Forum Discussion
ShinerBock wrote:
4x4ord wrote:
Wouldn't you expect a naturally aspirated engine to be at a much greater disadvantage than a turboed engine at higher elevation?
Yes, and I stated that it was impressive multiple times in this thread. However, I was just commenting on Fish's post were he said the 7.3L almost had the same time as the GM and Ram diesel pulling the same weight. I was merely stating that this was due to the 60 mph speed limit and that even the new Powerstroke would have a similar time due to the max speed of the test. All three diesels would likely be able to accelerate past 60 mph especially at the bottom of the hill. The 7.3L on the other hand was giving it all it had just to get close to 60 mph. Not saying it isn't impressive because it is.4x4ord wrote:
Edit: How are you comming up with a starting elevation of 8835 ft? The elevation of Silverthorn is 9035 and Dillon is about 9100 ft.
Look at it in Google Maps in bicycle mode.
LINK
I think you're right that the elevation gain is 2300 feet. I used an online elevation tool and got the same numbers but by using the elevation of Silverthorn and the elevation of the Eisenhower tunnel I get numbers that made the run a little easier. I was trying to come up with a way of making the Ford numbers believable. When you use 2300 ft as the elevation gain and 7.9 miles as the distance covered it becomes almost impossible for an engine with the new Powerstroke's specifications to do that run in 10:20 operating at the low rpm it ran at. It is also interesting that when you plug 500 HP and 7800 lbs into a 0-60 estimator it spits out 6.75 seconds which is what the Powerstroke was measured at by TFL.0-60 estimator This calculator predicts the 0-60 time (7.5 seconds) of my 440 HP 2017 Powerstroke almost exactly. It makes it hard believing Ford's power numbers.4x4ord wrote:
Wouldn't you expect a naturally aspirated engine to be at a much greater disadvantage than a turboed engine at higher elevation?
Yes, and I stated that it was impressive multiple times in this thread. However, I was just commenting on Fish's post were he said the 7.3L almost had the same time as the GM and Ram diesel pulling the same weight. I was merely stating that this was due to the 60 mph speed limit and that even the new Powerstroke would have a similar time due to the max speed of the test. All three diesels would likely be able to accelerate past 60 mph especially at the bottom of the hill. The 7.3L on the other hand was giving it all it had just to get close to 60 mph. Not saying it isn't impressive because it is.4x4ord wrote:
Edit: How are you comming up with a starting elevation of 8835 ft? The elevation of Silverthorn is 9035 and Dillon is about 9100 ft.
Look at it in Google Maps in bicycle mode.
LINKdanrclem wrote:
It didn't take hotrodders very long to start working on this engine.
LINK
Watch the videos linked in this article if you have any mechanical interest in the engine.
They have both a top and bottom end teardown video, plus some dyno stuff and measurements to compare it to the 351W and Coyote.
Lots of great info for us gear heads who have been dying to see what Ford built.- I wonder how long it will take before a couple of turbos get stuck onto the 7.3
- It didn't take hotrodders very long to start working on this engine.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/enthusiasts/fords-73-liter-v-8-can-make-600-naturally-aspirated-horsepower-with-basic-mods/ar-BBZC4PB?ocid=spartandhp ShinerBock wrote:
4x4ord wrote:
ShinerBock wrote:
How far is it 7.7? The point I'm making is that there wasnt a whole lot of extra power on tap because the Duramax only produced 341 hp with wide open throttle in the 30k test. Do you think, based on these test results, that the Duramax would out pull a 7.3 gas engine towing 16 k lbs at a more typical 3000 -5000 ft elevation.4x4ord wrote:
The run is only 7.6 miles long. The average incline is a 5.3 % grade with the top part being steeper. Godzilla averaged 52.4 mph. The Duamax ran full throttle pulling 30k at about 38 mph average speed. The math works out that it only developed an average of 341 hp at the crank during that run. Godzilla had to develop nearly identical HP to pull 16 k up at 52.4 mph.
Plotting from the sign on the on ramp in Silverthorne that they use as a starting point to the traffic lights at the top at the tunnel that they use as the end is more than 7.6 miles. Also, we are not talking about the 30k lb trailer runs the diesels made. We are talking about the 16k trailer runs that Fish posted earlier in his usual attempts to throw dirt on other brands. What I am trying to tell him is that even the new Powerstroke would have a similar 8:XX time because the test is limited to 60 mph.
It is almost 7.9 miles based on Google maps and it starts at 8,835 ft and ends at 11,135 ft. So the best possible time a truck can get is 7:54 seconds IF it starts out the run at 60 mph and stayed there the whole way. This is not the case and it takes some time to move a truck towing 16k from 20 to 60 mph up an incline above 8,000 ft altitude.
And yes I think the Duramax would still outrun the 7.3L at 3,000-5,000 ft because the engine will make more power than it does on the Ike. As I stated in another thread, the power an engine makes is not static and is always changing depending on many external conditions and engine design. Not to mention the gearing and trans programming also makes a huge difference in how well the engine can stay within it's power band.
Wouldn't you expect a naturally aspirated engine to be at a much greater disadvantage than a turboed engine at higher elevation? As far as the transmission tuning goes it looks like the Duramax/Allison is tuned to be pretty aggressive on its shift points and with a ten speed I think you can feel pretty confident that the Duramax will normally be revving in the 2500 - 3000 rpm range under full throttle.
7.9 miles vs 7.6 and 2300 ft of elevation gain instead of 2120 doesn't sound like that big of deal but it actually does make it harder to make the numbers work in a way that is believable .... especially for the Powerstroke to have pulled off what it did at 2200 rpm. It almost had to have been making more like 425 HP instead of 400 at the rpm it pulled the hill at. And according to the video I thought I was giving it the benefit of the doubt saying it revved at 2200 .... I thought it looked more like 2100 most of the time.
Edit: How are you comming up with a starting elevation of 8835 ft? The elevation of Silverthorn is 9035 and Dillon is about 9100 ft.JRscooby wrote:
I buy a new vehicle every 20 years or so. I have always thought a diesel pickup was not the best idea for most buyers. If you drive less than about 10000 miles a month, the price of fuel would never save the cost of the upgrade. The extra long life of the engine is mostly wasted because most pickups are not junked because the engine wore out. Then add the problems the emission controls cause, and the outrageous cost of some repairs that are needed by too high percentage of owners.
I'm thinking that the big spark plug motor might be a good choice...
This is even more true in the Class C/B/A market, where many get driven less than 2k miles / year, and sits there the other 9 months. A diesel is very wasteful, and your maintenance / mile driven is through the roof.
I see Ford really dominating in that market - they already own nearly 100% of the cab chassis, and now with a 7.3 / 10 spd combo, would make for some very good motorhomes.
Of course, there's always a big market for diesel - high miles driven, frequent heavy towing / hot shotting, power enthusiasts, or if you simply have money to burn.- Maybe there will be a new gas engine war between manufacturers. The consumer will definitely benefit from that war.
- I drive my diesel less than 10,000 miles a year, it probably only cost me a couple thousand more than a gas truck. I do my repairs myself and they aren’t all that expensive. My truck has no emissions control issues and never will.
Oh, your talking about NEW diesel trucks....
If I ever get a new truck I may get the 7.3, for no other reason than the fact that I think it’s cool. And so I can continually answer the question: “ Why didn’t you get a diesel?”
No doubt the new 7.3 pulls a trailer better than my old 7.3. JRscooby wrote:
spud1957 wrote:
I see this as my only option for my next tow vehicle IF I want to stay with Ford. Just can't see myself buying a Ford 6.7. I would always be wondering when the fuel pump is going to grenade. Neighbour here at our park in Largo had his 2016 die last week. The fuel pump took out the fuel system. 30,000 miles on the truck!!
THERE WAS NO WATER IN THE FUEL AND WARRANTY IS COVERING IT.
IF I go diesel it will probably be a 2017+ GM.
S
I buy a new vehicle every 20 years or so. I have always thought a diesel pickup was not the best idea for most buyers. If you drive less than about 10000 miles a month, the price of fuel would never save the cost of the upgrade. The extra long life of the engine is mostly wasted because most pickups are not junked because the engine wore out. Then add the problems the emission controls cause, and the outrageous cost of some repairs that are needed by too high percentage of owners.
I'm thinking that the big spark plug motor might be a good choice...
lol
:B
