Anyone Install Lithium ion Batteries? Results?

If anyone wants fairly complete information on LFP battery usage, theoretical and actual. The best location is the Sailing and Cruiser Forum. The original thread ran out of storage space at 4000+ posts and they had to start another one. I inquired what had happened and was told that things had begun petering out anyway since those that were convinced had purchased and those interested were lurking (as most of us do when trying to learn). The new thread has some very useful information and "Maine Sailor" has a 10 page write-up on his experiences and readings.

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f14/

Reed and Elaine

reed cundiff wrote:


The only bit of argument I have found amongst users of LFP is whether to go with a BMS or self-monitoring. I may be OCD but not enough to continually mess with a Fluke meter to do this. Those that self monitor seem to agree that the cells should never be above 3.4 V. Serious problems occur when they are allowed to go to maximum of 3.9V. The BMS generally have them absorb to 3.6 V and then float at 3.4 V.

I'm using Outback controllers for my RV lithium battery bank. The manufacturer said to use 14.4 volts to trigger the float mode of 13.6 volts. That seems to keep the battery at about 95% full.

It is scary to self monitor. If you have a weak cell that happens to hit 0 volts, it may distroy that cell by reversing the polarity of it. The system I have came with a battery monitor and solenoids that will shut off all loads if it is over discharged.

Deleted by poster.

I was following the LFP talk at a Liberty Coach thread on this forum and responded that Liberty Coach work with LFP was quite important in our going to LFP. I further noted that the 2000 deep cycles they had trialed without degradation was superb. I was informed that they have continued testing/trialing and are now convinced that the cells they use are good for at least 10 years of daily 80% DOD.I should greatly enjoy being able to read through any reports they may have produced, but these are probably proprietary.

Our older son (who designed and fabricated our system) attended a solar a month symposium ago where it was stated that the costs of LFP will probably drop by 50% within the next few years. I read something on an Aussie forum where it noted Australia is now producing the rare earths required for these cells.

We have had excellent results with our system which is CALB (Chinese Aviaition Lithium Battery) cells fabricated into batteries by Manzanita Micro in Washington. These come with a battery management system (BMS) which is designed for electrical vehicles but has been working quite well. Son went with Mazanita since he has hobbyist friends who are working with EVs and the fact that the smaller Manzanita cells are 65 pounds each. This permitted better placement of the four batteries in our forward "basement" designed to carry an Onan 6 kW generator. Checked with manufacturer (Open Range) and they said that it should hold 400 pounds. Balquon (sic) sells a 9.6 kW 12 V battery pack with BMS for $3500. It weighs 250# (the same as our four battery packs) but it would be far hard to "package" in our 5th wheel and rather darned difficult for a truck camper.

As noted above, our system has all four battery packs in series for a 48 V nominal system.

I would think that two of the 180 amp-hour (12 V nominal) battery packs would be sufficient and make a great 24 V system for a camper trailer.

The only bit of argument I have found amongst users of LFP is whether to go with a BMS or self-monitoring. I may be OCD but not enough to continually mess with a Fluke meter to do this. Those that self monitor seem to agree that the cells should never be above 3.4 V. Serious problems occur when they are allowed to go to maximum of 3.9V. The BMS generally have them absorb to 3.6 V and then float at 3.4 V.

RVTraveltime

Glad you are having good luck with your LFPs. We have likewise have had excellent results (see previous posts). Should not go below 80% depth of discharge (DOD) for long life. We generally run the Dometic refrigerator (a really energy hog) on AC during daylight. Our TriStar monitor shows we are "harvesting" about 4500 W-hrs each day in late October (northern Colorado).

They really do charge up rapidly without the Peukert disadvantages of lead scid.

Reed and Elaine

Last winter I bought lithium ion batteries from Starlight Solar in Yuma.
So far am amazed at how much better they are than my old AGM battery. For a test I turned on the A/C and it ran perfect until I turned it off. I couldnt do that with my other battery, voltage goes too low and inverter would not start it. The voltage never goes below 13.1 on these batteries until they are almost empty. Another thing is it charges almost twice as fast from my solar panels(about 1500 watt).

The price was high, about $3200 for 360Ah but that also include battery monitor in the RV and some other work and parts. The battery monitor can be hooked to your TV set and has a seperate display I put on the dash. Lifeline battery was going to be $1900 with battery monitor. These should last me over 10 years as I only use about 150AH per night.

Starlight Solar lithium battery

hbski wrote:

skipro3 wrote:

hbski wrote:
Seems you could currently get some for cheap if you have the space and wt allotment for them


1000Ah cell $750 ea

There isn't any details on that battery. Heck, doesn't even say it's 12 volts or not.

It's a standard LiFePO4 cell 3.2V @ 1000Ah....you need 4 to make a 1000Ah 12v pack....$3/Ah which is ridiculously cheap for these batteries....was just posting it up in case anyone following the thread was interested in that sort of thing....too much volume and weight for my app.

AND, BTW, not pushing, selling or in any other way associated with this company...check my profile....been here for a while.....was trying to pass on a good deal for someone that these would possibly work for because if you were in the market for some 1000 Ah cells this is a raging deal.

free radical wrote:
FWIW
Evwest,the electric car converters have these available

http://www.evwest.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=4&osCsid=ji51nlmfstcpug4cnjdfom0h83

some of those are getting in line with price for sure....however, have to be careful to figure delivered cost as some vendors will provide cost @ FOb....in other words that WOULD be the cost if you could pick it up in china......not saying that's what these are....just seen many advertised that way

skipro3 wrote:

hbski wrote:
Seems you could currently get some for cheap if you have the space and wt allotment for them


1000Ah cell $750 ea

There isn't any details on that battery. Heck, doesn't even say it's 12 volts or not.

It's a standard LiFePO4 cell 3.2V @ 1000Ah....you need 4 to make a 1000Ah 12v pack....$3/Ah which is ridiculously cheap for these batteries....was just posting it up in case anyone following the thread was interested in that sort of thing....too much volume and weight for my app.

FWIW
Evwest,the electric car converters have these available

http://www.evwest.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=4&osCsid=ji51nlmfstcpug4cnjdfom0h83