Recently picked up a used 2010 Dutchmen Kodiak. Been reading a lot, learning a lot, and buying a lot!The trailer was winterized at the dealership, but during the PDI - I had them show me everything about it (first time owner). Well, I noticed the grey tank was showing as 3/4 full, the rest were empty. No biggy I thought, this is probably from them flushing out the lines for me (they indicated it was "un-winterized" for me). The tank has been full for 2 weeks now, while I've been prepping it for our first trip. Figured "What the heck, its just clean grey water" and decided to just dump it in the gravel along side my driveway. I know this is generally frowned upon, but it should have been unused, clean (perhaps some anti-freeze?) water.Put my gloves on (see - I'm learning!), cracked open the drain cap, and a bunch of water, maybe a gallon or so, came pouring out of the cap. Let me tell you.... Sure didn't smell like rinse water. Or drain water. Had what I believe was probably toilet paper, but couldn't confirm. Was pretty digested whatever it was.So, long story short - back on here to figure out what the problem was. Found that I can cheaply, and pretty easily just replace the valves. For the time, cost, and relatively easy access to the valves - I might as well replace them both as long as I'm down there. But then, I see multiple recommendations for a twist-on valve that attaches where the sewer line would attach. Perfect!Is the twist-on valve a viable option, made specifically for the problem I am having? Or am I trying to convince myself that there is an easy way out? I'm fine with changing the valves - but if I can just twist a valve on in 5 seconds and call it a day, I would not be heartbroken either. I just don't want to cause a problem down the road if I don't make the proper choice.Thanks in advance! We coincidentally had 2 other sets of our friends pick up their trailers last week, so the 3 of us have been all excited to go on our first group campout!

It could have been water backed up behind the cap when the tank valve was opened, then closed, with the cap still in place.Before spending money, check to see if the valve(s) actually works or not. Your post above doesn't make any reference to having operated the valves to verify if they are functional or not.

Twist on valve is great addition IF you can leave it on all the time......Will it hang down to low?Will it need additional strap support so it doesn't bounce and stress drain header piping?I don't use the twist on because it would stick to far out side of my 5th wheel and would hang low so I installed another valve in horizontal run of common drain header.I have done this on last three trailers.I do it so I can 'optimize' waste tank usage when boondocking.Black/Grey tank drain valves MAY be leaking thru........but I would wait until next routine dump (FULL Tanks) and see if it is just poor winterizing procedure preformed by dealer, stuff caught in valve blade/grove or if seals are bad.Then decide....

From what I can tell, the valves appear to be working. At least water is not rushing out as fast as it goes in? The grey tank was 3/4 full and holding. The black has never been used by me, and is showing as empty on the control panel. Now I realize "empty" is a relative term that leaves a lot of wiggle room in this case. I have not actually put water into the black tank to see if that seal is holding. I cannot physically see the opening (at least I wasn't looking).I'll double check, but I believe I should be able to leave the twist on valve connected permanently as well. No worry about ground clearance or sticking out too far. Just wasn't sure if it was suitable for "permanent" use, or just a bandaid.

There should always be some water in the black tank unless you know for sure that there is nothing in it. Solids can and will get hard and overtime cause problems. I have just added a twist on valve to my setup to prevent the type of situation you described, but I would verify that the two existing valves are working properly.

This makes complete sense then. Pretty sure the "liquid" I had behind the cap was black water by the bits I believe were disintegrated TP. Couldn't tell if it was TP, or just some sort of sludge that was in the grey tank. Once I get home from work, I'm going to actually get down there and see whats going on. I'm hoping there is just something in the valve channel that is not allowing it to fully seat. Last night, I knew it was going to rain just prior to me dumping the grey in my driveway. How does one service a tank (expecting it t obe a black issue) in my driveway at home? It would be nice to actually flush out the tank myself so I have a cleaner environment to work in, as well as rinse out any possible obstructions. Do I try to contain everything in a bucket and dump down the toilet when full? Or can I leave a hose running outside on the ground to dilute anything that comes out of the tank while I'm working? This is strictly assuming that no solids are going to come out. Not trying to float a turd over to my neighbors curb for his enjoyment!

Replace valves, or use twist on? | Good Sam Community

BarneyS
Explorer III
Aug 19, 2016
I think I would go to a nearby or local full hookup campground, rent a site for the weekend ( or weekday if you are retired) and hook up to the sites sewer. I would then go ahead and do whatever needs to be done to empty the tanks and repair/replace the valves if necessary. It will probably not be necessary however.

I would take a length of hose and a tank rising want such as this or this, put it down the toilet and rinse the black tank out very well. This, if you do it long enough and rotate the rinser around well, will clean your tank and the sensors well. I do this every time I am going to leave the trailer unused for a length of time. I also use a clear 45 elbow to see what is coming out and when the tank is clean.

You can do this at a campground while hooked up to their sewer at your campsite. No need to worry about holding up people at the exit dump station or how much time you are taking. If you need to drive a bit to find a campground, then put some water in your tanks along with some dishwashing detergent and let it slosh around while you drive to the campground. This will get your tanks cleaned very easily in most cases.
Barney
bpounds
Nomad
Aug 17, 2016
I recommend a twist-on valve right at the end of your drain. It is not a replacement for the other valves, nor is it an excuse to not fix other valves that may be leaking. The twist-on is an additional convenience, a way to use gray water to back-flush the black tank, and a backup valve in case other valves leak. Besides, even healthy valves can seep a little, and having a valve right at the connection means there cannot be much surprise water sitting there.

As for the apparent black water in the line, your dealer obviously did not dump the tanks, and while sitting around the lot it would be easy for someone to have pulled the black valve handle. Maybe a kid, maybe someone just playing around, or maybe they expected the tanks to be empty on a dealer lot. Point is, I would not assume I had an issue until I had serviced the tanks myself. Drain, flush with plenty of water, check for leaks, etc.
mfox20
Explorer
Aug 17, 2016
To do it in the driveway I would just add about 3 gallons and see if you get a leak from the gray tank. If it leaks, drain the 3 gallons into a 5 gallon bucket and pour it down the house toilet. If it doesn't leak, try the same thing with the black tank. Either way if you have a valve issue you will know which one and go ahead and replace it.

Once repaired, I would fill each tank about half full of soapy water and dump at the campground on your next trip out. Should be clean enough then. Easy to get the water in the gray tank. Take a couple of long, hot, soapy showers. You can run a garden hose inside to add the water to either as well.
Glowrdr
Explorer
Aug 17, 2016
At the risk of sounding like I'm trolling for an answer I want to hear - I do agree with you mfox. It would be great if I can just do all of this in my driveway, but it sounds like that's not the best idea? Since I have already drained the grey water on my driveway (no taking that back now) - would it be safe to empty my black water into the carrier I have, and flush both tanks thoroughly so I can deal with the issue at hand? I'm concerned that I might not have the appropriate time, tools, etc if I try to diagnose and repair the problem at a dump site.

I will take precautions to ensure the black tank is in fact empty - but at this point, it just makes sense to deal with the issue at hand, and know for future reference that I don't want to be dumping either tank at my residence. (I knew this applied after I started using the trailer, it was more of a practice for me at home that went south - thus, bringing this issue to my attention now instead of later).

I do agree though, if I'm going through all of the troubleshooting - if it ends up being a bad valve instead of a clogged valve, I think the best thing to do is replace both valves while I'm down there. I may add the twist on valve for extra insurance.
Chuck_thehammer
Explorer
Aug 17, 2016
I can assure you .. dealers do NOT clean the tanks.. you would be lucky if they dumped them..
mfox20
Explorer
Aug 17, 2016
Like a few others said, if you have a valve issue replace the valve. Twist-on is just a band aid. I would not wait until next time out and tanks are full to check it out again.

If both tanks are empty, with valves closed, just put water in one tank, 5-10 gallons and see what happens. I would start with the gray water tank. If it doesn't leak past the valve then add water to the black tank.

It will be hard to determine which one is leaking if you have water in both tanks at the same time and both tanks are relatively clean.
trail-explorer
Explorer
Aug 17, 2016
Glowrdr wrote:
How "friendly" are some of the cleanout places at campgrounds? What I mean by that (or what I'm really asking) - would it be normal/possible for me to spend a half hour or so cleaning out my tanks, rinsing them, and troubleshooting the valve issue while I'm there? I kind of imagined something like a boat launch, or gas station - where there would be a line of people behind me waiting to get in. The wife has been talking about just hitting a county park a few miles from the house as a test run. This may be my best opportunity to get this taken care of before actually hitting the road.

Kind of hard to predict what the volume of "customers" would be at a local park/campground dump station.

Sunday, as people are departing, probably busy.
Saturday, maybe not so busy.

Mornings, busier, since that's when folks tend to pack up and leave to drive back home.

Afternoons, evenings, are likely to be less busy.

Some RV dealers have dump stations, so that's worth a check too.
Glowrdr
Explorer
Aug 17, 2016
I never thought about using my little tank caddy thing that came with mine. Perfect idea, and much more volume than a 5 gallon bucket.

Just to be clear on my end, I expected the grey tank to be filled with nothing but rinse water. Probably my fault, but I assumed that coming from an RV dealer, the tanks would be clean. I will double check the gauges, but at least the grey did go from 3/4 to E on the gauge. I was actually a little surprised when the black said empty. I was always under the impression they just permanently said full all the time. lol

Unfortunately the option of using my own sewer cleanout isn't much of an option at all - I live in a culdesac, so the cleanout is nowhere near what I have access to. How "friendly" are some of the cleanout places at campgrounds? What I mean by that (or what I'm really asking) - would it be normal/possible for me to spend a half hour or so cleaning out my tanks, rinsing them, and troubleshooting the valve issue while I'm there? I kind of imagined something like a boat launch, or gas station - where there would be a line of people behind me waiting to get in. The wife has been talking about just hitting a county park a few miles from the house as a test run. This may be my best opportunity to get this taken care of before actually hitting the road.

I really do want to say thanks again for everyones help. This has been a great forum for the couple of questions I had - I certainly hope I can give back once I have more than a couple weeks under my belt!
TBammer
Explorer
Aug 17, 2016
"PS, don't urinate in the shower or it is now black water! "

"But it's all pipes" George Costanza
beemerphile1
Explorer
Aug 17, 2016
Chuck_thehammer wrote:
gray water sounds harmless, but its not...OLD food/grease/chemicals...

If it contains food particles (organic matter) it is black water and not gray water. Most people don't understand this.

Gray water would be from laundry, shower, and hand washing. Any organic matter and it is technically black water.

PS, don't urinate in the shower or it is now black water!

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Replace valves, or use twist on?

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