More efficient propane furnace

howardwheeler wrote:
I know my camper isn’t insulated like a house, but the furnaces in RVs seem unusually inefficient, even crude. It does seem like someone would improve on what is essentially thirty year old technology. My unit is in fact 18 years old. And it was no state of the art furnace when new. Someone mentioned a two stage unit. That sounds very interesting. A better heat exchanger seems possible. I know two stage units in houses do have greater efficiency. Anyway, every time I get home from boondocking I complain to myself and just thought I’d share my complaint. Does anyone know someone who makes a two stage furnace?

I think you dismiss too readily how badly insulated most are. The space between the floor and the belly is often heated space, effectively serving as duct work, Over the years, major leaks can develop causing your furnace to pull in outside air and expel heated air back outside. A couple of hours with silicon sealer and underbelly tape can make a big difference in the performance of your furnace. Probably more than you’ll ever find by upgrading to a more efficient burner.

Piano, I tried to buy one of those when I first remember you mentioning that story of your daughter, but that company is NOT serious about selling anything. I tried for nearly a year with multiple emails and phone calls going to voice mail with no reply. This was over four years ago and I am still waiting for a reply. I am not going to fight with someone to get them to take my money.

I did the research and the catalytic heaters are safe. I have also tested mine, as well as my CO detector to ensure it's proper operation. I know almost no one can do this, but I actually do the CO testing and calibrating of CO monitors at work. I have also tested the output exhaust of my Honda EU2000i generators, and I am comfortable running them all night. Since I have added solar I don't need to anymore, but it is not something I worry about. I did check the accuracy of my Kidde CO sensor with a readout and I found mine to be accurate. When I get another one, I will have to test it to trust it, but right now I can test them with a good degree of accuracy.

All of that being said, I trust mine because I can test and verify them. But I also do run at least two CO detectors in an RV.
Piano, I pay great attention to your knowledge of batteries, and I understand why you judge unvented heaters, but CO is a product of incomplete combustion and catalytic heaters are very efficient.

I use the furnace to warm my 5th wheel up. Then I use electric heaters to maintain the temperature in the 5th wheel. That way you don't use all the propane up. Been doing that for 15 years now.

No doubt CO is a real hazard, but it kinda makes me wonder whether some folks forget to open up a vent when running the oven or stove??…Recognizing and mitigating the hazard is what counts most…

3 tons

I have two CO detectors and no catalytic heater.

Skibane wrote:

msmith1.wa wrote:
Here is one

Not always from heaters either.

There is NOTHING in your article that cites an example of someone being killed by CO from a catalytic heater in an RV.

Millions of people own and use RVs. You'd think that if CO deaths from catalytic heaters in RVs were a problem, there would be a least a few news stories about it.

Where are those news stories?

There is this thing called Google use for yourself and don't expect other's to do it for you.

Skibane wrote:

msmith1.wa wrote:
Here is one

Not always from heaters either.

There is NOTHING in your article that cites an example of someone being killed by CO from a catalytic heater in an RV.

Millions of people own and use RVs. You'd think that if CO deaths from catalytic heaters in RVs were a problem, there would be a least a few news stories about it.

Where are those news stories?

Don’t fool yourself it happens more often than you think.
If your CO2 detector fails you may never know it.

msmith1.wa wrote:

Skibane wrote:

pianotuna wrote:
And you are willing to apply for a Darwin Award on the basis of a 25 cent sensor? No Thanks! When is the last time the sensor was tested?

Let me guess: You're one of those people who wears 3 face masks while driving alone...

Typically, the CO sensor self-tests itself - and the detector also has a manual test button. Most models have a running time counter that disables the detector and sounds an alarm after enough hours have accumulated to degrade sensor accuracy.

If it's really that much of concern to you, install two CO detectors - or three, just to be extra, extra-sure. They're dirt-cheap, and readily available.

You'd think that if there was a significant danger associated with catalytic heaters, there would be at least one published news story about some hapless RVer being killed by one.

They've been sold for many decades. Camco sells a boatload of them.

Where are all the stories about death and carnage?

Here is one

Not always from heaters either.

Oops, try again. Someone got CO poisoning by running their generator effectively indoors….
That’s just extreme stupidity and the outcome would have been to be expected.
Go triple up your mask, Karen.

msmith1.wa wrote:
Here is one

Not always from heaters either.

There is NOTHING in your article that cites an example of someone being killed by CO from a catalytic heater in an RV.

Millions of people own and use RVs. You'd think that if CO deaths from catalytic heaters in RVs were a problem, there would be a least a few news stories about it.

Where are those news stories?

Skibane wrote:

pianotuna wrote:
And you are willing to apply for a Darwin Award on the basis of a 25 cent sensor? No Thanks! When is the last time the sensor was tested?

Let me guess: You're one of those people who wears 3 face masks while driving alone...

Typically, the CO sensor self-tests itself - and the detector also has a manual test button. Most models have a running time counter that disables the detector and sounds an alarm after enough hours have accumulated to degrade sensor accuracy.

If it's really that much of concern to you, install two CO detectors - or three, just to be extra, extra-sure. They're dirt-cheap, and readily available.

You'd think that if there was a significant danger associated with catalytic heaters, there would be at least one published news story about some hapless RVer being killed by one.

They've been sold for many decades. Camco sells a boatload of them.

Where are all the stories about death and carnage?

Here is one

Not always from heaters either.