Aluminum vs Fiberglass

You married? If so, siding is whatever comes with the floor plan of choice.

I like the classic look of Aluminum. I did have to repair cracks above the door frame, Which Sunnybrook did without cost to me. The aluminum frame and siding on the heavy frame have been a nice combination to own. Not officially a "light weight" trailer at 6700 lbs dry, but still lighter than many in it's class and has huge carrying capacity. I'd say buy what you like. I prefer tin. Each to his own.

I've owned both. For me, the fiberglass TT is easier to clean and maintain.

Ralph Cramden wrote:

Terryallan wrote:



I guess we believe what we want. I can only tell you what the website, and Coachmen say for their construction. And go by the fact that my 30" TT is super light. Comes in at 4811lb per the yellow sticker that is required by law to be correct. Compared to a 30" aluminum TT with the same floor plan that weighs over 6000lb. I can only guess that it is the Azdel that makes it so light. And yes. I know it is only in the walls. but that is enough. After all. they both have the same appliances, only mine has a gas, and electric WH, same slide Same beds, sofa, ect, ect.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, as it has been 2+ years since I have hole sawed through a Coachmen and will assume they now use Azdel for the inner layer also. I know for a fact it's used nowhere else, and even Coachmen's literature specifically says sidewalls.

A 30' RV would use 30 sheets for both the sidewalls, both inner and outer layers. The weight of a 1/8" thick sheet of luan is about 11 lbs and Azdel claims it weighs half what luan weighs. So that would be a weight savings of 165 lbs on a 30' trailer, 30 sheets at 5.5 lbs for Azdel opposed to 30 sheets at 11 lbs for luan. That weight savings you report came from somewhere else in the construction, most likely the frame and laminated floor.

I am not being contentious here but my 1995 31.5 ft Layton with no slide was a conventional (stick and tin) construction and had an UVWR of around 4,900 lbs. It was a very easy to tow camper, even with a half ton. It had a GVWR of about 7,700 lbs. It was easy to pull.

I wanted to mention that because you don't have to be super modern materials to be a lightweight.

Thanks!

Jeremiah

Terryallan wrote:



I guess we believe what we want. I can only tell you what the website, and Coachmen say for their construction. And go by the fact that my 30" TT is super light. Comes in at 4811lb per the yellow sticker that is required by law to be correct. Compared to a 30" aluminum TT with the same floor plan that weighs over 6000lb. I can only guess that it is the Azdel that makes it so light. And yes. I know it is only in the walls. but that is enough. After all. they both have the same appliances, only mine has a gas, and electric WH, same slide Same beds, sofa, ect, ect.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, as it has been 2+ years since I have hole sawed through a Coachmen and will assume they now use Azdel for the inner layer also. I know for a fact it's used nowhere else, and even Coachmen's literature specifically says sidewalls.

A 30' RV would use 30 sheets for both the sidewalls, both inner and outer layers. The weight of a 1/8" thick sheet of luan is about 11 lbs and Azdel claims it weighs half what luan weighs. So that would be a weight savings of 165 lbs on a 30' trailer, 30 sheets at 5.5 lbs for Azdel opposed to 30 sheets at 11 lbs for luan. That weight savings you report came from somewhere else in the construction, most likely the frame and laminated floor.

Ralph Cramden wrote:

Do you have any specific examples, such as manufacturer and model, of an aluminum sided aluminum framed trailer made today. I'm aware of Airstream, Livin-lite, and AVT along with some off brands like Work and Play. Run of the mill aluminum sided trailers that have S lock panels are always wood framed to my knowledge. Its a little hard to shoot a staple though an RV siding flange into aluminum tube and expect it to hold. The RV manufacturers are notorius for missing studs or blowing staples clean through the flange even with wood framing. I know of none using conventional RV S lock panels on aluminum framing.

I have seen more than a few new trailers with aluminum siding coming loose, especially with the thin gauge garbage used today, and a few on the PA turnpike being hauled to dealers by transporters with panels flapping in the wind. The only thing keeping it on was trim, molding, and windows.

Our last 5th wheel was a Sunnybrooke with aluminum siding and aluminum studs.

Not sure how they are attached as I never had reason to pull the siding off.

I like Azdel and I like Apex. Probably going to be my next Camper.

Smooth sided for me.

Please add some frameless windows while at it. Btw.

Ralph Cramden wrote:

Terryallan wrote:

Ralph Cramden wrote:

goducks10 wrote:
Find a fiberglass sided aluminum framed trailer that uses Azdel as the backing for the fiberglass. Zero delamination.

Not even close to the truth. Most only use Azdel for the outer substrate layer between the filon skin and center frame and foam layer. The inside is still Luan plywood. Sure the Azdel will not delaminate itself when wet like Luan but the adhesives are low VOC water based. Get water in the panel and the filon can delaminate from the Azdel, or the Azdel from the foam and aluminum tube center, or the inner wall panel can delaminate or fall apart.

Zero chance of delamination is far from a fact. Better yes....Bulletproof? Far from it.

A lot of marketing mumbo jumbo for sure and if it sways your purchase decision so be it.

A thing most people do not consider is the method of lamination. Vacuum bonded panels are far better than panels laminated by pinch rolling. Our 2013 Keystone had no delamination but after 3 years you could see every panel joint in the lamination, because Keystone uses pinch rolling. Were in our 3rd season in our 17 Rockwood and I can not see a seam as Rockwood vacuum bonds the panels.

Looked it up. RV Azdel walls have no wood. they are constructed as follows. Fiberglass exterior, Azdel, insulation, Azdel, décor interior. NONE of the pictures showed any wood period. No wood was mentioned in any of the descriptions. In truth. It was specifically noted that there is no wood, luan or other wise in a Azdel wall. You may know what you are talking about. But the construction cut aways, and specs tell a different story.

It was also NOT promised there could be no delamination, But that the chance is drastically reduced. I tried to download a picture, but it wouldn't. However. you can go to www.azdelonboard.com to see the construction of Azdell. This is the wall construction of the Coachmen RVs.

The inner layer of the wall panels on Coachmen trailers is luan plywood with vinyl wallcovering. The outer layer behind the Filon layer is Azdel and that is the only place it's used. Not the front nor rear walls, roof, or floor. Those areas are plywood. Want to see for yourself just look inside the hole for the door latch with a flashlight and you'll see the difference in the edge of the inner and outer panels for yourself. Heartland RVs, who also tout Azdel, are built the same way.

If you want to believe the websites and brochures go right ahead, just take them with a grain of salt because they'll also tell you about the high level of quality and quality control. Do not forget to also read the disclaimers on every one about specifications and materials being subject to change without notice at any time. There is more BS in those brochures and websites than in most cow pastures.

The cut aways at the Azdel website mean nothing when it comes to the actual construction the RV manufacturers use. Azdel makes and sells a material, they do not have anything to do with making the entire wall panel.

I guess we believe what we want. I can only tell you what the website, and Coachmen say for their construction. And go by the fact that my 30" TT is super light. Comes in at 4811lb per the yellow sticker that is required by law to be correct. Compared to a 30" aluminum TT with the same floor plan that weighs over 6000lb. I can only guess that it is the Azdel that makes it so light. And yes. I know it is only in the walls. but that is enough. After all. they both have the same appliances, only mine has a gas, and electric WH, same slide Same beds, sofa, ect, ect.

Terryallan wrote:

Ralph Cramden wrote:

goducks10 wrote:
Find a fiberglass sided aluminum framed trailer that uses Azdel as the backing for the fiberglass. Zero delamination.

Not even close to the truth. Most only use Azdel for the outer substrate layer between the filon skin and center frame and foam layer. The inside is still Luan plywood. Sure the Azdel will not delaminate itself when wet like Luan but the adhesives are low VOC water based. Get water in the panel and the filon can delaminate from the Azdel, or the Azdel from the foam and aluminum tube center, or the inner wall panel can delaminate or fall apart.

Zero chance of delamination is far from a fact. Better yes....Bulletproof? Far from it.

A lot of marketing mumbo jumbo for sure and if it sways your purchase decision so be it.

A thing most people do not consider is the method of lamination. Vacuum bonded panels are far better than panels laminated by pinch rolling. Our 2013 Keystone had no delamination but after 3 years you could see every panel joint in the lamination, because Keystone uses pinch rolling. Were in our 3rd season in our 17 Rockwood and I can not see a seam as Rockwood vacuum bonds the panels.

Looked it up. RV Azdel walls have no wood. they are constructed as follows. Fiberglass exterior, Azdel, insulation, Azdel, décor interior. NONE of the pictures showed any wood period. No wood was mentioned in any of the descriptions. In truth. It was specifically noted that there is no wood, luan or other wise in a Azdel wall. You may know what you are talking about. But the construction cut aways, and specs tell a different story.

It was also NOT promised there could be no delamination, But that the chance is drastically reduced. I tried to download a picture, but it wouldn't. However. you can go to www.azdelonboard.com to see the construction of Azdell. This is the wall construction of the Coachmen RVs.

The inner layer of the wall panels on Coachmen trailers is luan plywood with vinyl wallcovering. The outer layer behind the Filon layer is Azdel and that is the only place it's used. Not the front nor rear walls, roof, or floor. Those areas are plywood. Want to see for yourself just look inside the hole for the door latch with a flashlight and you'll see the difference in the edge of the inner and outer panels for yourself. Heartland RVs, who also tout Azdel, are built the same way.

If you want to believe the websites and brochures go right ahead, just take them with a grain of salt because they'll also tell you about the high level of quality and quality control. Do not forget to also read the disclaimers on every one about specifications and materials being subject to change without notice at any time. There is more BS in those brochures and websites than in most cow pastures.

The cut aways at the Azdel website mean nothing when it comes to the actual construction the RV manufacturers use. Azdel makes and sells a material, they do not have anything to do with making the entire wall panel.

Ralph Cramden wrote:

goducks10 wrote:
Find a fiberglass sided aluminum framed trailer that uses Azdel as the backing for the fiberglass. Zero delamination.

Not even close to the truth. Most only use Azdel for the outer substrate layer between the filon skin and center frame and foam layer. The inside is still Luan plywood. Sure the Azdel will not delaminate itself when wet like Luan but the adhesives are low VOC water based. Get water in the panel and the filon can delaminate from the Azdel, or the Azdel from the foam and aluminum tube center, or the inner wall panel can delaminate or fall apart.

Zero chance of delamination is far from a fact. Better yes....Bulletproof? Far from it.

A lot of marketing mumbo jumbo for sure and if it sways your purchase decision so be it.

A thing most people do not consider is the method of lamination. Vacuum bonded panels are far better than panels laminated by pinch rolling. Our 2013 Keystone had no delamination but after 3 years you could see every panel joint in the lamination, because Keystone uses pinch rolling. Were in our 3rd season in our 17 Rockwood and I can not see a seam as Rockwood vacuum bonds the panels.

Looked it up. RV Azdel walls have no wood. they are constructed as follows. Fiberglass exterior, Azdel, insulation, Azdel, décor interior. NONE of the pictures showed any wood period. No wood was mentioned in any of the descriptions. In truth. It was specifically noted that there is no wood, luan or other wise in a Azdel wall. You may know what you are talking about. But the construction cut aways, and specs tell a different story.

It was also NOT promised there could be no delamination, But that the chance is drastically reduced. I tried to download a picture, but it wouldn't. However. you can go to www.azdelonboard.com to see the construction of Azdell. This is the wall construction of the Coachmen RVs.