fuel additives

Good info but also remember on this camping forum a lot of people have diesel vehicles that are not started everyday. Something to make fuel last longer and something to make the oil more clingy might be beneficial to dry starting a motor that sits.

My company runs 3 diesel delivery trucks. We always get 350k on the motors before selling. Probably had 10 over the last 15 years...GM, Ford, Mercedes, Isuzu. Never a single issue with the motors (knock on wood) and never a drop of additive.

ETA: the only mechanical issue we ever had was on a Ford. The fuel tank lining dissolved and gummed-up the fuel system. Had to have it rebuilt with ZERO help from Ford. Absolutely the last Ford we have purchased/leased.

ShinerBock wrote:

jdc1 wrote:
What does the manufacture say? I think the millions of dollars they spent in research might be a clue.

Yes and no. There is a lot more into it than this that evolves around emissions. Even if an additive is good for the engine and may make it more efficient and reliable, it may harm emissions equipment and the EPA will require testing that the additive will not alter emissions.

If you were an engine manufacturer, would you spend the time and money to test all of these additives in all of the various fuel requirements from each state especially when you are making a dime off of it? Would you recommend an additive that may harm your emissions equipment(which you will pay out in warranty) if too much is added? Or would you stop recommending additives altogether as the manufacturers did with the new 2010 regulations?

Then you also have the minimum cetane rating your diesel is tuned to run on. Just like gas engines are tuned to run on certain octane ratings, so are diesels with different cetane ratings. For example, my BMW is designed to run on 50 cetane which is only available in California. I live in Texas which has a minimum cetane rating of 48 which is not too far off.

However, when traveling to other states that only have the federal minimum of 40 cetane, I do notice a drop in power and efficiency. On a trip to Florida, I got 2-3 mpg less(my car generally gets around 45 mpg) when using other state's diesel fuel. Halfway on the way back from Florida, I added some cetane boost and my mileage went back up.

Some people may call it snake oil by my fuel records from 90k worth of miles doesn't lie. I also have a friend that works at Southwest Research that tests these additives and I do know that they in fact work at cleaning up injectors and boost performance/efficiency. How much depends on your current fuel quality and how you use your vehicle. After all, these additives are not much different than the additives top-tier fuel diesel fuel brands put in their fuel. However, the brands just put the minimum required to meet state or federal fuel requirements.

So you are talking mileage ,and some are talking the health of the motor. So claims on both sides . I guess I was lucky on the health side not using an additive, and sacrificed mileage ,I guess . Never used it to see if there was a change in the mileage on the 7.3 nor this 6.7 Cummins .

Looks like archoil has a new formula.


https://www.archoil.com/products/ar6500-diesel-treatment

FishOnOne wrote:


Same can be said about Valvoline Premium Blue oil that advertises their oil is "Endorsed and Approved by Cummins" on every bottle and people think they have to run it because it's recommended by Cummins.

Egggzactly!

FWIW, the only oil I won't or don't run is Rosmella T4. Or haven't in a while anyways.
Aside from the odiferous emissions, and I'll qualify with I don't understand why or how, my old 5.9 would drink T4. Couple qts between oil changes, vs never adding oil between changes any other time, except when I took off once for long trip with about 10k miles on the oil and it was down a quart.

Grit dog wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

Grit dog wrote:
Seems alot of the Powerstroke guys think they need additives to save their engines...
Unless there's a problem you're trying to cure or you bought the wrong fuel for the weather, there is no need to add anything but diesel to your diesel tank.

Just so you know...

Link

OP,
I have ~215k miles on my Powerstroke and used a antigel fuel additive a couple of times that I recall when the temps got really cold. The last time was this past February, but even then it probably wasn't necessary.

I know... Still wondering how much PS paid Cummins for that glowing recommendation! Read through that recommendation if you want to see some real salesmanship!
BTW, you were probably very smart to juice up in Feb.
Youngest boy and I were in Dallas during that fiasco! Left warm sunny Seattle, lol and ended up with no power in the hotels and driving around for 2 days looking for that one place that was open to eat or get food! Somehow he got all his hockey games in, last one being early Mon morning and then pipes burst in that rink as we were leaving.
Spent an extra day waiting for a flight out and after 3 cancellations, hijacked the rental car and drove west through round 2 of the snow before it hit Dallas, to Albuquerque, to catch a flight.

I would have totally suspected that, that cold snap in central or S Texas would be good reason to add anti gel, as I wouldn't trust the diesel treatments that far south. However up anywhere along I 40, I wouldn't have worried about it.

Same can be said about Valvoline Premium Blue oil that advertises their oil is "Endorsed and Approved by Cummins" on every bottle and people think they have to run it because it's recommended by Cummins.

FishOnOne wrote:


Most of the diesel additives today are to help with the emissions system.

They may help the EGR and DSP with less soot generation, but not the SCR. Additives may increase NOx which causes the SCR to work even harder to lower the output. It also has an adverse effect on the catalyst. Although some new additive blends may actually reduce NOx.

ShinerBock wrote:

jdc1 wrote:
What does the manufacture say? I think the millions of dollars they spent in research might be a clue.

Yes and no. There is a lot more into it than this that evolves around emissions. Even if an additive is good for the engine and may make it more efficient and reliable, it may harm emissions equipment and the EPA will require testing that the additive will not alter emissions.

If you were an engine manufacturer, would you spend the time and money to test all of these additives in all of the various fuel requirements from each state especially when you are making a dime off of it? Would you recommend an additive that may harm your emissions equipment(which you will pay out in warranty) if too much is added? Or would you stop recommending additives altogether as the manufacturers did with the new 2010 regulations?

Then you also have the minimum cetane rating your diesel is tuned to run on. Just like gas engines are tuned to run on certain octane ratings, so are diesels with different cetane ratings. For example, my BMW is designed to run on 50 cetane which is only available in California. I live in Texas which has a minimum cetane rating of 48 which is not too far off.

However, when traveling to other states that only have the federal minimum of 40 cetane, I do notice a drop in power and efficiency. On a trip to Florida, I got 2-3 mpg less(my car generally gets around 45 mpg) when using other state's diesel fuel. Halfway on the way back from Florida, I added some cetane boost and my mileage went back up.

Some people may call it snake oil by my fuel records from 90k worth of miles doesn't lie. I also have a friend that works at Southwest Research that tests these additives and I do know that they in fact work at cleaning up injectors and boost performance/efficiency. How much depends on your current fuel quality and how you use your vehicle. After all, these additives are not much different than the additives top-tier fuel diesel fuel brands put in their fuel. However, the brands just put the minimum required to meet state or federal fuel requirements.

Most of the diesel additives today are to help with the emissions system.

wopachop wrote:
Would you add 2021 diesel to the old 7.3 motor?

Say wut?

jdc1 wrote:
What does the manufacture say? I think the millions of dollars they spent in research might be a clue.

Yes and no. There is a lot more into it than this that evolves around emissions. Even if an additive is good for the engine and may make it more efficient and reliable, it may harm emissions equipment and the EPA will require testing that the additive will not alter emissions.

If you were an engine manufacturer, would you spend the time and money to test all of these additives in all of the various fuel requirements from each state especially when you are making a dime off of it? Would you recommend an additive that may harm your emissions equipment(which you will pay out in warranty) if too much is added? Or would you stop recommending additives altogether as the manufacturers did with the new 2010 regulations?

Then you also have the minimum cetane rating your diesel is tuned to run on. Just like gas engines are tuned to run on certain octane ratings, so are diesels with different cetane ratings. For example, my BMW is designed to run on 50 cetane which is only available in California. I live in Texas which has a minimum cetane rating of 48 which is not too far off.

However, when traveling to other states that only have the federal minimum of 40 cetane, I do notice a drop in power and efficiency. On a trip to Florida, I got 2-3 mpg less(my car generally gets around 45 mpg) when using other state's diesel fuel. Halfway on the way back from Florida, I added some cetane boost and my mileage went back up.

Some people may call it snake oil by my fuel records from 90k worth of miles doesn't lie. I also have a friend that works at Southwest Research that tests these additives and I do know that they in fact work at cleaning up injectors and boost performance/efficiency. How much depends on your current fuel quality and how you use your vehicle. After all, these additives are not much different than the additives top-tier fuel diesel fuel brands put in their fuel. However, the brands just put the minimum required to meet state or federal fuel requirements.