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?","id":"message:2718201","revisionNum":1,"repliesCount":143,"author":{"__ref":"User:user:44616"},"depth":0,"hasGivenKudo":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TravelTrailerforum-board"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:2718201"},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718201"},"body":"Interesting article about an electric Class 7 truck .
Begs the question, are electric powered heavy duty pickups...ready for HD towing service... far behind ?
Range right now is somewhat limited, but where will it be in 5, 10, 15 years ?
Bedlam wrote: When you read about these electrics, I wonder how many are tied to the grid verses being battery or fuel cell powered. Even our bus trolleys have battery packs to allow the driver to move it back under the lines if he has go around an obstruction and loses connection with the lines.
Yeah, pure electric on cantenary systems are easy to do.
Worked on a light rail project recently and there were a couple of overpasses,they had to get under, so the specs were adjusted so there was enough battery power to go about 1/4 mile. The cantenary lines ended a little ways before the bridge and picked up shortly after. The pickup automatically lowered as they approached the bridge and went up once clear.
Almost a pure electric-hybrid.
Actually, cantenary lines for buses with the option for trucks to share could be a good implementation approach. Getting a pure electric delivery truck with sufficient range is tough but you can justify running the cantenary for bus system as the routes tend to be fixed. Once built letting delivery trucks use the lines would be fairly simple and would allow for significant range extension as I'm sure a lot of the truck routes will parallel bus routes. Unlike with charging stations, the truck keeps doing it's job while charging and while I don't know the specs, I'm sure they put out some pretty good power, so probably can charge while running the truck.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2017-09-11T08:24:26.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2017-09-11T08:24:26.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":447},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:TravelTrailer/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:TravelTrailerforum-board/message:2718201/message:2718333","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"1478","rawBody":"
Bedlam wrote: When you read about these electrics, I wonder how many are tied to the grid verses being battery or fuel cell powered. Even our bus trolleys have battery packs to allow the driver to move it back under the lines if he has go around an obstruction and loses connection with the lines.
Yeah, pure electric on cantenary systems are easy to do.
Worked on a light rail project recently and there were a couple of overpasses,they had to get under, so the specs were adjusted so there was enough battery power to go about 1/4 mile. The cantenary lines ended a little ways before the bridge and picked up shortly after. The pickup automatically lowered as they approached the bridge and went up once clear.
Almost a pure electric-hybrid.
Actually, cantenary lines for buses with the option for trucks to share could be a good implementation approach. Getting a pure electric delivery truck with sufficient range is tough but you can justify running the cantenary for bus system as the routes tend to be fixed. Once built letting delivery trucks use the lines would be fairly simple and would allow for significant range extension as I'm sure a lot of the truck routes will parallel bus routes. Unlike with charging stations, the truck keeps doing it's job while charging and while I don't know the specs, I'm sure they put out some pretty good power, so probably can charge while running the truck.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:2718333_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"User:user:273255":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:273255","uid":273255,"login":"John___Angela","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2003-02-18T16:50:42.000-08:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.goodsam.com/t5/s/feyqc97479/m_assets/avatars/default/avatar-2.svg?time=1737155183000"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:42"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:feyqc97479/user:273255"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718332":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:2718332","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:2718332":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:273255"},"id":"message:2718332","revisionNum":1,"uid":2718332,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TravelTrailerforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:2718201"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:2718201"},"subject":"Re: Electric truck - tow vehicle of future ?","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718332"},"body":"
Bedlam wrote: When you read about these electrics, I wonder how many are tied to the grid verses being battery or fuel cell powered. Even our bus trolleys have battery packs to allow the driver to move it back under the lines if he has go around an obstruction and loses connection with the lines.
Most of the units I have read about or watched videos on are are stand alone. Anywhere from 125 to 300 KWh. Kinda cool.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2017-09-11T07:10:14.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2017-09-11T07:10:14.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":447},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:TravelTrailer/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:TravelTrailerforum-board/message:2718201/message:2718332","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"458","rawBody":"
Bedlam wrote: When you read about these electrics, I wonder how many are tied to the grid verses being battery or fuel cell powered. Even our bus trolleys have battery packs to allow the driver to move it back under the lines if he has go around an obstruction and loses connection with the lines.
Most of the units I have read about or watched videos on are are stand alone. Anywhere from 125 to 300 KWh. Kinda cool.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:2718332_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"Rank:rank:49":{"__typename":"Rank","id":"rank:49","position":1,"name":"Moderator","color":"333333","icon":null,"rankStyle":"TEXT"},"User:user:1659":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:1659","uid":1659,"login":"Bedlam","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2012-06-13T11:02:40.000-07:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.goodsam.com/t5/s/feyqc97479/images/dS0xNjU5LTM3aTkxM0RCQzAxNDMxNTcxRjQ"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:49"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:feyqc97479/user:1659"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718331":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:2718331","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:2718331":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:1659"},"id":"message:2718331","revisionNum":1,"uid":2718331,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TravelTrailerforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:2718201"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:2718201"},"subject":"Re: Electric truck - tow vehicle of future ?","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718331"},"body":"When you read about these electrics, I wonder how many are tied to the grid verses being battery or fuel cell powered. Even our bus trolleys have battery packs to allow the driver to move it back under the lines if he has go around an obstruction and loses connection with the lines.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2017-09-11T06:24:06.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2017-09-11T06:24:06.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":447},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:TravelTrailer/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:TravelTrailerforum-board/message:2718201/message:2718331","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"283","rawBody":"When you read about these electrics, I wonder how many are tied to the grid verses being battery or fuel cell powered. Even our bus trolleys have battery packs to allow the driver to move it back under the lines if he has go around an obstruction and loses connection with the lines.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:2718331_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718330":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:2718330","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:2718330":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:273255"},"id":"message:2718330","revisionNum":1,"uid":2718330,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TravelTrailerforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:2718201"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:2718201"},"subject":"Re: Electric truck - tow vehicle of future ?","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718330"},"body":"
valhalla360 wrote:
John & Angela wrote:
Good morning. Nope. I'm talking full electric. I think the last two announcements I noticed were San Diego and Edmonton. Can't remember the rest but on one of the EV forums I follow there have been quite a few stories of various cities in the world making the switch.
Large scale installations or a few test units?
I do a little work with transit (not bus purchase but telematics on them) and hybrid is pretty much become the standard as it's a minimal cost difference and produces big results. Outside test cases and some small scale specialty uses haven't seen any large scale pure electrics.
Good morning. Well I don't much about this kinda thing. Just what I read on various medias, but when I read about cities replacing some or all of their fleets with electrics I would think it is past the proof of concept phase. I would be interested in seeing how the numbers wash out though. Many of the cities using the new technology are overseas but there are a dozen or so in North America as well. One of the manufacturers are not too far from me in Burnaby but many are in China as well.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"207","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2017-09-11T06:15:03.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2017-09-11T06:15:03.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":225},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:TravelTrailer/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:TravelTrailerforum-board/message:2718201/message:2718330","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"1232","rawBody":"
valhalla360 wrote:
John & Angela wrote:
Good morning. Nope. I'm talking full electric. I think the last two announcements I noticed were San Diego and Edmonton. Can't remember the rest but on one of the EV forums I follow there have been quite a few stories of various cities in the world making the switch.
Large scale installations or a few test units?
I do a little work with transit (not bus purchase but telematics on them) and hybrid is pretty much become the standard as it's a minimal cost difference and produces big results. Outside test cases and some small scale specialty uses haven't seen any large scale pure electrics.
Good morning. Well I don't much about this kinda thing. Just what I read on various medias, but when I read about cities replacing some or all of their fleets with electrics I would think it is past the proof of concept phase. I would be interested in seeing how the numbers wash out though. Many of the cities using the new technology are overseas but there are a dozen or so in North America as well. One of the manufacturers are not too far from me in Burnaby but many are in China as well.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:2718330_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718329":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:2718329","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:2718329":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:2851"},"id":"message:2718329","revisionNum":1,"uid":2718329,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TravelTrailerforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:2718201"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:2718201"},"subject":"Re: Electric truck - tow vehicle of future ?","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718329"},"body":"
John & Angela wrote:
Good morning. Nope. I'm talking full electric. I think the last two announcements I noticed were San Diego and Edmonton. Can't remember the rest but on one of the EV forums I follow there have been quite a few stories of various cities in the world making the switch.
Large scale installations or a few test units?
I do a little work with transit (not bus purchase but telematics on them) and hybrid is pretty much become the standard as it's a minimal cost difference and produces big results. Outside test cases and some small scale specialty uses haven't seen any large scale pure electrics.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"207","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2017-09-11T05:13:07.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2017-09-11T05:13:07.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":205},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:TravelTrailer/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:TravelTrailerforum-board/message:2718201/message:2718329","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"677","rawBody":"
John & Angela wrote:
Good morning. Nope. I'm talking full electric. I think the last two announcements I noticed were San Diego and Edmonton. Can't remember the rest but on one of the EV forums I follow there have been quite a few stories of various cities in the world making the switch.
Large scale installations or a few test units?
I do a little work with transit (not bus purchase but telematics on them) and hybrid is pretty much become the standard as it's a minimal cost difference and produces big results. Outside test cases and some small scale specialty uses haven't seen any large scale pure electrics.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:2718329_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"User:user:237915":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:237915","uid":237915,"login":"BenK","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2002-04-18T11:36:55.000-07:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.goodsam.com/t5/s/feyqc97479/m_assets/avatars/default/avatar-9.svg?time=1737155183000"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:42"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:feyqc97479/user:237915"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718328":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:2718328","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:2718328":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:237915"},"id":"message:2718328","revisionNum":1,"uid":2718328,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TravelTrailerforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:2718201"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:2718201"},"subject":"Re: Electric truck - tow vehicle of future ?","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718328"},"body":"Not always politics...
Some times it has to do with rebates/tax incentives/etc...to even tax credits by whatever entity trying to get this going
Windgenerators had full IRS tax credits up to $100,000.00 back in the early 80's
They had to 'fly' and generate electricity by midnight December 31st...can't remember the exact year
Limiting factors back then were the available workers out in those tiny towns and cranes.
Plenty of fly by night OEMs...we made tons on the tax credit sales and even more fixing all of the busted flyby night units (insurance work)
Ditto current climate in California for solar, which is going away soon, if not already
PS...for electric powered vehicles...using HP as a gauge skews it a bit. Wondering which metric will become the standard that the general public will both accept and understand
Electrics are better for stop and go than long cruising distances where the power storage become a bigger factor...that full to a few times 100% torque at zero RPM vs ICE's zero torque at zero RPM situation","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2017-09-10T08:32:20.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2017-09-10T08:32:20.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":205},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:TravelTrailer/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:TravelTrailerforum-board/message:2718201/message:2718328","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"1118","rawBody":"Not always politics...
Some times it has to do with rebates/tax incentives/etc...to even tax credits by whatever entity trying to get this going
Windgenerators had full IRS tax credits up to $100,000.00 back in the early 80's
They had to 'fly' and generate electricity by midnight December 31st...can't remember the exact year
Limiting factors back then were the available workers out in those tiny towns and cranes.
Plenty of fly by night OEMs...we made tons on the tax credit sales and even more fixing all of the busted flyby night units (insurance work)
Ditto current climate in California for solar, which is going away soon, if not already
PS...for electric powered vehicles...using HP as a gauge skews it a bit. Wondering which metric will become the standard that the general public will both accept and understand
Electrics are better for stop and go than long cruising distances where the power storage become a bigger factor...that full to a few times 100% torque at zero RPM vs ICE's zero torque at zero RPM situation","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:2718328_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"User:user:354008":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:354008","uid":354008,"login":"spoon059","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2010-10-03T10:19:08.000-07:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.goodsam.com/t5/s/feyqc97479/m_assets/avatars/default/avatar-1.svg?time=1737155183000"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:41"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:feyqc97479/user:354008"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718327":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:2718327","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:2718327":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:354008"},"id":"message:2718327","revisionNum":1,"uid":2718327,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TravelTrailerforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:2718201"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:2718201"},"subject":"Re: Electric truck - tow vehicle of future ?","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718327"},"body":"
John & Angela wrote: There would be no political reason to do it. Bus riders don't care how the bus is powered.
I can tell you that in my liberal county in liberal Maryland there is a TON of political reason to use alternative energy. Our local Ride On buses have been hybrid for many years and they are introducing all electric as well. The people that ride it don't care, but liberal voters and donors love to hear about a \"feel good\" story with little or no regard to practical application.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"207","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2017-09-10T08:25:33.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2017-09-10T08:25:33.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":205},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:TravelTrailer/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:TravelTrailerforum-board/message:2718201/message:2718327","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"535","rawBody":"
John & Angela wrote: There would be no political reason to do it. Bus riders don't care how the bus is powered.
I can tell you that in my liberal county in liberal Maryland there is a TON of political reason to use alternative energy. Our local Ride On buses have been hybrid for many years and they are introducing all electric as well. The people that ride it don't care, but liberal voters and donors love to hear about a \"feel good\" story with little or no regard to practical application.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:2718327_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718326":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:2718326","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:2718326":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:273255"},"id":"message:2718326","revisionNum":1,"uid":2718326,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TravelTrailerforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:2718201"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:2718201"},"subject":"Re: Electric truck - tow vehicle of future ?","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718326"},"body":"
valhalla360 wrote:
John & Angela wrote: There are a lot of North American cities switching to electric only buses. The bean counters must be making sense of it. There would be no political reason to do it. Bus riders don't care how the bus is powered.
Hybrid is getting a lot of real life use but outside demonstration units and tiny buses used in central areas of European cities, I haven't seen much pure electric.
Hybrid makes a lot of sense. A transit bus is a perfect use of hybrid. They typically operate on congested signalized corridors and with stops, rarely go more than 1/4 mile between stops. Average speeds of 20-30mph are common.
A standard diesel bus needs 250-300hp to get halfway decent acceleration which is a big deal given the use case and that engine is operating in a wide RPM range during acceleration and deceleration resulting in significant time spent outside the engines ideal power output range.
With a hybrid, a 75-100hp engine would be plenty to maintain the average speed and you can set it to run at a constant power output near it's peak efficiency. The only downside is if you need to move the bus to a new city and have to travel 50-100 miles on freeways. With only 75hp, top speed is probably going to be around 45-50mph unless the batteries give it a boost (which means limited range) or you oversize the engine which negates a lot of the benefits of hybrid. I haven't heard of anyone doing this but you could make a transport battery pack that could be loaded in the bus if you need to do a long distance move. It could simply be a modular set of batteries that are placed on the floor of the bus with quick connect wiring and a port to connect to the hybrid battery pack.
Good morning. Nope. I'm talking full electric. I think the last two announcements I noticed were San Diego and Edmonton. Can't remember the rest but on one of the EV forums I follow there have been quite a few stories of various cities in the world making the switch.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"207","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2017-09-10T07:21:30.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2017-09-10T07:21:30.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":206},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:TravelTrailer/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:TravelTrailerforum-board/message:2718201/message:2718326","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"2100","rawBody":"
valhalla360 wrote:
John & Angela wrote: There are a lot of North American cities switching to electric only buses. The bean counters must be making sense of it. There would be no political reason to do it. Bus riders don't care how the bus is powered.
Hybrid is getting a lot of real life use but outside demonstration units and tiny buses used in central areas of European cities, I haven't seen much pure electric.
Hybrid makes a lot of sense. A transit bus is a perfect use of hybrid. They typically operate on congested signalized corridors and with stops, rarely go more than 1/4 mile between stops. Average speeds of 20-30mph are common.
A standard diesel bus needs 250-300hp to get halfway decent acceleration which is a big deal given the use case and that engine is operating in a wide RPM range during acceleration and deceleration resulting in significant time spent outside the engines ideal power output range.
With a hybrid, a 75-100hp engine would be plenty to maintain the average speed and you can set it to run at a constant power output near it's peak efficiency. The only downside is if you need to move the bus to a new city and have to travel 50-100 miles on freeways. With only 75hp, top speed is probably going to be around 45-50mph unless the batteries give it a boost (which means limited range) or you oversize the engine which negates a lot of the benefits of hybrid. I haven't heard of anyone doing this but you could make a transport battery pack that could be loaded in the bus if you need to do a long distance move. It could simply be a modular set of batteries that are placed on the floor of the bus with quick connect wiring and a port to connect to the hybrid battery pack.
Good morning. Nope. I'm talking full electric. I think the last two announcements I noticed were San Diego and Edmonton. Can't remember the rest but on one of the EV forums I follow there have been quite a few stories of various cities in the world making the switch.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"timeToRead":2,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:2718326_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}}},"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718325":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:2718325","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:2718325":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:2851"},"id":"message:2718325","revisionNum":1,"uid":2718325,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TravelTrailerforum-board"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:2718201"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:2718201"},"subject":"Re: Electric truck - tow vehicle of future ?","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:2718325"},"body":"
John & Angela wrote: There are a lot of North American cities switching to electric only buses. The bean counters must be making sense of it. There would be no political reason to do it. Bus riders don't care how the bus is powered.
Hybrid is getting a lot of real life use but outside demonstration units and tiny buses used in central areas of European cities, I haven't seen much pure electric.
Hybrid makes a lot of sense. A transit bus is a perfect use of hybrid. They typically operate on congested signalized corridors and with stops, rarely go more than 1/4 mile between stops. Average speeds of 20-30mph are common.
A standard diesel bus needs 250-300hp to get halfway decent acceleration which is a big deal given the use case and that engine is operating in a wide RPM range during acceleration and deceleration resulting in significant time spent outside the engines ideal power output range.
With a hybrid, a 75-100hp engine would be plenty to maintain the average speed and you can set it to run at a constant power output near it's peak efficiency. The only downside is if you need to move the bus to a new city and have to travel 50-100 miles on freeways. With only 75hp, top speed is probably going to be around 45-50mph unless the batteries give it a boost (which means limited range) or you oversize the engine which negates a lot of the benefits of hybrid. I haven't heard of anyone doing this but you could make a transport battery pack that could be loaded in the bus if you need to do a long distance move. It could simply be a modular set of batteries that are placed on the floor of the bus with quick connect wiring and a port to connect to the hybrid battery pack.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"207","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2017-09-10T07:11:56.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2017-09-10T07:11:56.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":205},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"grouphub:TravelTrailer/category:TRAVELCENTER/community:feyqc97479board:TravelTrailerforum-board/message:2718201/message:2718325","replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"body@stringLength":"1772","rawBody":"
John & Angela wrote: There are a lot of North American cities switching to electric only buses. The bean counters must be making sense of it. There would be no political reason to do it. Bus riders don't care how the bus is powered.
Hybrid is getting a lot of real life use but outside demonstration units and tiny buses used in central areas of European cities, I haven't seen much pure electric.
Hybrid makes a lot of sense. A transit bus is a perfect use of hybrid. They typically operate on congested signalized corridors and with stops, rarely go more than 1/4 mile between stops. Average speeds of 20-30mph are common.
A standard diesel bus needs 250-300hp to get halfway decent acceleration which is a big deal given the use case and that engine is operating in a wide RPM range during acceleration and deceleration resulting in significant time spent outside the engines ideal power output range.
With a hybrid, a 75-100hp engine would be plenty to maintain the average speed and you can set it to run at a constant power output near it's peak efficiency. The only downside is if you need to move the bus to a new city and have to travel 50-100 miles on freeways. With only 75hp, top speed is probably going to be around 45-50mph unless the batteries give it a boost (which means limited range) or you oversize the engine which negates a lot of the benefits of hybrid. I haven't heard of anyone doing this but you could make a transport battery pack that could be loaded in the bus if you need to do a long distance move. It could simply be a modular set of batteries that are placed on the floor of the bus with quick connect wiring and a port to connect to the hybrid battery pack.","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[],"totalCount":0,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"timeToRead":2,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:2718325_1"},"latestVersion":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}},"customFields":[]},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/community/NavbarDropdownToggle-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/community/NavbarDropdownToggle-1741694506000","value":{"ariaLabelClosed":"Press the down arrow to open the menu"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/EscalatedMessageBanner-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/EscalatedMessageBanner-1741694506000","value":{"escalationMessage":"Escalated to Salesforce by {username} on {date}","viewDetails":"View Details","modalTitle":"Case Details","escalatedBy":"Escalated by: ","escalatedOn":"Escalated on: ","caseNumber":"Case Number: ","status":"Status: ","lastUpdateDate":"Last Update: ","automaticEscalation":"automatic escalation","anonymous":"Anonymous"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/users/UserLink-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/users/UserLink-1741694506000","value":{"authorName":"View Profile: {author}","anonymous":"Anonymous"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-shared/client/components/users/UserRank-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-shared/client/components/users/UserRank-1741694506000","value":{"rankName":"{rankName}","userRank":"Author rank {rankName}"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageTime-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageTime-1741694506000","value":{"postTime":"Published: {time}","lastPublishTime":"Last Update: {time}","conversation.lastPostingActivityTime":"Last posting activity time: {time}","conversation.lastPostTime":"Last post time: {time}","moderationData.rejectTime":"Rejected time: {time}"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSolvedBadge-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSolvedBadge-1741694506000","value":{"solved":"Solved"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSubject-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSubject-1741694506000","value":{"noSubject":"(no subject)"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageBody-1741694506000":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageBody-1741694506000","value":{"showMessageBody":"Show More","mentionsErrorTitle":"{mentionsType, select, board {Board} user {User} message {Message} other {}} No Longer Available","mentionsErrorMessage":"The {mentionsType} you are trying to view has been removed from the community.","videoProcessing":"Video is being processed. 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