How to finance yourself while RVing fulltime?

westend wrote:

bigdogger wrote:

westend wrote:
If the vehicle is used in the conduct of a business, the vehicle expenses could be a business expense. I don't operate like that but do deduct vehicle expense from my business. You are getting into a grey area, there for me, as one would also be using it as a residence and there may be some fancy accounting in that regard. Really, there's nothing from preventing me from taking a few postcards for sale to the Grand Canyon, using a coach as the transportation, and writing the whole thing off.

Other than the fact that the IRS would stomp all over that deduction for numerous reasons, how much income are you going to be able to shelter from the sale of a few postcards? Tax write offs are worthless if you don't have income. If you have income and are trying to write off depreciation on your RV, the RV had better be a necessity, not a convenience to earning that income. Best for 99% of all people to consider the costs of the RV and travel as something your traveling income is going to have to cover in addition to normal living expenses like food and insurance. Like others have said, it is possible to supplement retirement and social security income while RVing, but to make an actual living you really need a portable professional job. Still much better for the pre-retirement person to have a career and take RV vacations than it is to travel around the country working 6 months at a time flipping burgers at Micky D's.

I don't believe you're correct about the IRS and it's position on the hypothetical post card sales business. A nice thing about the tax code is that it allows for loss of income. Lets say our hypothetical post card salesman has another job. He earns $50,000/yr. but isn't content so forms his post card business, buys an RV and proceeds to drive many miles, selling only a few cards. The next years filing would show a big loss on Schedule C for the post card business and that number could be deducted from the $50K from his other income.

As to the exact relationship that the RV plays in the operation of a business and to personal use for recreation, I'm not clear. This is where a tax consultant or accountant would be of benefit.

Actually, the IRS is very clear about how a business needs to be profitable. The general rule is it must make a profit 3 out of 5 years. There are also many other criteria they may apply. If a business loses money (making the RV expenses business expenses would obviously do that in the postcard scheme) and there is really no intention or potential to be profitable, the IRS will dis-allow the loss from being deducted from other income hence sheltering that income rom taxes. The real nasty thing is when they dis-allow those deductions you will not only be responsible for the taxes, but penalties and interest as well.

bigdogger wrote:
So true. Living in an RV and have to move occasionally to follow your work is way different than traveling the country for recreation. Saying a person moving around to different pipeline welding jobs is an RVer is the same as saying waiter on a cruise ship is taking a Carribean Cruise.

I do not disagree with your example, but I have friends who worked as pilots, stewards and stewardesses for airlines and another that was a merchant marine. They got to experience a lot of different places on their days off in their travels for work. I don't see a very big difference between workamping/volunteering for up to 6 months in one spot and working a temporary job in a trade if one needs a source of income rather than just a supplement to retirement.

Birdogger your the man !! Imagine working to achieve financial independence, something that apparently was lost on one individual.

Great response.

Bill

bigdogger wrote:

westend wrote:
If the vehicle is used in the conduct of a business, the vehicle expenses could be a business expense. I don't operate like that but do deduct vehicle expense from my business. You are getting into a grey area, there for me, as one would also be using it as a residence and there may be some fancy accounting in that regard. Really, there's nothing from preventing me from taking a few postcards for sale to the Grand Canyon, using a coach as the transportation, and writing the whole thing off.

Other than the fact that the IRS would stomp all over that deduction for numerous reasons, how much income are you going to be able to shelter from the sale of a few postcards? Tax write offs are worthless if you don't have income. If you have income and are trying to write off depreciation on your RV, the RV had better be a necessity, not a convenience to earning that income. Best for 99% of all people to consider the costs of the RV and travel as something your traveling income is going to have to cover in addition to normal living expenses like food and insurance. Like others have said, it is possible to supplement retirement and social security income while RVing, but to make an actual living you really need a portable professional job. Still much better for the pre-retirement person to have a career and take RV vacations than it is to travel around the country working 6 months at a time flipping burgers at Micky D's.

I don't believe you're correct about the IRS and it's position on the hypothetical post card sales business. A nice thing about the tax code is that it allows for loss of income. Lets say our hypothetical post card salesman has another job. He earns $50,000/yr. but isn't content so forms his post card business, buys an RV and proceeds to drive many miles, selling only a few cards. The next years filing would show a big loss on Schedule C for the post card business and that number could be deducted from the $50K from his other income.

As to the exact relationship that the RV plays in the operation of a business and to personal use for recreation, I'm not clear. This is where a tax consultant or accountant would be of benefit.

Building a net worth of a million dollars is fairly easy today (a million just isn't what it used to be). Most minor millionaires I know (many colleagues) did it on salary, or starting and running small businesses, and they got there by not spending it faster than they could earn it. They key to building wealth is to not spend all that you earn, and to certainly not spend more than you earn.

Many college graduates today will earn $2-5 million in a working life of 20-25 years, but few will accumulate that wealth, as they spend most of it on things they will eventually discard, or on housing themselves in a place bigger than they need in a location too expensive for the value provided.

A $15/hour job will pay a wage-earner close to a million dollars over a 35 year working life, and many at that level will start early enough to work 45 years. A $24/hour job will pay $1,750,000 over 35 years.

I try to keep my kids on track with lifestyle vs earnings, but sometimes when they get an income boost, or a break on cost of living from moving around, first thing coming to their minds is "what can I spend this on?" The discipline is not easy.

wintersun wrote:

Old-Biscuit wrote:
Be debt free and have an income

Or do it the American way and have rich parents. Worked for the Waltons and the Bush and Romney and Koch and hundreds of other billion heirs.

You do realize that roughly 80% of millionaires in America are FIRST generation wealthy? They didn't inherit their money, they earned it. If people spent a lot less energy on complaining about other rich people and spent that energy on becoming successful instead they too might have become millionaires. (hint hint)

Old-Biscuit wrote:
Be debt free and have an income

Or do it the American way and have rich parents. Worked for the Waltons and the Bush and Romney and Koch and hundreds of other billion heirs.

Not yet heard from the OP, but the key to making money while moving around at will is to be an entrepeneur rather than an employee. There are not all that many employers who can let you be where you want to be, rather than where they need you to be. There are jobs that require you to move around from one job location to another, and sometimes an RV facilitates that (a relative who services nuclear power plants, usually a 2-3 month job, has just bought a trailer, to get away from the cheap motels he has been living in for years). That's not the same as going where you want to go.

You could make yourself the Rick Steve of RV travel and produce, star in, a travel show. All you have to do is sell the idea to financial backers.

You could be another Mike Wolfe. He didn't start out as a picker (that would be Frank), rather he was a producer of TV shows, specializing in reality formats, and "picking" and the antique business grew out of that. All he had to do was sell the idea to financial backers, but he did have a good track record.

Traveling independent sales representative is another good idea, doesn't earn as much as producing a TV series, but it can beat working part time for minimum wage (or less), if you are good at selling.

Search on "enterpeneur ideas" and follow some of the leads. Some will lead to web sites on how to become "independently wealthy" if you just pay them to teach you their ideas. (The idea that works for them is getting you to pay). But there are others pointing out work that needs to be done by people who can bring the skills and resources to solve a problem, or sell a solution to a problem.

At the minimum, one could get into the telephone solicitation business, so long as you have a mobile phone and can confine your travel to mobile service areas. About 1/4 of the solicitors calling me lately are coming from mobile numbers. I personally would not want to do that work (though a computer now does most of it for you), yet many people make a living, and most are working for themselves.

You can sell on Amazon as a merchant and use them to actually warehouse and ship the product for you. All you need to do is check inventory and order more product from the manufacturer(s).

Or a good job is someone has the skills is to be an independent sales rep for a number of small companies and go to trade shows or similar events around the country. With the destruction of the worker economy in the Bush years many companies laid off their salaried sales reps but still need people to go around and service their dealers.

One could rep lines of fishing gear for example and make stops at tackle shops or rep tools or gadgets and make stops at hardware stores.
All you need are some decent computer and people skills.

It can take a year or two to get it going to the point where it will provide you with the income you want. I started a business 8 years ago and designed tools which I have manufactured overseas and then shipped to two contract warehouses in the states. I use an internet website and an e-store and Amazon to sell the products and the two warehouses to fill the orders and ship them out.

Our income is half what is was when my wife and I were working full time in high tech but it is more than enough as we have no debts. We can run the business from anywhere in the world where we are in the world and do so with about 8 hours a week of our time.

There are many others selling on Amazon and eBay that are making good incomes from home. The toughest part is already there in place and waiting to be taken advantage of. Don't expect to get filthy rich but you can make a comfortable living.

trailertraveler wrote:
As we have traveled across the country, we have met a lot of folks in campgrounds and RV parks that are working on highway, pipeline, power plant and other projects. We met a gentleman working on a project in Pensacola, FL this winter that has worked in Alaska, North Dakota and lots of places in between as a welder and pipefitter. In the plains states, we meet folks that work operating and maintaining the planting and harvesting equipment like combines and driving grain trucks from the fields to the drying, storage or shipping facilities. We have also met independent insurance appraisers/adjusters that work the aftermath of disasters like wildfires, tornados and hurricanes. I don't think many of these folks consider themselves RVers and the ones that I have talked to don't belong to any RV related organizations.

So true. Living in an RV and have to move occasionally to follow your work is way different than traveling the country for recreation. Saying a person moving around to different pipeline welding jobs is an RVer is the same as saying waiter on a cruise ship is taking a Carribean Cruise.