Are You Buying All These Half-ton Claims?

BenK wrote:
Many times it boils down to what an OP *wants* to hear

Then they call advisors a derogatory: "The Weight Police", in order to put down
what they didn't want to hear

Many don't understand the difference between 'can do' vs 'should do'

The 'half ton' of today used to be the 3/4 or 1 ton of bygone eras. What has NOT
changed are their GVWR's

Betcha the percentages between 'half ton' vs the higher class TV's is something
like 80/20, or even higher

So the OEM demographicers are smack on target with their marketing of 'half ton'
as the main pickup/SUV offerings

Ditto the OEM marketing numbers to the public. They know that most all will NOT
read the fine print, and if do, won't understand the ramifications...so they
will normally take the MTWR as an absolute....we read that here most all the time

Well said, Ben!!!

cekkk wrote:

Buck50HD wrote:
Many also think that their 10 or 15 year old 3/4 and 1-tons are equivalent to a 2014 model.:S

I'm sure not one of them. I really like my truck, a lot. But as far as comparing it to today's trucks, that would be foolish. It is far and a way ahead of the new F350Ds in one respect - It's paid for! :B

So why is it that some people insist on having the same standard for current 1/2 tons, as they did 10, 15, or 20 years ago?

The braking systems, metallurgy of the chassis, suspension (not just in load carrying, but overall control), electronic aids, and power train, is vastly superior.

Can we not say a modern 1/2 ton can easily control a bigger trailer than a mid 90's model? Especially considering the weight and wheelbase can be higher than some 3/4 ton models back then...

RoyJ wrote:
These arguments never end.

What defines something as a "1/2 ton", "3/4 ton", or "1 ton"? There's no Holy Book of Engineering that says past a certain frame thickness and/or cross section you're into "2500 territory".

Take a 1970s 3/4 ton, I'm willing to bet a modern 1/2 ton beats it in nearly every category.

I like to look at hard facts, such as F/R GAWR, GVW, payload, and drivetrain (power, gradability and startability). If a truck meets those specs, what difference does the badge on the door make?

If you are talking about payload, the modern half tons are not even in the same hemisphere as most 70's 3/4 ton trucks. I am considering purchasing a '76 F-250 Super Cab from a friend. I do not NEED a second truck, but it has character, and is calling my name. :B It is a 2 wheel drive long bed (155"wb) Camper Special, 390 4V, no A/C. the Title shows unladen weight at 4,400 lbs. GVW is 8,100 lbs. Payload would be 3,700 lbs. He is not sure if both tanks were full when he had it weighed, but one was full for sure. It has dual batteries, and front and rear stabilizer bars, as well as a factory helper leaf on the rear springs. Camper Specials also have doubled frame sections to handle increased loads, such as slide in campers. This truck's payload is approximately 2 1/2 to 3 times as much as most modern half ton trucks. Trailer tow ratings do differ a lot with the modern trucks, though. Back then, three quarter ton trucks had tow ratings around 7,500 to 8,500 lbs, and one ton dually's were rated for 10,000 lbs. towing capacity. Half ton trucks of the day normally had 6,000 lb. or lower tow ratings, but some could go as high as 7,000 when equipped with certain factory heavy duty options. A 3,000 lb. plus payload rating was the norm for a three quarter ton pickup in the 70's.

brulaz

Amazing, You can get into a xlt 4x4 f550 cheaper than the f 250 lariats.

IdaD wrote:

spoon059 wrote:

Gr8life wrote:
A pickup with 10,000 pound gvwr only costs a little more than one with a 7,500 pound rating and will tow the same trailer better. I did not say the 7,500 pound model was worthless, dangerous, or inadequate. There are lots of reasons to choose the various models.

In my research, I was able to buy my Tundra for about $7000 less than a relatively base 3/4 ton truck at the time. That is over 20% higher cost and would have been more money than I was comfortable spending.

As it sits now, my Tundra has sufficient payload, rear axle, tow capacity and tire capacity to handle my current trailer and my next trailer needs.

To save $7000 and still have a vehicle that meets my needs is a no-brainer to me. I never once suggested that a 3/4 ton or heavier truck WOULDN'T meet my needs, but it sure seems that you suggested that a half ton doesn't meet the needs of anyone towing.

Did you buy new and what did you pay? If you don't mind sharing, anyway.

Right now in my area I could get a Ram 6.4 for around $32k and a Ram CTD for around $37k. These are basic Tradesman models, but the essentials are there - 4wd, cloth seats, AC, keyless, power windows/doors, etc. Add maybe $1000 to make it a 3500.

I doubt I could get a Tundra for much less, and I doubt a Tundra is any easier on gas than the 6.4.

Same experience as spoon around here. About Can$7-8K premium for similarly equipped F250, versus an EcoB F150 with HD payload. The difference in payload my be 300#. The $$ difference is higher if you eliminate the HD Payload option, but then so is the payload diff.

This is where I compare. They're a high volume dealer with reasonable prices for Ontario:
Hanna Ford's Inventory

It just seems reasonable to me that you pay more for a heavier duty, more capable truck. And I would be willing to pay the premium if I needed it. But right now I'm just at the "thinkin and watchin" stage.

As for RAM HDs, the ones I've seen tend to be 2-4K higher than
F250's at Hanna, similarly equipped. I might be able to use Hanna Ford's numbers to argue them down some. But Rams just don't sell in the volumes that Fords do in Ontario.

I am glad that you are happy with your Toyota. I have towed with a wide variety of vehicles and repeat that the higher gvwr units towed the same trailer better than lesser models. That does not mean your Tundra is an inadequate vehicle. Hitch up your trailer to a buddie's F-250 or 2500 and you will get it. The difference may only be from a nine to a ten, but there will be an improvement.

spoon059 wrote:

Gr8life wrote:
A pickup with 10,000 pound gvwr only costs a little more than one with a 7,500 pound rating and will tow the same trailer better. I did not say the 7,500 pound model was worthless, dangerous, or inadequate. There are lots of reasons to choose the various models.

In my research, I was able to buy my Tundra for about $7000 less than a relatively base 3/4 ton truck at the time. That is over 20% higher cost and would have been more money than I was comfortable spending.

As it sits now, my Tundra has sufficient payload, rear axle, tow capacity and tire capacity to handle my current trailer and my next trailer needs.

To save $7000 and still have a vehicle that meets my needs is a no-brainer to me. I never once suggested that a 3/4 ton or heavier truck WOULDN'T meet my needs, but it sure seems that you suggested that a half ton doesn't meet the needs of anyone towing.

Did you buy new and what did you pay? If you don't mind sharing, anyway.

Right now in my area I could get a Ram 6.4 for around $32k and a Ram CTD for around $37k. These are basic Tradesman models, but the essentials are there - 4wd, cloth seats, AC, keyless, power windows/doors, etc. Add maybe $1000 to make it a 3500.

I doubt I could get a Tundra for much less, and I doubt a Tundra is any easier on gas than the 6.4.

Gr8life wrote:
A pickup with 10,000 pound gvwr only costs a little more than one with a 7,500 pound rating and will tow the same trailer better. I did not say the 7,500 pound model was worthless, dangerous, or inadequate. There are lots of reasons to choose the various models.

In my research, I was able to buy my Tundra for about $7000 less than a relatively base 3/4 ton truck at the time. That is over 20% higher cost and would have been more money than I was comfortable spending.

As it sits now, my Tundra has sufficient payload, rear axle, tow capacity and tire capacity to handle my current trailer and my next trailer needs.

To save $7000 and still have a vehicle that meets my needs is a no-brainer to me. I never once suggested that a 3/4 ton or heavier truck WOULDN'T meet my needs, but it sure seems that you suggested that a half ton doesn't meet the needs of anyone towing.

8iron wrote:

spoon059 wrote:
..Then you have the guys that spell the work(sp?) TOW as TOE and BRAKES as BREAKS and then you really have to question the intelligence of someone who doesn't know the appendage on their foot from the act of dragging another vehicle behind them...

Luckily, not everyone judges intelligence by their spelling on Internet forums. Work or word, we know what you meant.

Boom... you got me on that one =)! That was, however, a simple one time mistake. The references that I mentioned are repeated ad nauseam by those posters.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Yep - 50plus grand is a little hard to want to spend......