Towing above 65

spoon059 wrote:

jaycocreek wrote:

How did you conclude that the accident was caused by solely by speed and not by equipment failure, improper loading, improper hitch adjustment, driver tuning the radio, or other driver error or equipment problem?

My son was there as a first responder and extracted the victims. He was privy to what happened from those involved and who saw it and investigated it.

I don't mean to call you a liar, but this smells of nonsense. I worked as a patrol officer for over 12 years and have investigated thousands of accidents, from minor fender benders to multi car fatal collisions. Most jurisdictions have dedicated reconstructionists that actually investigate fatal wrecks. Being a first responder to the scene, like I was, wouldn't make you any more privy to the investigation than some guy standing on the other side of the road watching. Investigations take days or even weeks... its not CSI where everything happens and gets wrapped up in an hour.

#1 A first responder on the scene doesn't know what speed a vehicle was traveling without asking the driver, and even then they lie most of the time. Unless your son saw evidence, such as a quarter mile of brake skids in the road, its virtually impossible to determine speed just standing their looking. Even if you had a quarter mile of skids, that doesn't mean excessive speed as much as it may signify mechanical failure. Heck, I can drag my wifes car behind my truck and lay down a mile of skid marks and we can only be traveling at 10 mph.

#2 Every witness of a car crash will ALWAYS say that the other guy was speeding. My favorite was when someone would make a left turn and get broadsided. I would ask them what happened, they would almost always tell me, "That guy was speeding!!!". I would then ask, "why did you pull out in front of him if you knew he was speeding?" That caused them to stop and look confused. Then I would ask them to estimate how fast the car was traveling and inquire about any certifications or training they had on speed estimation. Surprisingly, not a singly at fault driver could ever provide me with any competent training in speed estimation. Witnesses to wrecks are often ignorant about what really happened. Usually they hear the crash, turn and look and see the aftermath and they try to piece it together in their mind.

For example I caught a serious wreck on my dash cam a couple years ago. The at fault driver was driving next to me and our light turned red. I slowed and stopped, he was distracted and drove right through it. He hit a car broadside that was traveling left to right at about 60 mph. I had multiple witnesses tell me the car was moving right to left (nope) that the at fault vehicle was the on traveling perpendicular to me (nope) they got the colors of the vehicles wrong... all kinds of stuff. They weren't trying to lie, they just didn't actually see the impact. They wanted to be helpful and tried to piece it together, but they just didn't understand the dynamics of a motor vehicle collision.

#3 Even if that crash was reconstructed, you would have a hard time proving a speed. Most speed calculations are done with a skid to stop equation. In this case the camper flipped over, so it didn't skid until it stopped. It would be almost IMPOSSIBLE to estimate speed because the truck likely skidded/slowed some before it flipped. Then it appears as though the semi struck and pushed it while it was flipped, so you can't estimate the slip coefficient of the side of the trailer or the truck.

#4 Even IF they were able to provide some speed estimation, it would be a broad range. Even in skid to stop scenarios it was common to see a speed estimate range of 20 mph. That means that the truck MIGHT have been going 70, or it could have been going 50. Definitely no way to PROVE that the speed was excessive.

#5 Did your son make any statements about any mechanical failures? Is it possible the truck suffered a sudden catastrophic tire failure that caused the truck to lose control? He could be doing 50 mph, lose a tire, lose control of the truck and swerve in front of the semi and still die. The problem wasn't SPEED, the problem could have been mechanical. Then again, he wouldn't know that on scene. That would be part of the follow up investigation where they inspect tires, brakes, mechanical systems, etc. Again, that takes days or weeks to determine.

#6 Any mention of any other involved vehicles? Perhaps another vehicle cut in front of the truck, causing him to swerve and strike the semi.

#7 Any wind gusts? I think we have all seen the video of the 1 ton truck pulling a trailer at slow speeds through a construction zone and the wind knocking the trailer over. That would be catastrophic, speed having no bearing on the equation.

#8 How did the driver die? Is it possible he had a medical emergency that influenced his driving? Until an autopsy is completed, it is impossible for your son to know. Perhaps he had a non fatal stroke and lost control. His body would still show horrible trauma... but it would have been completely irrelevant to the collision. Autopsies can take anywhere from a day to several weeks to pinpoint definitive cause of death.

Do you catch my drift? Its super easy to post a picture and an uninformed opinion. Doing so does not make it proof of negligence or speed.

I catch your drift......I spent 20 years as a traffic engineer in the Miami area specifically with accident records, built a computerized data base for recording all accident data etc and am familiar with accident reconstruction...there are numerous methods to estimate speed besides skid marks...one being the number of times the vehicle rolled over from the point where the incident started....but most importantly, and I assume as a leo you would agree is "too fast for conditions" Florida especially has all posted speed limits conditioned by "the conditions existing at the time of the accident" and assumes a bright sunny day wiith no complicating ambient conditions, toss in dusk, rain, etc etc. and a 55 mph speed limit is no longer an absolute. So, negligence and speed....yes to both...the accident itself is proof of both.