FCA Investigation Finds Inflated Sales/update page 2

The sad part about this conversation is that eight years later people still don't have a clue about what happened. The auto industry bail-out was just a by-product of the real problem which was sub-prime mortgages, credit default swaps, pyramid scheme type profits, and criminal behavior at the top of many of our financial institutions.. Unfortunately this means it could happen again and most likely will.

Had the governments of the world (not just the U.S.) not intervened as they did, we would have seen a complete collapse of the world's economy. Those that like to espouse the mantra that government should never be involved in business, would have joined the rest of us foraging for nuts and roots to keep from starving.

spoon059 wrote:
I don't doubt that the bailouts helped a lot of working families. That's great for them, but where does it end? Poorly managed companies that are spread too thin and not financially able to succeed should not cost the taxpayers. I'm great that you, and others still have jobs, medical and pensions... but i disagree with the idea that the federal govt should bed invoked in private enterprise.

Where does it start, where does it end? My father in law owned his own company. If he details on loans and can't pay, is the govt going to pay his bills? Doubtful, nor should they. There is a process in place for situations like this... its called bankruptcy. I realize you are passionate about it because it directly and positively benefits you. As someone who questions the decisions of our federal govt, i am concerned about the precedent set that bailed out a failing competitive private industry.

It's pretty simple.
When a company that size goes belly up and the resulting cascade of other businesses and individual people go belly up with it, how much tax money will the gov't collect from them......$Zero.

How much has everyone paid since they were offered the loan.....I'm sure it would now be in the billions when you figure all the employees and subcontractor suppliers.

I don't doubt that the bailouts helped a lot of working families. That's great for them, but where does it end? Poorly managed companies that are spread too thin and not financially able to succeed should not cost the taxpayers. I'm great that you, and others still have jobs, medical and pensions... but i disagree with the idea that the federal govt should bed invoked in private enterprise.

Where does it start, where does it end? My father in law owned his own company. If he details on loans and can't pay, is the govt going to pay his bills? Doubtful, nor should they. There is a process in place for situations like this... its called bankruptcy. I realize you are passionate about it because it directly and positively benefits you. As someone who questions the decisions of our federal govt, i am concerned about the precedent set that bailed out a failing competitive private industry.

Spot on. Wall street got a pass. And we have to get realistic about competing in global markets. That genie isn't going back in the bottle, and no one's going to turn the clock back to 1957.

What Perrysburg Dodgeboy said is 100% accurate except for the real need to re-open the union contracts as it was a must. Simply because without any changes to the existing contracts and insane legacy costs, refinancing would have only been a short stop gap action to delay the same outcome because the uncontrolled debt would have continued to increase with no end in sight. All 3 would have had to file chapter 11 or even chapter 7.

The only thing Chrysler and GM needed was the Government to demand the banks who BTW got trillions of free money to loan both refinance their loans and there would have been no need for any government money or bankruptcy. The reason for the bankruptcy was to open our Union Contract and gut it. Mainly our health care and Jobs Bank.

The only reason Ford wasn't in the same boat was their loans came due one year earlier. Otherwise they would have been in court right alongside of Chrysler and GM.

The messed up part is everyone of you know this is true but still just can't help yourself can you.

Don

goducks10 wrote:

spoon059 wrote:

Fordlover wrote:
What, no stab at GM? There's plenty of material ya know.

The amount of recalls they had that one year or 18 month period?
The amount of money in bailout funds that was "forgiven" or paid back with other bailout money?
The amount of brands selling the same exact product with a different name?

BOOM, I'm out...

The amount of people that kept their jobs, houses, autos, etc. Priceless.

And the bond holders who got .30 cents on the dollar years later. Priceless?

goducks10 wrote:


The amount of people that kept their jobs, houses, autos, etc. Priceless.

The exact same amount of jobs, houses, and autos had we not bailed them out and forced them to file for Ch. 11 bankruptcy from the start. In the end, we bailed out a company that still needed bankruptcy to solve their long term issues. :S

spoon059 wrote:

Fordlover wrote:
What, no stab at GM? There's plenty of material ya know.

The amount of recalls they had that one year or 18 month period?
The amount of money in bailout funds that was "forgiven" or paid back with other bailout money?
The amount of brands selling the same exact product with a different name?

BOOM, I'm out...

The amount of people that kept their jobs, houses, autos, etc. Priceless.