Upgrade Tires

This subject has been thoroughly discussed in countless threads, and everyone has their opinions on which brand is better.

As this thread is following the argumentative trend of the others, it is meeting the same end.

Thread closed.

Jim,

From someone that often disagrees with you, and has been confrontational with you, but respects you experience and knowledge,

This comment of yours,

" Very few RV trailer mfg will puta 80 psi rated wheel on a trailer with 15" 205/75-15 C tires. From all the posts I've seen most are the 50 psi rated wheels. Most with the 225/75-15 C or a D tire report a 75 psi rated wheel. "

And this comment of someone else,

“Jim assumes that the trailer manufacturers only use a 50 PSI wheel”

Proves my opinion in this comment that,

“as a matter of fact most of the argument comes from some that try to twist words and meanings of phrases into a strict and incorrect, this or that, that drives the argument…”

this is not meant to be a flame, no matter how much it seems to be,
but It also shows their lack of credibility, reasonability, and responsibility, whose only purpose is to be argumentative in these threads…

gmw photos wrote:

JJBIRISH wrote:

....snip....

..... the first choice to reduce tire failure risk is good tire maintenance and not over loading or under inflating the tire (including while parked or stored) or exceeding the speed rating…

If you need tires anyway, just buying a better tire the correct size can reduce risk…

Jack,
My major "problem" with this whole tire failure issue relating to trailers ( not just travel trailers, but horse, equipment, and cargo trailers as well ) is this: let's assume for a moment that everybody keeps their tire correctly inflated. I know that is a false assumption, but let's assume for the sake of argument, that all the tires rolling down the road, or even parked, are correctly inflated. That leads us to your other point, and that being this is an industry that is notorious as we have seen for fitting tires that are barely adequate regarding load carry capacity. And then we get into your part of the comment, "just buying a better tire...."

....I'm going to take that comment and put my spin on it, and that is, using a LT tire is a step in that direction. And again, not trying to start a flame war here, but after all, the title of this thread is "upgrade tires". My experience, and observation has been that LT tires have been more reliable, and longer lasting. In my mind that could certainly be construed to mean, they "are of better quality".

Personally, I make sure "all" of my numbers work. I am not a trained engineer, so I place faith that what these guys and gals write into their specs are far more likely to have merit than any guess I can make on my own.

To me, this is not really all that hard folks...write to the company that made your wheels. Write to the company that built your trailer. Find out what the specs are. Ask what standards the components are built to, and then research those standards.

This whole argument as to whether Maxxis tires are any good or not, I have no idea. I have not used them. Are they "just another ST tire".....or are they "a tire that will meet and exceed my needs" ??? I do not know the answer to that question, but what I "do know" is the various LT tires that I have chosen for my four different trailers have worked ( knock wood ) as they should. In other words, I have found what works for me, and as long as it's on my nickel, I am going to stick with what works.

I have no single argument with anything you have said, and don’t believe I have ever posted any differently…

It is and has been my opinion for some time and I have stated it many times that the Maxxis M8008 is the” best ST tire” made today… I don’t believe that is in conflict with your statement though… … I have also stated I only personally in depth and thoroughly researched the Maxxis that fits my trailer…

I have one issue with using the LT tire and that has nothing to do with the tire but with the tire companies lack of responsibility on the subject… we won’t even get into that here…

JJBIRISH wrote:

....snip....

..... the first choice to reduce tire failure risk is good tire maintenance and not over loading or under inflating the tire (including while parked or stored) or exceeding the speed rating…

If you need tires anyway, just buying a better tire the correct size can reduce risk…

Jack,
My major "problem" with this whole tire failure issue relating to trailers ( not just travel trailers, but horse, equipment, and cargo trailers as well ) is this: let's assume for a moment that everybody keeps their tire correctly inflated. I know that is a false assumption, but let's assume for the sake of argument, that all the tires rolling down the road, or even parked, are correctly inflated. That leads us to your other point, and that being this is an industry that is notorious as we have seen for fitting tires that are barely adequate regarding load carry capacity. And then we get into your part of the comment, "just buying a better tire...."

....I'm going to take that comment and put my spin on it, and that is, using a LT tire is a step in that direction. And again, not trying to start a flame war here, but after all, the title of this thread is "upgrade tires". My experience, and observation has been that LT tires have been more reliable, and longer lasting. In my mind that could certainly be construed to mean, they "are of better quality".

Personally, I make sure "all" of my numbers work. I am not a trained engineer, so I place faith that what these guys and gals write into their specs are far more likely to have merit than any guess I can make on my own.

To me, this is not really all that hard folks...write to the company that made your wheels. Write to the company that built your trailer. Find out what the specs are. Ask what standards the components are built to, and then research those standards.

This whole argument as to whether Maxxis tires are any good or not, I have no idea. I have not used them. Are they "just another ST tire".....or are they "a tire that will meet and exceed my needs" ??? I do not know the answer to that question, but what I "do know" is the various LT tires that I have chosen for my four different trailers have worked ( knock wood ) as they should. In other words, I have found what works for me, and as long as it's on my nickel, I am going to stick with what works.

JIMNLIN wrote:

Jim assumes that the trailer manufacturers only use a 50 PSI wheel .

Your assumption is incorrect.
I never said anywhere that trailer mfg only use a 50 psi wheel. I have mentioned some members have stated their ST205/75-14" C tires came with 50 psi rated wheels. We also have lots of members reporting a 65 or 75 psi rated 15" wheels with their ST205/75-15 C tires. And some members have said their ST225/75-15 D tires came with 75 psi and 80 psi.

Jim you posted yesterday at 5:56 pm
" Very few RV trailer mfg will puta 80 psi rated wheel on a trailer with 15" 205/75-15 C tires. From all the posts I've seen most are the 50 psi rated wheels. Most with the 225/75-15 C or a D tire report a 75 psi rated wheel. "

Barry,
That makes a lot of sense and boils it done to trading risk and assuming one risk is better than another, or the one risk is less than another…

If that is the only choice I too would chose the lower of the two risk… but without all the information it’s no longer a choice or even a assumption… it’s a guess…

If the choices is yours, and it is to install a tire that isn’t properly fitted with the rim, you have also added the risk of negligent liability on top of the higher risk of rim failure…
But fortunately that isn’t your only choice…

If cost is the driving factor, the first choice to reduce tire failure risk is good tire maintenance and not over loading or under inflating the tire (including while parked or stored) or exceeding the speed rating…

If you need tires anyway, just buying a better tire the correct size can reduce risk…

Up sizing to a higher capacity tire that correctly fits the rim and falls within its ratings (might require calling the mfg.) can be prudent…

or for a minimal cost the correct rim sized for the upsized tire can be added and would almost always be the best choice… almost because the benefit of upsizing reaches a point of rapid diminishing returns quickly…



or you could throw all caution to the wind and go all out cost be damned…

Balancing my newly and highly upgraded trailer tires…
I did need new rims… 13,200@131

Jim assumes that the trailer manufacturers only use a 50 PSI wheel .

Your assumption is incorrect.
I never said anywhere that trailer mfg only use a 50 psi wheel. I have mentioned some members have stated their ST205/75-14" C tires came with 50 psi rated wheels. We also have lots of members reporting a 65 or 75 psi rated 15" wheels with their ST205/75-15 C tires. And some members have said their ST225/75-15 D tires came with 75 psi and 80 psi.

JJBIRISH wrote:

PartyMarty wrote:
.......CapriRacer has posted that the wheel manufacturers do not have PSI as a factor in rating their wheels . Only a weight rating .

Then CapriRacer with all due respect is wrong and I doubt he said exactly what you are saying, and if he did he should come forth with the evidence to support he professional opinion…

Allow me to clarify.

There are no government regulations that require a max inflation pressure be stamped on wheels. Many wheels are NOT marked with a maximum inflation pressure. (and please note the word "many"). - and the important thing is that some are.

And the above is based on observation. I used to work in a tire lab where we had a bunch of wheels, and I was hard pressed to find ANY with a maximum pressure stamped on the wheel. I always puzzled over why that was so. I have talked to several wheel design engineers and to a man, they've all said that inflation pressure plays a minor role in the stresses on wheels.

And just so folks understand - motor vehicle manufacturers have thoughtfully arranged it so that bolt patterns can be used to determine what load is applied to the wheel. So designing a wheel becomes a bit easier as the bolt pattern determines that load and inflation pressure needed - and the wheels are designed appropriately. It's hard to do this wrong.

Further, motor vehicle manufacturers have pretty good feedback systems (called "a warranty system") and tire and wheel failures get investigated.

Unfortunately, we can not say the same for trailer manufacturers. They typically put on minimal tires and wheels (and sometimes less than minimal). And they have virtually no feedback system for tires and wheels. Further, unlike the tires on motor vehicles, trailer tire manufacturers don't have their own feedback systems. They are virtually blind to any sort of negativity. (OK, I'll concede that Goodyear and Maxxis have their own warranty systems and are likely to "see" the sorts of problem we have been discussing - but I'll point out that every other trailer tire manufacturer doesn't.)

As a result we are struggling to compensate. The discussion on wheels and inflation pressure is the result of the attempts to upgrade the load carrying capacity of the tires by increasing the inflation pressure. This has resulted in people confronted with the problem of the wheel limitation. So what to do about it?

In an ideal world, people would use wheels that are matched to the inflation pressure. But people don't want to spend money un-necessarily, so the question boils down to: Is it better to use a tire with the inflation pressure that seems to result in a certain level of risk for a tire failure? - OR - Is it better to risk a wheel failure, by using a higher inflation pressure?

That appears to me to be the choice we are trying to discuss. I'll leave the conclusion to those confronted with the problem, and I'll assist in helping sort this out where I can.

Is there anybody on this forum that has an RV steel wheel that is stamped 50 PSI ?
JJ says his is 70 PSI .
Fla-Gypsy says his has a weight rating but no maximum psi rating .
JJ cannot decide if the tire blows first or the wheel blows first .
Jim assumes that the trailer manufacturers only use a 50 PSI wheel .
So far , nobody has come forward and claimed to have a wheel marked 50 psi maximum .
So far nobody has claimed to blow up an RV steel wheel .
Only the Maxxis Cheerleaders are trying to prevent the rest of us from using the proper solution to upgrading our RV tires .
The proper solution to upgrading is to increase the load weight rating that is posted on the sidewall of the tire .
The simplest way to do that is to go to a Load Range D or Load range E tire and inflate to the maximum psi shown on the sidewall or as stamped on the wheel .
If you have room go to a 225 tire instead of a 205 tire .

Lowsuv wrote:
Is there any person on this forum that has blown up a steel RV wheel due to over inflation ?

A RV wheel ?? Didn't know their were such wheels. Rvs like all trailer types come with trailer wheels unless the hubs are special and require same type of hub centered wheels like we use on our trucks.

I've split several 15" steel wheels on my equipment trailers from over pressuring which isn't bad for over 800k miles towing commercially.

Have I split a wheel on my RV ?? No as I match the wheels pressure rating to the tires pressure rating on all the RVs I've had.

The statement that " as has also been pointed out, there are a ton of reports of ST tire failures with hardly any reports of wheel failures" has a simple explanation. The wheels aren't the issue here as they were matched to the tires pressure (load range) and load ratings so why would they fail because the tire did.

Dexter says this about inflation and load;

"Tires of greater capacity should never be mounted on wheels of a lower capacity since most end-users will inflate and load them to the rating embossed in the tire. This practice can result in dangerous failure of the wheel which may lead to an accident."


Got a question for you guys pushing wheels don't have different pressure rating 'cause there all are rated at 80 psi.
Why do you think a trailer wheel mfg like Dexter (and other mfg) markets 4 different 15" wheels that carry different psi and load reguirements;

...017-347-xx... 15x5JJ ...5-4.5...1820@ 50 psi
...017-345-xx... 15x6JJ ...5-4.5...2050@ 65 psi
...017-326-xx ...15x6JJ ...6-5.5...2600@ 75 psi
...017-348-xx... 15x6JJ ...6-5.5...2830@ 80 psi

Very few RV trailer mfg will puta 80 psi rated wheel on a trailer with 15" 205/75-15 C tires. From all the posts I've seen most are the 50 psi rated wheels. Most with the 225/75-15 C or a D tire report a 75 psi rated wheel.

George,

thanks, we also know we disagree on some things, and are able to respect our differences and agreements… :)

and your key phrase LIKELY makes sense and changes the whole argument… as a matter of fact most of the argument comes from some that try to twist words and meanings of phrases into a strict and incorrect, this or that, that drives the argument… like the ridiculous post several before yours re-asking a question I already gave my opinion on…

I read the SAE article what’s funny is I have done a lot of contract work for them and worked inside their offices many times in my day job… nice people and I have pumped them for information many times on different subjects over many years… but not about this subject…

anyhow with their minimum 65psi test procedure it seems obvious to me it is not a standard being applied to many trailer wheels at least for rating the wheel… if it did I wouldn’t find so many rims rated for lower psi ratings, and my rims rated 70 psi wouldn’t fall into any of the test pressures…
I would have no way of knowing if it failed the 80psi test pressure or aced the 65psi test pressure… just the rims I posted in this thread had psi ratings of 60, 70, and 95… and each manufacture seems to have different criteria…

So I will sit back and await for someone to offer answers to the what I believe to be logical questions about the rims and the cheerleader remarks…