How difficult is it to get a title?

drsolo wrote:
Well we will see if my friend has an unregisterable doorstop or not. What I do know is Wisconsin law. And neither Wisconsin nor Florida requires a notary for title transfer.

Florida Out of State title Transfer requirements.

HERE

"To transfer an Out-of-State title to Florida, the following documents will need to be provided:

The Original Title:
If purchased, both the buyer and seller must properly complete the “Transfer of Title by Seller” section on the title.
It must include printed names and signatures of buyer(s) and seller(s),odometer reading and date read, selling price, and date of sale.
NOTE: Cross-outs, white-out, alterations, or erasures may void the title or require additional documentation.

If your vehicle has a lien or if it is a lease and you do not have possession of the title you would need to refer to our Registration Only Customer Information Publication.

Proof of Current Florida insurance:
The card, policy, certificate, or binder (expires within 60 days) must state the insurance is a Florida Policy and be in the current owner’s name, listing the specific information for the vehicle you are registering. Insurance cannot be expired, post-dated, or from any other US state or territory.

Identification: All owners or purchasers* must be present with one of the following valid(unexpired)documents:
(1) State-issued Driver License/ID Card (includes US Territories), (2)Passport from any country,or (3) Canadian Driver License/ID Card.

If an owner/purchaser cannot be present, consider using a Power of Attorney form, which can be obtained from our website or our office. You will be required to submit a copy of the absent individual’s identification along with the completed Power of Attorney form.

*Businesses are required to submit documentation showing they are a valid business.
Out - of - State businesses must submit a valid IRS tax return or occupational license to prove validity.
Florida businesses can submit a printout from SunBiz.

If the individual acting on behalf of the business is not listed as an officer,
director, or registered agent on SunBiz, or if it is from Out - of - State, the individual in our office for the transfer must also submit, on letterhead, a letter that authorizes them to act on behalf of the business.

Vehicle Identification Number Verification: The VIN must be verified on all vehicles titled Out - of - State being transferred to Florida. To save time, consider printing a VIN Verification Form and having it completed before coming to our office. A Florida notary or a law enforcement officer may complete the VIN Verification Form.

If it’s not completed in advance, our office can verify the VIN as a courtesy (you must bring the vehicle to the office) when you come in for the transfer, weather permitting.

Sales Tax: If you have owned the vehicle for less than 6 months, proof of sales tax paid must be submitted
with your transfer paperwork.

A dealer invoice or title/registration, which specifically lists sales tax paid, are the most common ways to prove this."

According to the above ALL OWNERS (which would include the NAMED PERSON(S) on the title) MUST BE PRESENT at the time of transfer.. If the named person cannot be present then ANOTHER FORM called a POWER OF ATTORNEY FORM IS REQUIRED. ADDITIONALLY YOU NEED A COPY OF THE NAMED OWNER(S) IDENTIFICATION.. See the items I bolded..

For Out of State Titles you MUST have the VIN “VERIFIED”, this REQUIRES AN ADDITIONAL VIN VERIFICATION FORM.

HERE

"Used Boat or Utility Trailers(1.999 Pounds or Less)

1.You Must Submit ONE of the Following as Proof of Ownership:

Bill of Sale (with or without perjury clause or notary) that contains the VIN (Vehicle
Identification Number) and other trailer details, which is signed by the seller and lists the
purchaser.

Prior Owner’s Registration and a Bill of Sale (with or without a notary or perjury clause), which is signed by the seller and lists the purchaser. In this case, the Bill of Sale does not have to contain the VIN as long as it is signed by the current registered owner (on newer Florida registrations, the Bill of Sale is located in the lower right hand corner of the registration).

Dealer Invoice, if purchased from a Florida Dealer (their trailer sales tax statement must also be submitted)

Out-of-State Title or Registration or MSO (Manufacturer’s Statement of Origin), which provided a complete “chain of ownership”.

2.You must submit ONE of the Following as Proof of theEmpty Weight:

Weight Slip*

If previously registered in Florida, the weight listed in our system will suffice

Weight indicated on dealer paperwork

Weight indicated on the Out-of-State Title, Registration or MSO"

Seems pretty straight forward.. I suspect that even Wisconsin would have a very similar process for Out of State title transfers..

AirForceAngler wrote:
Run! Don't walk away, run from anything without a title. If the sellers are the legal owners, they can get another title. I'd even pay them to do it because that's easier than trying to get one once you've bought it. Otherwise, you have a stolen item.

X2

Well we will see if my friend has an unregisterable doorstop or not. What I do know is Wisconsin law. And neither Wisconsin nor Florida requires a notary for title transfer.

Idaho has always been easy.

SprinklerMan wrote:
In Maryland you can get a homemade trailer plate and title

"Drsolo" is complaining about Florida's "rules" even though Drsolo AND "friend" FAILED to do "due diligence" on their part by NOT researching BEFORE purchasing what they needed in order to transfer ownership correctly..

They are blaming Florida for their own short comings..

Failure to research and follow the rules results in a complete mess.. Drsolo's friend now has a unregisterable doorstop..

In Maryland you can get a homemade trailer plate and title

Drsolo writes “There is a vin number on vehicles. The purpose of the vin number is that if the vehicle is stolen then the owner reports the vehicle stolen by its vin number. “

Vin number on a trailer and a VIN number on a vehicle with a motor are two different beasts.

As you SHOULD have noticed, trailers get treated DIFFERENTLY than automobiles.

“OTOH, when a person fills in the back side of the title it is a proof that the vehicle was sold. “



Wrong.

Each state has it’s OWN SPECIFIC RULES that must be followed to the “T” if you want to successively be able to transfer “ownership” of a trailer (or even motor vehicle).

In PA you simply cannot “sign and fill out” the backside of a title yourself, PERIOD.

In PA you MUST sign the backside of the title only in the presence of a “Notary”, the Notary will fill in all the proper info and when you sign it they will apply their Notary seal.

In order to bring in a vehicle into PA from an individual the ORIGINAL title from the state the vehicle came from MUST have the back signed IN FRONT OF A NOTARY by the owner you purchased from and a Notary seal must be present.

For instance, I bought an antique auto from a gentleman in SC, SC however DOES NOT REQUIRE “notarization” off titles.. The owner simply signs the back and the new owner also signs the back..

I contacted my local Notary and specifically asked what I NEEDED TO DO in order to transfer an out of state title to PA..

In order for me to be able to transfer the title to my name in PA, the seller in SC HAD to locate a Notary and sign the title IN FRONT OF THE NOTARY and have the notary seal applied. The SELLER had to jump through some hoops to find a notary but they did.

Both the seller and myself FOLLOWED the rules that PA uses and I had NO TROUBLE in successfully transferring the title into my name.

“The title serves multiple purposes of being able to easily transport the information needed to a DMV window to change ownership, to get license plates and to pay taxes on the sales transaction. In Wisconsin there is no requirement for license plates on trailers under 3K lbs so many people dont bother to file for a title transfer and avoid paying for both title and sales tax. “

Too “easy”, in fact anyone can simply forge a name and claim ownership.. That is why many states have specific rules on how to transfer ownership that must be followed. Imagine if someone grabbed YOUR title to YOUR RV and vehicles and forged YOUR name to the titles then they took possession of said vehicles and then proceeded to take them to another state.. If other states followed your logic the thief would have no problem getting a new title in a different state and you are left with nothing..

Not signing and properly transferring the title within your state to AVOID taxes is called tax evasion.. That is a whole ‘nuther discussion..

“Physical possession of the title, the vehicle and a sales receipt should be enough. But not in Florida. “

Names on a title can be forged and a “sales receipt” both can be forged, two bogus forgings can equal a good title?

Anyone can scribble a name on a paper and say it is the owners signature and anyone can easily make a fake sales slip.. Without some PROOF or WITNESS that the signature is real you simply have a piece of paper and a big hulking doorstop.

You seem to think that Florida and all other states should have the same rules as your state of Wisconsin.. They DO NOT.. They have different rules for many reasons, most of the top reasons are for collecting taxes on the sale and for making sure it isn’t stolen.

“What I got is a clear title showing no liens, filled out and signed by a previous owner. All Florida has to do is check to see if the vin number shows up as stolen.”

Wrong, what you have is an OPEN TITLE with no “liens”. You have no proof that the signature on the title is really the signature of the previous owner.. You NEED more proof that your friend NOW owns the trailer..

You should have found out up front what documentation FLORIDA REQUIRED before purchasing..

Florida isn’t at “fault” for you and your friend not finding out and following ALL the rules BEFORE making the purchase..

You would have been better off buying the trailer, having it put into your name, getting the new title then using that title (in your name) as the means of transferring to your friend in Florida..

Trailer VINs are treated differently from MOTOR VEHICLE VINs in most states.. Not to mention before 1980s many trailer VINs did not follow any common alpha/numeric sequence or even length making tracking stolen trailers pretty much a lost cause..

Trailers unlike motor vehicles also only have ONE location for the VIN which is typically stamped on the tongue, but not ALL trailers have the VIN stamped on, some used plates that were riveted on or even sticky labels.. This makes it far easier to wipe out (or “wash”) the OEM VIN..

Most modern day motor vehicles have at least TWO and in many cases THREE locations where the VIN can be found making it harder to wipe out the VIN..

Around my neck of the woods, folks junk water damaged trailers by tearing them down for scrap and sell the trailer frames with a title for $500 (folks buying the frame with title use this as a shortcut in order to build a new trailer)..

There is a vin number on vehicles. The purpose of the vin number is that if the vehicle is stolen then the owner reports the vehicle stolen by its vin number.

OTOH, when a person fills in the back side of the title it is a proof that the vehicle was sold.

The title serves multiple purposes of being able to easily transport the information needed to a DMV window to change ownership, to get license plates and to pay taxes on the sales transaction. In Wisconsin there is no requirement for license plates on trailers under 3K lbs so many people dont bother to file for a title transfer and avoid paying for both title and sales tax.

Physical possession of the title, the vehicle and a sales receipt should be enough. But not in Florida.

What I got is a clear title showing no liens, filled out and signed by a previous owner. All Florida has to do is check to see if the vin number shows up as stolen.

I thought this thread looked familiar, discovered I replied to it four months ago.

drsolo wrote:
This website: DMV says titles are not needed for trailers weighing less than 2000 lbs. But when she went to the DMV with a bill of sale that had the VIN number on it, they gave her a sheaf of papers they said she had to have filled out to establish a "chain of ownership". It is absolutely ludicrous. On another site it says they DO require a title. WI doesnt require a title or a license plate on trailers less than 3000 lbs.

This is all messed up.

This IS NOT A "LUDICROUS" requirement at all.

In a nutshell the state NEEDS some "legit" paperwork which establishes the chain of previous ownership..

This is to PROTECT THE OWNER of the trailer, if the trailer was stolen from outside the state ANYONE CAN FORGE a "bill of sale" and present it to another state in order to acquire a new title.

Most states will require some sort of paper trail in order to establish that you are now the rightful "owner".

She now needs to attempt to fill out the paperwork as best as possible, perhaps she could contact a RV, auto or other trailer dealer to see if they can assist with the paperwork..

Alternately, in PA we can contact our local state representatives office for assistance when dealing with PADOT issues like registration..

Had she contacted her local DMV BEFORE buying she could have found out the right way to do things..