V-10 problems

dodge guy wrote:
I have an 02 Excursion with the V-10 and 4.30 gears. I tow a 9200lb TT with no problems. Combined I'm about 17,500lbs. It'll do 60 with no problem up a mountain! It needs to rev! 4500 all day long!

The 4.10's are OK, but the 4.30's are the best, part of me wishes I would've went with 4.56's.

As far as the 5star tune, best money you can spend at this point. The biggest change is the shift programming. It makes a big difference in towing. No more short shifting and going into O/D too early. Worth every penny!


The diesel guys hate this but it will hang with a stock diesel of similar vintage all day long!

The OP would be happier with his V-10 if it had more gear behind it, his trailer isn't all that heavy, so if the truck is properly setup and driven correctly (get used to the sound of some revs!) it would do just fine for his usage. Yes, at the higher altitudes it (and any other NA engine) will loose some power, but again the OP's combined weight isn't that high.
Like Dodge Guy above, I too run a V-10 Excursion which serves as our dedicated tow rig for our 11,000 lb TT. I have regeared it to 4.88s but with my 35" tires it has an effective ratio of 4.39, which makes a big difference in getting the most out of these motors. With our combined weight of approx. 19,000 lbs I have held 60 MPH while fighting heavy truck traffic on I-81 up Fancy Gap in VA. We have only towed all through the Eastern states and haven't made it out West yet but that climb is one of the East's most challenging and our setup did just fine. I do run Banks headers, 5Star tunes and a performance muffler but the single biggest towing performance mod you can do for your V-10 rig is go with the deeper gears. I actually ran the 4.88s with stock sized tires for 2 full years and the thing pulled like a locomotive, better than a stock diesel of the same vintage, same as Dodge Guy's rig. The OP has the higher output 3 Valve V-10 and the much better transmission, so I am very confident that with a change to deeper gears he would be very happy with that 7,500 lb TT in the Western mountains, if he is willing to let the engine work as designed at the higher revs.

Turtle, you are preaching to the quire. :W

Personally I do not think pulling grades with an RV should be like the pike's peak race. What are folks accomplishing by hammering it going up hill?

It has to be a mind set that I do not understand. I do not give a flip when pulling a long grade when someone blows by me with a big heat contrail coming out the pipe. How much real time is being saved?

Gesus, not this again. :R One more time...........

The OP wants to go faster up hill. That takes more HP. Gears don't give you more HP; only more torque and torque is not HP. If all he needed more torque to the wheels all he has to do is drop a gear. But as Grit points out, this will slow him down even further.

Couple that with the fact that the OP does not like to go above 4,000 RPM but wants to climb hills at a high speed.

To climb that hill at the fastest speed the OP is going to have to hold that V10 to as close to 4,750 as possible. He doesn't seem to want to do this so there is no solution to this problem unless he wants to buy a new diesel. Then he can pull a mountain at high speed and make maximum HP at under 4K RPM and get 30% better mileage while doing so.

theoldwizard1 wrote:

midnightsadie wrote:
I agree with the right gears you could pull a freight train.

CONCUR !

I suspect he needs a lower rear axle ratio, like a 3.73 or possibly even a 4.10.

Except you didn't read, he says he has 4.10s.....

midnightsadie wrote:
I agree with the right gears you could pull a freight train.

True, and they are a very good engine in general, however the proverbial freight train would still get pulled slowly at very high rpms uphill at altitude.

To the op, nothing wrong with your engine unless it's not running right.
Look at the stats on your old 350. Likely around 200hp/300ft lbs. look at the V10. Around 350?hp/375ft lbs. just approximately guys. Didn't look it up.
Look at the most powerful recent gassers, 8.1, EcoB, newer 6.x engines. They are around 400/400.
Take all those and lop almost 1/3 off the numbers when you get between 1 and 2 miles up from sea level. Except the ecoboost.
Look at stock diesels in the last 10-15 years. 300/500 ish up to now 400/900+. With many running 1000+ tq with mild tunes. Take away only a couple percent at altitude due to forced induction and you'll get a feel for why your 10 year old V10 doesn't blow your socks off.
Run it with your right leg fully extended going up hill and don't watch the gas gauge! You have a good engine.

The V10 is still used in the Class 4 and up chassis cabs. It should be a reliable and solid engine if you have it geared properly for your use.

midnightsadie wrote:
I agree with the right gears you could pull a freight train.

CONCUR !

I suspect he needs a lower rear axle ratio, like a 3.73 or possibly even a 4.10.

If you get a diesel make sure that you learn about the down side also. I did for preference and improved mileage but if you aren't driving it all the time takes a long time to recoup the increased acquisition/maintenace cost if its purely a fuel economy choice. Do you mind plugging in when cold, do you mind the increased noise (depends on vintage), diesel fuel availability, smell/smoke (again depends on vintage), fuel additives and increase maintenance possibility, etc

My V10s were quick turn keys only issue was trans which I could have had rebuilt by Woods or BTS and slight increase in towing fuel. My V10 would get 10 mpg towing trailer the 6.0l stock would get 12 mpg, tuned/deleted slighty more. The 6.4l stock wasn't as good (regen) but the 6.7l was slightly better than stock about equal to tuned/deleted but needed DPF fluid and had to be extra sensitive for fuel sources cause was worried about the WIF (water in fuel) issues that gave some owners grief.

My 6.0l would rattle when started cold to allow it to preheat (takes longer to warm up). My tuned/deleted one sounded like a jet when it would kick in high idle to warm up. The 6.4L was quieter and the 6.7. sounded almost like a gasser but there is a price delta for each jump in vintage/technology.

jmacpolo wrote:
Maybe I should be looking at a diesel. What kind of mileage will a diesel get doing 65 up a grade? What kind of mileage do they get while not towing? I an not pulling 14,000 lbs I am pulling a little under 7,000. Which diesel truck will get me up the hill at 65 and deliver the best mileage?

Thanks,
John

I had a stock Excursion V10 with 4.30 gear and only Magnaflow cat back. It was in tip top shape and would yawn pulling my trailer in sig at over 65 mph going through the grades from IL to FL. Got used to hearing 10 cylinders firing each moderate grade but the speed didn't budge except on the steepest.

My stock 6.0l was an improvement but wasn't day to night to me as some describe it. The worst part of the V10 drivetrain was the trans which was shifted less than smartly and seemed sloppy when its temps increased. The 5/6 sp behind diesel always shifted crisp and never chased gears. Now tuned and deleted is another story but being fair the V10 is a pulling machine in its own right. Nearly bulletproof from Ford only issues it has is an occasional COP going out or spark plug spitting if they weren't installed correctly. I only had to replace COP myself.

Now the big 3 diesels are putting out much more than they did 99-05 when the V10 was used in the Excursion. If they increased the technology on that engine like other gassers and diesels I am sure it would be that much a better engine prolly a hard pressed option to diesel for light to medium loads.

I have driven the 7.3L IDI, powerstroke, 6.0L, 6.4L and of course the 6.7L and technology and progress has done wonders for what is available.

The_real_wild1 wrote:

dodge guy wrote:
I have an 02 Excursion with the V-10 and 4.30 gears. I tow a 9200lb TT with no problems. Combined I'm about 17,500lbs. It'll do 60 with no problem up a mountain! It needs to rev! 4500 all day long!

The 4.10's are OK, but the 4.30's are the best, part of me wishes I would've went with 4.56's.

As far as the 5star tune, best money you can spend at this point. The biggest change is the shift programming. It makes a big difference in towing. No more short shifting and going into O/D too early. Worth every penny!


The diesel guys hate this but it will hang with a stock diesel of similar vintage all day long!

I was going to say something about the diesel comment until I finished the sentence. lol

jmacpolo wrote:
Maybe I should be looking at a diesel. What kind of mileage will a diesel get doing 65 up a grade? What kind of mileage do they get while not towing? I an not pulling 14,000 lbs I am pulling a little under 7,000. Which diesel truck will get me up the hill at 65 and deliver the best mileage?

Thanks,
John

On any given grade and weight a diesel will give you around 30% better mileage then a gas rig. If you get 10 with a gas rig a diesel will net you about 13 MPG.

They are all about the same. 19-20 on the Hwy. 16-17 mix and ugly in the city. (It takes a lot of energy to get a big truck up to speed light after light after light.) :E

Sorry, but you are pulling around 14K give or take unless your truck and stuff and you are made out of helium.

Again, all of the big 3 get about the same mileage and anybody that tells you different is a fan boi. :B