Trailer Cargo Capacity

SoundGuy wrote:

pulsar wrote:
Semantics?

Federal regulations are required, now, to be written in plan English.

What the heck is "plan English"? :h

It's what you get when you old eyes don't see that you've dropped the "i" out of "plain."

I've edited the post.

Tom

pulsar wrote:
Semantics?

Federal regulations are required, now, to be written in plan English.

What the heck is "plan English"? :h

mike-s wrote:

pulsar wrote:
Among those regulations is that a full propane tank must be included as part of the vehicles UVW.

Note: that's tanks, not cylinders. Cylinders are the more common BBQ style containers.

Semantics?

Federal regulations are required, now, to be written in plain English. The final publication in the Federal Registry of the regulations refer to the Plain English executive order 12866. The requirement restricts technical terms and jargon. I think most people whole would say that BBQ style containers could be called propane tanks. Do a Google search for propane tanks and see what comes up.

Regardless, the regulation makes it clear that it they is referring to the type of containers you are referring to. The final publication states:S4.3.5 If the vehicle is a recreation vehicle trailer and is equipped with a propane supply, the weight of full propane tanks must be included in the vehicle's unloaded vehicle weight.

Tom

GrandpaKip wrote:
My camper was about 300 pounds heavier than the placard when I took it home. So that needs to be considered.
I think you are wise to consider the CCC as one of the weight factors.

My own 2014 Coachmen Freedom Express 192RBS has an "advertised" dry weight of 3535 lbs ...



... but my particular unit arrived at the dealer with a stickered dry weight of 3815 lbs, a whopping 280 lbs heavier - and this is just a 19' couple's trailer!



To that I have to allow for the weight of a battery, water in the WH tank, and reserve capacity in the fresh water holding tank ... all in about 4000 lbs before I added anything else. :E It ALL counts so more CCC you have the better. :B

GrandpaKip wrote:
I would say that probably 90% of people I talk to in campgrounds have no idea what any of the weights are regarding their camper.

Absolutely agree.

Two 3500 lb axles (2-3/8" dia. axle tube) is probably the most popular rating by far. Larger rated axles will be more expensive and some axles have larger brakes and require 6-lug wheels which adds to the cost. The TT manufacturers try to build TTs around 3500 lb axle ratings and can play with the CCC numbers to make it to work. Axles can be loaded to or near their ratings in some cases (after deducting a tongue wt. figure) which can increase the risk of a bent axle. (Tires can also be loaded to near their max rating.) The TT manufacturers conveniently don't list axle ratings and details in their specs.

Our 1st TT was 20' (with dual axles), had a 1500 lb CCC rating and weighed close to it's GVWR. Our current 29' TT (an "ultralite") has a CCC rating of 1563 lbs and also weighs close to it's GVWR and just one full holding tank will put it over. Many TT owners quote a figure of 1500 lbs as typical weight of all cargo fully loaded for camping. Will depend somewhat on size of family and heavier things like tools that some take with them.

The 2018 version of our KZ TT (same length & features) now has a CCC of only 1210 lbs, down from 1563 lbs. That's getting to be a pretty low CC for a 29' TT. KZ says about their weights: This weight reflects the rolling average unit weight for each model. Your trailer weight will vary according to optional equipment.

TTs designated "ultralite" usually means they're built with the thinnest, lightest and least substantial materials & components to get the most bang for the buck relative to length and to make them towable by less capable TVs.

You can't trust CCC numbers in my experience. Maybe they're more accurate in the past couple of years? Our TT weighed 190 lbs more than the factory UVW, as delivered. Not sure if it was the options we ordered and/or things they may not include in the UVW like spare tire, microwave, propane, etc. The wt. of ALL cargo for camping for two came to only 555 lbs. The wt. of all mods (shocks, Dexter equalizers, water filtration, 2nd TV, etc.) was 119 lbs. The total wt. on top of the UVW came to 864 lbs. All wts are from a commercial scale. The as-delivered wt. was well off from the "yellow" sticker number (a white sticker in our case inside a cabinet and the max. cargo wt. on the sticker at front/left outside is also way off.

Frames do not have weight ratings of any kind and there is no correlation of the rating of axles used on them. Some frames have the much more flexible design of 3 pieces of sheet steel welded together and along with a low CCC does not make for a durable TT.

carringb wrote:

pulsar wrote:


In other words, all RV's are required by federal regulation to have a "true weight" CCC label.

Tom

Hopefully the OP is looking at yellow stickers, and not brochure weights, which still have no legal requirement to reflect reality (hence the number of "mandatory options" on many trailers.

No, brochures are not covered by the regulations, but the "mandatory" or other options are covered as far as the yellow sticker is concerned.

The information below comes form Code of Federal Regulations, CFR 571.120, and from the commentary about the regulation posted in the Federal Registry. Manufactures have to certify the GVWR and UVW and the OCCC (for motor homes) or the CCC (for trailers.) It goes into details about the difference in weight os RVs built in dry seasons as opposed to wet seasons. (In essences, they have to use the wet season weights.) Manufactures are allowed to use an exemplar weight - they don't have to weigh every vehicle. However, the rules caution that they are allowed to understate carrying capacity, but not overstate it.

After the vehicle certification is done, the regulation talks about change in weight, rather done by the manufacturer or dealer. If weight exceeding 45.4 kg (100 pounds) is added to a motor home or RV trailer between final vehicle certification and first retail sale of the vehicle, the load carrying capacity values on the RV load carrying capacity labels (Figures 1 and 2) required by S10.4 must be corrected... (That paragraph continues to provide two ways the correction can be made.

Tom

SoonerWing03 wrote:
The reason behind the question is that the current leader in the club house trailer, which has 95% of the things we were looking for, has a stickered weight of 5,160 lbs and a GBWR of 6,600 lbs. That wa just a bit of a concern to me because with the TV being a Tahoe, the vast majority of what we take with us will be packed in the trailer. I will say that the vast majority of our trips will be around 4 days with a couple week long trips sprinkled in. I don’t think we will pack 1,400 lbs of stuff but just from a common sense standpoint, I would have liked that number to be up over 2,000. We can get that same floor plan with the higher rated GVWR but have to go with an aluminum body vs fiberglass. Just not sure if I am making too big of an issue out of the trailer GVWR or not.

Like SG, I believe in a nice cushion when it comes to the CCC. I have about 1200 pounds to go to hit the 6000 pound rating.
My camper was about 300 pounds heavier than the placard when I took it home. So that needs to be considered.
I think you are wise to consider the CCC as one of the weight factors.
I would say that probably 90% of people I talk to in campgrounds have no idea what any of the weights are regarding their camper.

The reason behind the question is that the current leader in the club house trailer, which has 95% of the things we were looking for, has a stickered weight of 5,160 lbs and a GBWR of 6,600 lbs. That wa just a bit of a concern to me because with the TV being a Tahoe, the vast majority of what we take with us will be packed in the trailer. I will say that the vast majority of our trips will be around 4 days with a couple week long trips sprinkled in. I don’t think we will pack 1,400 lbs of stuff but just from a common sense standpoint, I would have liked that number to be up over 2,000. We can get that same floor plan with the higher rated GVWR but have to go with an aluminum body vs fiberglass. Just not sure if I am making too big of an issue out of the trailer GVWR or not.

My trailer (35 ft Windjammer) claims 7210 on the door sticker. Unfortunately, I didn't weigh it on the first day.

With full water and all our equipment it weighs 8160 according to the CAT scales. This leaves us 390 lbs for clothes and food before exceeding the 8550 GVWR. We can stay under it, but it seems like a small load capacity for such a large trailer. Like others, we have a cover over the pickup bed and extra chairs, bbq and bikes go there.

pulsar wrote:


In other words, all RV's are required by federal regulation to have a "true weight" CCC label.

Tom

Hopefully the OP is looking at yellow stickers, and not brochure weights, which still have no legal requirement to reflect reality (hence the number of "mandatory options" on many trailers.