Forum Discussion

Wolfrequiem's avatar
Wolfrequiem
Explorer
Oct 30, 2017

Dayton Fayette Axle Identification and Questions

Hello, All,

I just purchased a 20' camper frame from the 1970's to build a tiny house on (the deck actually measures 18' 6", but I think they listed it as 20'). I live in an older Terry fifth wheel now and that is getting old during winter, so I'm hoping to build myself something--as/if funds allow--to do a little better. The camper frame has the Dayton Fayette axles and heavy duty suspension. The hubs are stamped 5-1-70, and they have the 10" brake drums, with brakes on *both* axles... and I'm desperate for some help identifying the axle rating and scoring a few part numbers, as well, if any of you can help me.

The first question, then, is what are the axles rated at?

The diameter of the axle and spindle are slightly more than is typical for 3500lb axles (the 2 3/8" and 1.719" normally quoted numbers--my axle is 2 3/4", or a hair more, and my spindle is 1.732", as best I can tell, on both), and, having read that some of the older models were actually rated at 4100lb, I'm wondering if these are (I need to know before I build on it, is why I ask). To add to the confusion, I've also read that some 5200lb axles actually measure in at the 2 3/8" diameter range too, so I don't know what to assume I have. With the heavy suspension and it being older, I'm thinking more than 3500lb, but can't be sure, if you could help me identify the rating. The coupler, if it matters, is a Marvel Class 3 unit.

The shocks I am getting/that I think will work are the Lippert LC283280. At least, I'm hoping those work.

Second, the trailer is missing four of the tapered 60° 1/2-20 bolts for the hubs, and I'm struggling to find replacements. I've searched and found the various places that sell the bolts of this type that are often linked in the forums, but they sell them with a *fine* thread, and I need *coarse," RH. Anybody know where four could be scored? And a salvage yard is fine.

Last, is there a PDF with the brake diagram on it, so that I can compare to see what might be missing? There are no lights at present, and the brakes have been cut, but I'm going to buy some lights and a harness and rewire it all, and need to know what to look for on the brakes when I inspect them, to know what needs to be replaced. Or if there are just some general things you know of—at first glance, they all seem to be there, though one scrubs when one wheel turns. I am told Dexter makes replacement parts, and have contacted them, but they're not proving very helpful. (Also, my idea of testing them is to wire the trailer, then hook it up to the truck, jacking up each tire or axle and spinning it while someone engages the brakes, to see, first, if it stops the tire and, second, if it releases it; does that sound like an appropriate method for testing them?)
And do any of you know the style or replacement part numbers with Dexter for them?

Anyway, any part references you can give on the bushings or seals or anything, please feel free. Anything you can link me to would be awesome, as well, shematics-wise, etc. I have ordered some seals already that I think will work, and have a shock in mind I'm going to try, as well, but am not sure about Class D or E on tires to order them. As for swapping the axles out--I don't have funds for that with all that I'm in for already, but, given how few times the thing will be on the road, would just as soon not spend the money on it. I mean, I may move it twice in my life, if that.

I am adding photos. I'm not sure if you can see it from the pictures, but the two wheeled axles are connected to that third axle between them, which is hooked to those bumpers between the wheels. It's weird, or, at least, I've never seen it before, but it looks heavy duty.

The main thing is, I'm not even sure what the devil I have or what you would call that suspension to even search for stuff on it. "Dayton Fayette" I can do, of course, not that that is helping any.

Thanks, in advance,
Gary









  • Wolfrequiem's avatar
    Wolfrequiem
    Explorer
    Oct 31, 2017
    Thanks, Westwood.

    I was definitely going to go with a terminal strip/box. I'm not sure about the "star" scheme difference you mention and will need to research it to know what to do.

    My last trailer was converted into a car hauler--it had the benefit of a wider berth between the tires than this one--and I had the same experience you're intimating, as far as the ride, and did not use a WDH on it. The trick is, though, I kept my speeds down, too; I don't know what I'd have experienced doing 70 mph. It was great up to 65 mph, though, and, unlike this one, I was all up and down the highway at 140miles one-way with that one.

    Right now, I just ordered the last lug from Vintage and I'm in $28 on those four. I have found four shocks for $160 (Lippert, from eTrailer), and four tires, class D, speed rating M, for $200, plus the install. Add to that $40 in paint, primer and sanding pads, a new jack and jack shoe for $32, and I'm pretty stoked and pretty set.

    Oh, and I am replacing the inner seals--that was $10 (the bearings and races were all great, though in need of a going over with 2000 grit on a couple of the races where the bearings had sat on them).

    I'll have to do some work on the brakes, like adding two refractor springs, but that *seems* to be it, as they seem to all be there (mostly), and seem to be in good shape, until I test them (I haven't completely gone over the magnets, yet, though). And then the wiring and lights, which, going the route we're talking looks like another $100).

    One wheel does scrub some. I'm not sure about what that might involve, but we'll see.

    So, $470, at present, with another $100 and perhaps some sundries to go, plus $48 to mount the tires, and that should mostly do it. I'm stoked. (I only paid $450 for the trailer, which I thought was pretty great for the beefed up frame.)

    And the frame is solid/sturdy.

    Man, I'm getting excited--I want to have it framed before January, which is doable if I stay about where I am and penny pinch in the meantime. :D I'm broke for now, though, and don't even have it for the wiring harness yet. lol Next week, hopefully. (We'll see on the axles on down the road... if you all will pardon the pun.)
  • westend's avatar
    westend
    Explorer
    Oct 31, 2017
    I have a '71, 22' length, torsion axles, and Dexter 4 bolt rims. It rides on Carlisle 15" RH Trail Load D. It rides like an extension of the truck, even without a WDH. I topped out around 6K lbs. With that dual-beam suspension, make sure your frame is really good. If adding lumber, weight goes up fast.

    I'd pretty much suggest, like others, to start saving for new axles. BTW, also suggest to wire your brakes in a "star" scheme instead of the typical "daisy chain". For the extra $10 in wire, it is a big improvement and, if you lead all your brake wires to a terminal strip, it makes diagnosis of any trouble, much easier.

    If Etrailer doesn't sell the lug bolts, a fastener distributor can get them for you.
  • Gdetrailer's avatar
    Gdetrailer
    Explorer III
    Oct 31, 2017
    Wolfrequiem wrote:
    I'm going to sing a Pink Floyd song to you on that one...

    "Money... get back, I'm all right, Jack, keep your hands off of my stack... Money, it's a hit." ;)

    I'm glad all you rich upper crust types don't have to worry about these things like we poor working stiffs. :)

    (I do honestly appreciate the advice, however, don't think I don't. Turns out Fayette is still in business and actually still selling parts for them in some cases, however. I do agree they are typically comprised of Unobtanium, however, though not as much as we thought, evidently.)

    http://www.fayettedistribution.com/default.asp

    For posterity and anyone that tunes in later looking for information: These 2 3/4" axles, with the 1.732" spindles, are 4400lb axles. Hooray! I was wanting that most of all. I have brakes on both, which is what made me think it.

    If Fayette cannot supply what someone needs, Redneck Trailers or Vintage Camper Sales might. In fact, on the latter, which sells both the right and left handed bolts, depending upon availability, plus various other brake parts, etc. I actually scored 3 RH bolts earlier today, at 5$ each. It's all they had. The left-handed go for $15.

    I've got them looking for me another, as well as some of the refractor springs on the brakes, after which, I think I'm good to go... until funds allow for a swap on the hubs, which actually may be sooner than I had suspected. Turns out there are some easy swaps for them without much more hassle, though they "ain't cheap," either. :)

    The rest, given how slowly I drive under something like this, how much under weight I'll come in at, and with some stabilizer bars, the rest shouldn't be too hateful, given--again--how little it will ever be on the road. I had an old one once before, so I'm not completely unfamiliar with those aspects of it--over 60mph, it gets hairy; under, I sailed, usually, and behind a 79 Sierra inline six.

    Thanks, again, to everyone.


    Your money, waste it if you wish..

    Someday, regret it when things goes sideways.

    For the record, I am NOT "made of money".

    However, my Dad taught me well in mechanics, electrical, plumbing and many other trades and my Mom, taught me well in saving money..

    All of the above wisdom has served me well, allowing me to save by doing things myself without trapping myself into a money pit..

    Fall into the pit if you wish, don't grumble to me later on down the road when your unobtainium luck runs out.

    You are just a another fool playing games shooting messengers here when they don't give you the answers you wish to hear.. I will further ignore your requests for help :B
  • Wolfrequiem's avatar
    Wolfrequiem
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2017
    I'm going to sing a Pink Floyd song to you on that one...

    "Money... get back, I'm all right, Jack, keep your hands off of my stack... Money, it's a hit." ;)

    I'm glad all you rich upper crust types don't have to worry about these things like we poor working stiffs. :)

    (I do honestly appreciate the advice, however, don't think I don't. Turns out Fayette is still in business and actually still selling parts for them in some cases, however. I do agree they are typically comprised of Unobtanium, however, though not as much as we thought, evidently.)

    http://www.fayettedistribution.com/default.asp

    For posterity and anyone that tunes in later looking for information: These 2 3/4" axles, with the 1.732" spindles, are 4400lb axles. Hooray! I was wanting that most of all. I have brakes on both, which is what made me think it.

    If Fayette cannot supply what someone needs, Redneck Trailers or Vintage Camper Sales might. In fact, on the latter, which sells both the right and left handed bolts, depending upon availability, plus various other brake parts, etc. I actually scored 3 RH bolts earlier today, at 5$ each. It's all they had. The left-handed go for $15.

    I've got them looking for me another, as well as some of the refractor springs on the brakes, after which, I think I'm good to go... until funds allow for a swap on the hubs, which actually may be sooner than I had suspected. Turns out there are some easy swaps for them without much more hassle, though they "ain't cheap," either. :)

    The rest, given how slowly I drive under something like this, how much under weight I'll come in at, and with some stabilizer bars, the rest shouldn't be too hateful, given--again--how little it will ever be on the road. I had an old one once before, so I'm not completely unfamiliar with those aspects of it--over 60mph, it gets hairy; under, I sailed, usually, and behind a 79 Sierra inline six.

    Thanks, again, to everyone.
  • Gdetrailer's avatar
    Gdetrailer
    Explorer III
    Oct 30, 2017
    Wolfrequiem wrote:
    I'm not sure why everyone is ignoring my caveat: Such measures are too expensive for me to afford, especially if you look at the photos and see what all would be involved in pulling the old hardware off, e.g., I don't weld or have access to a cutting torch without having to pay the premium for that, too. It's not just a matter of swapping something out, as on a newer model. The hubs I'm probably in for, but the axles I'm stuck with. Too, given that this thing won't be on the road probably but twice or maybe three times as long as I have it, the benefit-cost analysis makes doing anything more than necessary a waste. Thanks for the advice, though.


    You are not listening to GOOD advice.

    Dayton Fayette axle parts are made of "Unobtainium", they are obsolete and out of production.

    The bolts you seek are rarer then "hens Teeth" and if I remember correctly one side uses LEFT HAND THREADS and those bolts pretty much are non existent the last time I tried searching for a poster on this forum..

    You can find the rims, but they are costing $150 each now days USED WHEN YOU CAN FIND THEM FOR SALE and you will need 5 of them so you have a spare..

    IF it was a DEXTER axle with the star rims you may have had some luck in calling Dexter to get a cross reference to a modern axle (which is what I was able to do) in order to cross to modern Ford 5 on 4.5 drum pattern (3500 lb axle).

    Now, if you REALLY insist on doing it the hard way, you could buy the newer 5 bolt drums, then take the bearings from you old drum and go to a bearing shop and see if they can match a bearing with proper sizes..

    BUT, you still have one more hurdle to deal with..

    The axle stub length..

    This one will have to be carefully measured and will need to MATCH EXACTLY but you have no real way to do this without either another axle stub or using the new drum with a test fit to see if it will come close..

    Now, perhaps if you have the energy left you might be able to build your "tiny house"..

    But I will toss an additional bomb into your idea..

    Your trailer does not have SPRINGS..

    It uses a "teeter totter" design and shocks to stabilize the teeter totter..

    That is a less than ideal setup and most likely will cause a lot of grief in towing stability and comfort..

    Listen to folks, scrap the axles and I would suggest the teeter totter suspension. New axles plus new springs and if you want shocks you could add them in also.

    Do it right the first time rather than half way then regret the half way and then try to fix after the fact.

    Scrapping the old axles and replacing with new will get you new brakes and new drums..

    A pair of drums now days will cost you about $150 and you will need two pairs..

    If you don't have the rims they will cost you $750 IF you are lucky to find them..

    New Ford 5 on 4.5 pattern rims can be bought new starting at $40 each..
  • Wolfrequiem's avatar
    Wolfrequiem
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2017
    I'm not sure why everyone is ignoring my caveat: Such measures are too expensive for me to afford, especially if you look at the photos and see what all would be involved in pulling the old hardware off, e.g., I don't weld or have access to a cutting torch without having to pay the premium for that, too. It's not just a matter of swapping something out, as on a newer model. The hubs I'm probably in for, but the axles I'm stuck with. Too, given that this thing won't be on the road probably but twice or maybe three times as long as I have it, the benefit-cost analysis makes doing anything more than necessary a waste. Thanks for the advice, though.
  • DownTheAvenue's avatar
    DownTheAvenue
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2017
    Finding parts for anything almost 50 years old can be problematic,and if you even locate parts, they will be expensive. Replace with current production axles and be done with it. If you think the costs for new axles is expensive, just wait until you have a breakdown on the road with those obsolete axles!
  • Ralph_Cramden's avatar
    Ralph_Cramden
    Explorer II
    Oct 30, 2017
    Old-Biscuit wrote:
    Instead of trying to rebuild those OLD axles/Brakes with parts that are obsolete/hard if not impossible to find........buy a couple of NEW 5200# axle with electric brake assemblies and be done with it


    X2 and I'd go a step further by throwing some Dexter Torflex axles on and eliminating shocks and springs entirely. Either #11 @ 6K rating or even #12 (7K) or #D13 (8K).
  • Wolfrequiem's avatar
    Wolfrequiem
    Explorer
    Oct 30, 2017
    Well, like I was saying, that's too expensive an option at this point, or, at least, given the $700 dollars, etc., I'm seeing them go for. Too, the suspension on this thing is the issue: New axles would mean me having to trade out the suspension too, at least, IF what Dexter is telling me is legit (they are trying to upsale me, so I only half trust them).

    Thanks for the reply.
  • Old-Biscuit's avatar
    Old-Biscuit
    Explorer III
    Oct 30, 2017
    Instead of trying to rebuild those OLD axles/Brakes with parts that are obsolete/hard if not impossible to find........buy a couple of NEW 5200# axle with electric brake assemblies and be done with it


    But if you gotta have them call these folks. They use to have lots of axle parts etc
    Mouser Steel Supply at (573) 866-2979.

About Travel Trailer Group

44,029 PostsLatest Activity: Jan 28, 2025