the tax rates and fuel costs go up, the people paying those taxes do their best to avoid paying them as taxes usually do nothing of benefit for the payer.

There is still an US Excise tax on high load tires. That needs to be extended to "Low Rolling Resistance" tires used on hybrid vehicles to get the CAFE up. Other than that, the proposed taxes both new and increased will probably force an end our RVing in late 2016. I'm not happy about that, but those are the new laws.

Matt

ReadyToGo wrote:
If you don't want to pay tolls, there is a simple solution: stay off the toll ways.
Just drove alongside the Austin TX toll way. Didn't pay a penny and went as fast as I wanted.
Also have driven alongside I-35 in Kansas. Went as fast as I wanted there also.
Same with the toll way in Oklahoma.
There is one exception. Getting through Chicago is almost impossible without going on a tollway.

When possible. Try going from San Diego --> LA without using an Interstate. Or from almost anywhere to Las Vegas.

Dog Folks wrote:
I know it is not total solution, and I will get flamed for this: BUT what about the growing number of "environmentally friendly" electric cars that use our roads and do not pay the use taxes that are built into fuel costs?

When will their free ride end?

In certain parts of D.C. there has been discussion about eliminating the fuel tax and starting a mileage tax. Drive more miles, pay more taxes, drive less miles pay less taxes. So far they haven't figured out the logistics of putting it into action.

Dog Folks wrote:
I know it is not total solution, and I will get flamed for this: BUT what about the growing number of "environmentally friendly" electric cars that use our roads and do not pay the use taxes that are built into fuel costs?

When will their free ride end?

Yep, you have that right the owners of hybrids and all electric cars are getting a free ride on the roads.
These are very "Smart Cars". The real solution is very close to tolls, it is a tax by mile driven, or better yet weight/mile same as truckers pay. Road tax based on the weight and miles driven.
Vehicles could be equipped with sealed transponders to track miles driven, but many go No, No, No, don't track my travels that is an invasion of privacy.

It is like many that get permanent plates for their trailers, they use the roads paying $200 once in the life of the trailer doesn't cover their use.

Here in Oregon my 32' 5er cost $229 every two years to license, 40% goes to the highway fund and 60% goes to Oregon State Parks.

There should be some of you Washingtonians, that can remember when there was a push to speed up the upgrades to Highway 18 between Auburn and North Bend, the state asked to put a toll on the road, the citizens turned it down for a slower pace of improvements.