1/2 ton SAE J2807 tow ratings

spoon059 wrote:
And for the record, I think it is rather childish that Ford, GM and Dodge all pulled out of this agreement because the other guy wasn't doing it. If they were concerned with safety and educating the buyers (whole purpose behind the standard) then GM and Ram should have gone along with the standard and made a big stink about how comply with this standard and Ford is too afraid of it.

I have to give more respect to Toyta for agreeing to the standard and then honoring their agreement even when everyone else backed out at the last minute.

To GM's credit they did publish their new tow ratings for about 3 weeks on their online ordering guide website with the new SAE specs. The 1/2 ton and one ton trucks changed a couple of hundred lbs at the most. Many weren't changed. The 3/4 ton in certain models dropped from 17xxx to 15xxx lbs was the major change.

IMO safety was never a major part of the new SAE specs but rather a same spec for picking towing performances.

Toyota reduced a few models by up to 400 lbs. If a 10600 lb rating drops to 10200 lb its simply not that big of a deal. Toyota doesn't sell trucks or compete in the HD 3/4 and one ton pickup truck market so their choosing to go with the SAE specs simply doesn't mean much either.

The new SAE specs doesn't change any trucking weights laws or the way folks work the same trucks out here on our highways. Just my opinion but the SAE specs won't change anything or help a newby choose a truck to do the job. They will have the same help me choose questions and the same old answers of yeah its will work fine to the usual you need a one ton truck.

spoon059 wrote:
And for the record, I think it is rather childish that Ford, GM and Dodge all pulled out of this agreement because the other guy wasn't doing it. If they were concerned with safety and educating the buyers (whole purpose behind the standard) then GM and Ram should have gone along with the standard and made a big stink about how comply with this standard and Ford is too afraid of it.

I have to give more respect to Toyota for agreeing to the standard and then honoring their agreement even when everyone else backed out at the last minute.

We agree 100% here, Toyota gets mad props for having the back bone to say, nope we are not going to play these games anymore! Good job Toyota! BTW to all the Fred Diaz fan members, it was under his watch that this happened.

Don

Ram bash? You must be reading some other thread

Perrysburg Dodgeboy wrote:
Not sure how this got turned into a Ram bash fest



Don

Y u so angry?

And for the record, I think it is rather childish that Ford, GM and Dodge all pulled out of this agreement because the other guy wasn't doing it. If they were concerned with safety and educating the buyers (whole purpose behind the standard) then GM and Ram should have gone along with the standard and made a big stink about how comply with this standard and Ford is too afraid of it.

I have to give more respect to Toyta for agreeing to the standard and then honoring their agreement even when everyone else backed out at the last minute.

Perrysburg Dodgeboy wrote:
Not sure how this got turned into a Ram bash fest...

Don

Don you need to calm down. Look through my posts, I do not bash Rams. I personally think that the company has come a long way recently and makes great trucks. If I were in the market today, I would probably be buying a Ram 3500 with the 6.4 Hemi.

I simply used Ram as an example because they are king of the mountain in terms of max towing from a 1 ton pickup truck. Ford and GM are several tons behind Ram last time I checked.

My point was pretty clear, I thought. A Ford with 11K behind it will most likely stop from the same speed in a shorter distance than a Ram with 30K behind. Both are "legal", but people cry and moan on this forum if someone is "stupid enough" to fully load the F150. If you fully load (or over load) the Ram, its still safe in their eyes. I was just pointing out the hypocrisy.

Hopefully all my comments don't get deleted for a mod for "flaming" because I point out the disparity...

azwildcat99 wrote:
I'm okay with the manufacturers tow ratings, but I think there should be two ratings published. One rating with only the driver, as done today, and another with each of the seats filled. That would give a better representation to the American consumer. I was just as naive when I bought my first truck and subsequent trailer. Had I known the effect of payload on tow rating I would have bought the right truck the first time.

You know if you go to the Ram towing guide, it has a sliding scale that will show you how much you can tow with how much payload you reduce form the truck. Pretty slick. Wouldn't be that tough to setup. Ford and GM should take note.

I'm okay with the manufacturers tow ratings, but I think there should be two ratings published. One rating with only the driver, as done today, and another with each of the seats filled. That would give a better representation to the American consumer. I was just as naive when I bought my first truck and subsequent trailer. Had I known the effect of payload on tow rating I would have bought the right truck the first time.

Not sure how this got turned into a Ram bash fest but what I find funny is this.

"Mike Levine, a spokesman for Ford, told Automotive News that the 2015 F-150 will get a new towing rating to go with its new aluminum body.

"As a founding member of the SAE trailer towing committee, we will meet SAE trailer towing standards," he said." :E :h Now he is one hell of a spin master!!!

Lets see Chrysler, Ford and Ram were all going to use the new standards in 2013 but then Ford decided that they were going to take a big hit.
" But Ford decided not to publish lower tow ratings for its 2013 F-150, spurring other automakers to follow suit."

Maybe by bring a 3500 Ram up you might be able to distract from the real story. :Z

Don

spoon059 wrote:

fla-gypsy wrote:
brake a couple of feet shorter.

Isn't that a common issue brought up by owners of 3/4 ton and up trucks... that the half tons might be able to make it move, but they can't stop the weight? Seems to me that this test will show just how long it takes to stop these rigs.

I bet that an F150 towing 11,000 lbs can probably stop that weight in a shorter distance than a Ram 3500 towing 30,000 lbs can stop. Yet somehow it is considered "safe" to pull 30,000 lbs with the Ram (within its ratings) but it is out of control to pull 11,000 lbs with the Ford (within its ratings).

I'm not sure that I follow the logic that a Ram stopping from 65 mph in 500 feet is "safer" than a F150 stopping from 65 mph in 400 feet. I'm making these numbers up, because I don't know the exact numbers... but you get my point.

I agree with that assessment. There are many larger TV's that are seriously overloaded and the operators of such think they are the smart ones. They totally disregard the real numbers and ratings exactly like they will with the new standards.