SoundGuy wrote:
Thanks for your detailed reply. Now that there's just 2 of us I do from time to time give some thought as to whether I really need my Silverado vs a somewhat smaller, more fuel efficient vehicle like the Honda Ridgeline. My wife has an '06 Civic and with the usual regular maintenance required for any vehicle all we do is put gas in it (not much) and drive it - dead reliable. :B However, the question remains - what would I gain? Honda claims 26/19 mpg for the current generation of Ridgeline and if I could actually believe it that 25% improvement over my Silverado might in itself be sufficient justification, especially here in Canada where our fuel costs average 30% higher than in the US. Fuel cost when towing isn't my concern but rather the significant annual cost for fuel when not towing - thousands $$$$$ every year. :E I really like driving a 1/2 ton, the interior space it provides, and of course how easily it tows our 192RBS. :B However, your fuel mileage numbers tell me what I've always believed - your V6 Ridgeline is working a lot harder than my V8 Silverado pulling a 192RBS, despite the fact that some of that extra 5.3L GM engine grunt is being used to push along a much heavier vehicle. EPA numbers for the Ridgeline (not towing) are to me the main attraction but in the real world I question whether it really comes anywhere near close to those numbers. :h
Guys, we are dangerously close to hijacking the OP's thread, so Mods - perhaps if you want - maybe move this over to Tow Vehicles . . .
That said, your analysis is sort of what we've done re. fuel efficiency and how much of a driver that might be in changing vehicles. Keep in mind a couple of base line factors: (1) Your best comparison to mpg efficiency is to the current, "Gen 2" Ridgeline released beginning as a 2017 model - not my older version, "Gen 1" Ridgeline; the Gen 2 has even slightly more interior space than my truck, and mine even sits 5 adults comfortably; its drivetrain is improved with a 6-speed (vs. my 5-speed) and engine has increased its power by 30 hp (now 280) over mine and a very modest torque increase (only 15) to 262 lb/ft.; the AWD trims have a much improved torque vectoring system and still come with a transmission cooler and wiring harness ready to receive your choice of an electronic brake controller (we use a Tekonsha Primus on our truck). The Ridgeline Owners Club forum (ridgelineownersclub.com) shows lots of your fellow Canadians now own them. I haven't found anyone from up your way unhappy with the Ridgeline.
(2) And yes, to state the obvious, of course our V6 is going to "work a lot harder" than your V8. However, remember that the Ridgeline was designed to do this kind of work in a mid-size package. It's drivetrain (I'm talking about my Gen 1, 2011 model now) operates comfortably within its design limits. I set the cruise control to 60-61 mph and let the engineering and technology of the truck do its thing. Of course it will shift to adjust to the operating environment, but the mpgs we achieve with our truck are largely experienced under cruise control. But then again, there are other times that I will manually "feather" the throttle to better manage circumstances. With that said, I have tracked the towing experiences with a number of Gen 2 Ridgeline owners who tow similar loads as we do, and they experience about 3-4 mpg better than we do with our 2011. Is that significant enough to amortize the increased $$ to purchase a new Ridgeline? Well, now you get back to qualitative factors that focus on some of the unique features of the Ridgeline vs. traditional designs (whether other mid-size or 1/2 tons). How much are those worth to someone? Your call. I guess go test drive one and let us know what you think.
SoundGuy wrote:
The fact you're able to tow without weight distribution has me mystified as there's no way I could with my Silverado ... 625 lbs of gross tongue weight just unloads the truck's front steer axle far too much. :E I typically average ~ 13% gross tongue weight but in fact have tried everything I can to increase that just a bit more, the problem being that fully loaded fridge at the far rear of the trailer really counters my efforts. A full black tank on the way home also exacerbates the situation, 'though by that time the fridge contains far less so that does help. In your case, running just 10 to 11% gross tongue weight is awfully low, especially without the use of weight distribution. So - we have essentially the same trailer, typically averaging about the same gross weight (4600 to 4800 lbs) yet you're running significantly less gross tongue weight. Loading as I do I don't see any way I could run that little even if I wanted to and 2) if I did I have little doubt I'd be all over the road when towing at highway speed. I'm mystified. :W
I don't have a Ph.D. in Vehicle Dynamics, so all I can offer you is my own analysis that I've shared previously in other threads - plus my experience. Assuming that we are all rational people and want to have fun in this hobby while maintaining the highest in safety standards :B , I can just honestly tell you that our configuration has been as solid as can be when we camp with the weight ranges I've stated. Perhaps it is a combination of factors . . . though the Ridgeline has a uni-body design, our Gen 1 version has an extremely stiff and strong ladder frame with seven cross members that are welded to the truck's body. It just doesn't twist or torque when under a load. (The Gen 2 version's frame and body is even significantly stronger than mine, so that's the one you would probably seek as a comparison.) But if you don't take my word for it (not saying you don't - it's just always good to get all the objective evidence you can) - how about my friend who followed us last week in his Class C? We had a 288 mile run to Garner State Park with prevailing, modest crosswinds from the south at 12-14 mph. Kind of standard stuff here in Texas. Running westbound on I-10 between Houston and San Antonio in the midst of heavy semi traffic passing us and us passing others - plus the cars, SUVs and other trucks passing us at 70+mph - he rang me up from behind and said (unsolicited) "sure looks like your rig tracks really well; no wiggle or sway with all of this traffic going on." (That's almost an exact quote, but hey, it was last Wednesday and I can't remember what I had for breakfast this morning!)
Do I feel semis going by or by me passing them? Certainly, there is a very small sensation. And occasionally you will have a greater sensation depending on the aerodynamics of the passing truck. But I have absolutely never felt nervous, threatened, out of control nor that we are all going to die! ;)
I will give you a caveat to this based on your comment about how you run toward home; i.e. with a full black tank. We do not run that way, but when I have had a lot of material in our black or gray tank while towing I can feel the difference. THAT is when a good WDH would solve that problem, but we just never have the need to travel that way with our style of camping. Some Ridgeline owners employ them and others do not. As always, there is a great debate on this topic. Our Gen 1 manual did not recommend the use of one since the truck was designed to tow well without a WDH, and "an improperly adjusted WDH . . ." can seriously affect braking and handling, etc, etc. etc. We have been totally fine without a WDH, but other Gen 1 owners wouldn't leave home without one! The Gen 2 manual does not have the same caution as my owner's manual, so again, some Ridgeline owners use one and others do not.
We test drove a 2017 Black Edition trim (tops in the US version), and the dealer offered me the opportunity to bring my trailer over and hitch it up for a test run. I didn't do it since we were not ready for a buying decision, but maybe that's the pathway for you. Head to a Honda dealer and tell them that towing behavior is the critical decision point and see what they say.
Meanwhile, next April we are headed to the Midwest (Illinois and perhaps eastward to Indiana and Ohio) to see friends and enjoy some of the historical sites in our nation's original Northwest Territory. So if we run over as far as eastern Ohio, why don't you drop down from Ontario and meet up with us at a park of your choice. I'll toss you the keys to our truck and let you go have a run where ever you want while doing a test tow! Might be fun to compare our 192 RBS rigs, anyhow. Maybe by then I will have made that 12V wiring run from the vent over our bed to the TV booster power so that I can put in a fan and pwm controller. If not, bring your tool box! :W
