Payload Rating vs Tongue Weight

from what I understand, it seems that the 500lbs rating is if you just put a ball on the bumper and pull that way. If you have a hitch installed then you would go by that rating. My f150 had the same thing and stated a 500lb tongue weigh rating, but it was for a bumper pull.

"That assumption of a wdh is primarllily limited to RV owners. In the real working world, wdh setups are rare as hens teeth. People hook trailers and tow them when they have a job to do. They pine over tongue weights and where to load the canned goods and have a bathroom scale handy when they’re pulling a TT.
I can’t explain the phenomena."

Even as one who generally tries to stay within ratings, I wholeheartedly agree with this. Buying a truck and RV setup? Yeah, I'll run the numbers and stay within GVWR and GCVWR.

Have to haul something somewhere? Just like back in the day: if the deuce-and -a-half is available, I'll use it. Otherwise, I'll take the heavy duty pick-em-up....slower trip, watch the descents, but will get the job done.

From the time I was 16 (awful long time ago) until probably 40, either work or play involved hauling everything from OTR doubles to lowboys to sno-go trailers with anything from a GMC Astro (when it was a truck, although a POJ truck) to a Jeep Wagoneer to several varieties of Class 1 - 5 trucks. Never heard of a WDH until I bought my 1st RV.

To the OP's question, I haven't seen many vehicles that call out a specific limit on tongue weight, but if the vehicle manufacturer calls it out and you want to comply with the ratings, then a called out tongue weight will (extrapolating backwards) provide a limit on the trailer size, or at least the loading of that trailer. I'd dig into the manual and see if the tongue weight rating is truly the manufacturer's engineered rating or if it's a byproduct of the max trailer weight.

valhalla360 wrote:
Usually when you get into the higher weights, there is an assumption that you are using a weight distributing hitch with a dedicated higher class receiver hitch. They typically have a higher weight rating (check the fine print in your manual)

500lb is typically just a plain ball often bolted to the rear bumper. If that's what you are running...no you are limited to 500lb hitch weight (or whatever it lists as) or payload max calculation...whichever is lower.

That assumption of a wdh is primarllily limited to RV owners. In the real working world, wdh setups are rare as hens teeth. People hook trailers and tow them when they have a job to do. They pine over tongue weights and where to load the canned goods and have a bathroom scale handy when they’re pulling a TT.
I can’t explain the phenomena.

Thanks everyone for answering. I guess I still don't have a clear answer to may real question.

Is there some reason that manufactures very often specify a tongue weight capacity of 10% the max towing capacity regardless of GVWR, GAWRFR, or GAWRR? I was even looking a a hitch component manufacturer the other day and on their website and they said to determine the tongue weight by calculating 10% GTWR.

This conflicts with a 10-15% ideal weight on the hitch, and is basically forces the towing capacity to be lower than specified.

In addition in the forums I keep seeing allowed tongue weight determined by taking GAWRR and subtracting the rear axle weight from a CAT scale. When people ask questions about tongue weight the answer seems to often neglect any reference to the tongue weight capacity specified by the manufacturer.

Without a lot more detail, it's hard to get too specific. That said, I agree with bikendan - I would not be likely to exceed the stated capacity in the manual, regardless of the rating listed on the hitch. When you get into higher payloads you start bringing in questions of axle ratings, WDH, etc... If your vehicle is limited to 5k towing, it likely means that many of those other components could become an issue with a higher tongue weight.

Usually when you get into the higher weights, there is an assumption that you are using a weight distributing hitch with a dedicated higher class receiver hitch. They typically have a higher weight rating (check the fine print in your manual)

500lb is typically just a plain ball often bolted to the rear bumper. If that's what you are running...no you are limited to 500lb hitch weight (or whatever it lists as) or payload max calculation...whichever is lower.

OP, you have a little soccer mom mobile. Don’t overthink it. Keep your trailers in the popup/teardrop size. Done.

kb1234 wrote:
blt2ski,
The hitch itself is rated for 900lbs tongue capacity, the 500lbs is listed in the vehicle manual. Are you suggesting to disregard that in favor of the hitch rating and the manual calculation based on payload?

The 900lbs is the rating for the hitch receiver ONLY, not for the vehicle it's attached to. That same receiver is mounted to many different models with different towing specs.
Go by the vehicle's owners manual, not what's on the receiver.

blt2ski,
The hitch itself is rated for 900lbs tongue capacity, the 500lbs is listed in the vehicle manual. Are you suggesting to disregard that in favor of the hitch rating and the manual calculation based on payload?

The typical issue you are talking about, is related to the hitch itself! Put a stronger higher capacity hitch on your truck, you can then pull a heavier trailer. Assuming the rating is based on a hitch provided my the manufacture.
I also figure max tow capacity the way you do. If you have no payload left after loading with people etc for hitch weight, you actual two rating is not manufactures max rating, it is ZERO, nothing, nada, squat.....

marty