06Fargo wrote:
NC Hauler wrote:
06Fargo wrote:
NC Hauler wrote:
jims1 wrote:
I too am making this leap to the dark side. What a lot of folks don't realize is that their Dodges, Fords, and Chevy's are not built to handle the advertised weight ratings day in, day out. We tow 17.5-18k depending on the level in the tanks. .
Some truth to that, but there are also a lot of us out here who do know what they're doing, can do the simple math and know what we need to tow with. My 2013' Ram 3500 crew cab, long bed, 4X4 Dually, with 4:10 gearing has a GVWR of 14,000#, with a RAWR of 9750# and a GCWR of 37,000#. My 5er has a GVW of 16,950#, loaded to 16,050, with a 3300# pin weight. CAT scales has my truck loaded, ready to hook to my 5er with full tanks,5er hitch, wife, pets and toolbox @ 9,420#. That put's my loaded truck at a weight of 12,720#( 9420# plus 3300# pin weight), and total weight of 25,470.(5er @ 16,050# plus truck loaded weight of 9420)) So as you can see, I'm 1280# under my trucks GVWR, and WELL under my trucks GCWR and doing it all with a 1 ton crew cab dually which, at this time, has to also be my daily driver.
You're basically saying, those that tow well over their trucks limits day in , day out, won't last.. I agree with you on this, if it's what you meant. But i also believe if one has matched the truck with what they're towing, and is maintained properly it WILL perform day in and day out, just as it was designed to do.
My truck also has the medium duty Aisin transmission option in it, which, which makes my towing combo of Cummins/Aisin a little more robust, capable of towing even your examples of a 5er in the 17.5-18K weight range with just the 1 ton dually....
Any speculation at all why Chrysler engineers (lawyers?) rate a pickup for 37,000lbs GCWR, but it is not rated to haul the sum of it's two axle ratings without a trailer?
Being an Engineer myself in a manufacturing plant that manufacturers brake calipers, I don't pretend to know it all, nor least of all "speculate" on anything without knowing fact's given to me by the manufacturer of the sum of all the components that it takes to build a brake caliper, be it single piston, dual piston, combi-caliper, ABS, ESC, etc..., can't help it, have been in manufacturing since 75..
My RAWR is 9750#, my FAWR is 6,000#, together that equals 15,750, though recommended GVWR is only 14,000# ( Math/calc/statistics/robotics is my "bag:)). SO, being an old engineer, one who has more common sense than most of the younger Engineers, I go by what is recommended and use specs and comply with what other engineers have come up with due to reliability or safety reasons, (based on my part of manufacturing).
and I really don't understand what you want me to "speculate on when you ask, "Any speculation at all why Chrysler engineers (lawyers?) rate a pickup for 37,000lbs GCWR, but it is not rated to haul the sum of it's two axle ratings without a trailer? I have NO idea what you're asking me and I have a Degree in Secondary Ed, (thought I wanted to be a school teacher and never followed through, then got an Engineering degree, and I really can tell you that Engineers are NOT Lawyers...that's more in the warranty and responsibility, liability dept of a manufacturer....our company has Engineers who are just that, Engineer's, then they have a completely different building in another state that takes care of liability claims, contracts, warranties, etc.... if there are any, or any accident's due to our products, which are used on Chrysler, GM, Ford, Volvo, Mercedes Benz, VW, BMW and several others that use our brake by wire, ABS, ESC systems and brake calipers and adapters, and also the new combi-calipers...
It seems everywhere I post, you have issues with me trying to follow my trucks recommended tow ratings, or when I bring up weights. ...WHY?? I know it's not popular, I get called names, get ugly PM's, but it still doesn't change my mind when it comes to matching tow vehicles up with what one is towing. It's as though you are trying to justify yourself though me going in the opposite direction. I really don't understand your question. I gave all my weights, I fall WELL within all my weights, not even over my trucks GVWR, no where close to touching my RAWR, with OEM "E" rated tires, and it appears you have issues with this. I don't need air bags, I don't need to talk about all the safety buffers built in, I don't need to say a 1 ton SRW truck is just like mine, except the tires, (because in my trucks comparison, that is not true).
You need to call Chrysler Corporation to get your answer, and it'll probably be one you won't accept or want to hear.....I know and live specs, can't help it....it's what "I" do, whether anyone else does it or not, I can take the name calling, the piling on and the filthiness I've gotten in personal pm's from some on these forums, but, it won't change my mind about matching the right tow vehicle up to what ever it's towing, using the recommended hitch, and speeds that I think are safe to tow at....matters not if no one agrees with me, I still believe what I believe.
Sorry I couldn't answer your question as to why Chrysler recommends a certain amount of weight to be towed...I would say that you could call Ford or GM and get the same answer from THEIR Engineers and lawyers, but it probably wouldn't make any difference to you...
NC Hauler - FYI - I did call Chrysler first before posting on a rv forum and asked them the question why the weight ratings don't add up specifically on my truck. They could not give me an answer. I then had an engineer from a federally approved truck equipment upfitter contact Chrysler on my behalf and no further information was discovered. It's a Big Secret.
I don't have degrees or much for educations - I have no secret agenda - sorry to upset you- you could have answered me with "It's the brakes because..." and I would believe you due to your credentials, without the paragraphs.
A little poking around the spec sheets shows it is common practice in pickup trucks that these weights don't add up so I guess it is more pickup legal b.s. and not a life threatening component issue.
That's why I posted the question a couple times here.
I have hauled with class 8 - 140,000lbs on 8 axles on snow and ice - I have no interest in over 23-25000lbs with any kind of pickup buckboard with juice and electric brakes.
Have a safe and Happy New Year.
You win...I quit. Sorry, but I already knew everything you just told me and have told me before. I've worked with some of these design Engineers when we design their ABS, ESC systems and their front and rear brake calipers for some of the trucks we put these systems on..we have to know their specs, and of course our brakes EXCEED their specs they expect us to meet. It's our way to cover "liability". It's no "secret" as you suggest, call GM and Ford and ask them the same question you posed to Chrysler....there is only so much info they'll push to the public..Just plain old common sense liability coverage for those who ignore numbers.
I have not towed with a Class 8, nor would I care to but I don't poke fun at others or their equipment for NOT having done it, I've towed rv's all through the mountains of WV, TN, VA, SC and NC since 75, but it really doesn't mean a lot. My truck isn't a "pickup buckboard", have no idea what you meant by that or by the comment "with juice", but did understand the electric brake comment. I too have no interest in towing over 23,000# to 25,000# with my pick up either...have no idea where some of your rants are coming from....I know I have enough pickup truck, loaded to the teeth with awesome options and most comfortable, that will easily and safely handle what I need it to do where I do my towing.
So, I will try to steer clear of you in these forums for it appears we won't get along or agree. May you to have a Happy New Year, and that's probably without the sarcasm you had in your offering to me. You win, Your right, your far more experienced...Uncle...
I DO want to apologize to the OP for having hijacked your thread if you're still around. I truly did not mean for this to happen...Again, I'm sorry for that.
