When will it end

Spoon, I think we agree; for the most part anyway.

Think of this. You say you want more efficiency. But then you say that "most" people want more power. As Joe Dirt would say: "It's not about you brutha; it's about the CONSUME-Aaaa." You want Snakes and sparklers. :B

GM or Ford or Ram or whoever is just following the money trail. If the consumer wants power they are going to give them power. "When" the consumer wants economy, that's what they will give them.

Remember in 70 when we had 450 HP 454's? Then in 72 we had the Vega? LOL. What changed? When the gas crisis hit and gas tripled and then some, the CONSUMER changed!

A friend has a 1969 427 tri-power Vett. When the gas thing hit he traded it straight across for a Dotson pickup!!! He had to get to work and he couldn't do that with the Vett.

The bottom line is this: If you own a diesel and want better fuel economy just keep your foot out of it and you will get better fuel economy. You want better fuel economy, buy a more aero trailer like a hi-lo or pop up. Or buy an eco-diesel.

You also can get a de-tuner just like a tuner. My friend did this with his Volvo tractor he tows with. He detuned it to 350 HP because he could not control his right foot. Now it only puts out 350 HP (and fuel through the engine) no matter how much he pushes his right foot down.

Much like my 6,000 lb 5.7 diesel caddie can only use 105 HP worth of fuel. That's why a car as big and heavy as the Titanic and get and honest 30 MPG out on the highway! :E

The only thing I wish the big three would offer on their diesel pickups is a Eco/Power tuner. You just be boppin around solo? You can put you tune on Eco. If you are towing, you can put your tune on power. The problem with that is government regulation.

Turtle n Peeps wrote:
Choose economy or power............or something in between. You can't have all three or even two at once. You want clean air? It's going to take some energy (fuel) to do this too.

A lot of people, myself included, think that we have sufficient power and want more efficiency. The marketing strategy of the big 3 is for more power, because that is what sells. Therefore it would seem that the majority want power over efficiency.

In regards to the rest of your post, I have to disagree with it. Look at trucks from 20 year ago as opposed to today. More power, cleaner burning and more fuel efficient. I'm not a diesel engineer by any means. Much smarter people than me have been working on this technology for a long time and are making headwinds. I'm not sure how much juice is left in the squeeze, but I doubt we have reached 100% efficiency. I don't have a clue how much money it will cost to gain another 10% efficiency or whether its even worth it.

I concur!!!

Turtle n Peeps wrote:
Some of you don't know how a diesel engine works by some of the replies.

A diesel engine is throttled by the amount of fuel that it is given by your right foot at any given time. Always was from the very first one. At idle, the air to fuel might be 100 to 1. At full power it might be 8 to 1.

With a "diesel engine" you are the master of your fuel economy with your right foot. Want better economy? Don't press so hard with your right foot. Want more power? Press harder with your right foot.

And before the whiners and nit pickers start, let me say this right now. Yes I know that if you put a tuner on your engine and jack the timing to the moon you may pick up a slight amount of efficiency. I also know that your NOX will go out of sight on the smog machine so the OEM people can't do this.

Right now at this time "almost" every single molecule of fuel is burned in a gasoline engine. Go read your smog printout if you don't believe me. Mine in a 10 YO car has 0 HC's coming out of the pipe. How do you get below 0 anyway?

Ut oh, I can hear the nit pickers again and they want to talk about that pesky efficiency number. They say, "well what about that 20% efficiency number for those gasoline engines." "What about that, hu!"

Well how do you propose to capture more heat or even more noise that comes out of the tail pipe for more work? Yes, even the noise that comes out of the pipe is wasted energy. How do you propose to get bearing and ring drag down to zero?

You want better fuel mileage? Buy a smaller truck with less HP. Buy an Ecodiesel. "But then I can't tow my 38' 5er" you say? Too bad, you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Choose economy or power............or something in between. You can't have all three or even two at once. You want clean air? It's going to take some energy (fuel) to do this too.

X2

Some of you don't know how a diesel engine works by some of the replies.

A diesel engine is throttled by the amount of fuel that it is given by your right foot at any given time. Always was from the very first one. At idle, the air to fuel might be 100 to 1. At full power it might be 8 to 1.

With a "diesel engine" you are the master of your fuel economy with your right foot. Want better economy? Don't press so hard with your right foot. Want more power? Press harder with your right foot.

And before the whiners and nit pickers start, let me say this right now. Yes I know that if you put a tuner on your engine and jack the timing to the moon you may pick up a slight amount of efficiency. I also know that your NOX will go out of sight on the smog machine so the OEM people can't do this.

Right now at this time "almost" every single molecule of fuel is burned in a gasoline engine. Go read your smog printout if you don't believe me. Mine in a 10 YO car has 0 HC's coming out of the pipe. How do you get below 0 anyway?

Ut oh, I can hear the nit pickers again and they want to talk about that pesky efficiency number. They say, "well what about that 20% efficiency number for those gasoline engines." "What about that, hu!"

Well how do you propose to capture more heat or even more noise that comes out of the tail pipe for more work? Yes, even the noise that comes out of the pipe is wasted energy. How do you propose to get bearing and ring drag down to zero?

You want better fuel mileage? Buy a smaller truck with less HP. Buy an Ecodiesel. "But then I can't tow my 38' 5er" you say? Too bad, you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Choose economy or power............or something in between. You can't have all three or even two at once. You want clean air? It's going to take some energy (fuel) to do this too.

When people stop buying these overpriced trucks. I saw my first one on a dealer's website with a $100K plus MSRP. Forgot what it was, think it was a Ford.
Gman

Better fuel mileage would be great and I'm content with the power of my current truck. I wouldn't buy a new truck just to get more power or better fuel mileage.

What to me is the most impressive about the newer trucks is the longevity that they have.

I'm sitting at about 137,000 miles and my truck still runs like new, doesn't use a drop of oil and the the maintenance cost are half what they used to be while having twice the HP and better fuel mileage than they got in the old days.

Its all relevant but I can't comprehend $70,000.00 for a new pickup truck.

wowens79 wrote:

SweetLou wrote:
So what? They aren't racers if you keep it stock. Look at what the gassers are doing as far as cars. HP is still only 400 in a diesel so I don't get your point. In trucks its all about torque right? The design isn't about mpg, but the next thing they need to give us is the ability to switch off the HP and turn on MPG when you want it.

An Econ switch would be nice. My wife's Honda CRV has one, and you can really tell the difference in power and fuel economy when you turn on the econ. I turn it off around town, but use it on the highway.

All vehicles have an Econ switch. It's variable and just to the right of the brake pedal.

(Here's hoping for 1000+ ft lbs from the factory!)
Pretty awesome time in history when you can buy pickup trucks that post up semi truck like numbers and 700/800hp off the lot domestic cars......anyone who doesn't like it can feel free to buy a 70s/80s turd and live the slow life! Haha

kw/00 wrote:
I often ask when will the continuous price increases ever end? Lol Trucks have got way to expensive...!!

If you count for inflation and trucks that are apples to apples then prices in 1997 are roughly the same as today. For example, a 1997 F150 Lariat super cab 4x4 base price was roughly $26,500 new. Accounting for inflation, that is $40,300 today. You can get the same kind of options found in a 1997 Lariat standard on an XLT today, and a 2017 F150 XLT super cab 4x4 with a 5.0L has an MSRP of $40,600 on Fords website. So if you compare trucks with the same options and account for inflation, they really don't cost that much more.

1stgenfarmboy wrote:
I get 13 mpg pulling a 7,500lb TT, with my 93 W350 4X4, i think that is pretty good when looking at what new 60k $ trucks can do.

60K and that's not considered high anymore. If you kept the truck for 10 years that would be a cost of $500 a month plus insurance, fuel, and who knows what else just to lug a house around behind you.

A record 84.5 percent of shoppers who acquired a new car last quarter used financing, either a loan or a lease. That’s the highest level since Experian Automotive, an information service company, began tracking this data in 2006. Back in 2008, before the recession, that metric was 79.7 percent.

I know that's what it is, but it just blows my mind. Just like everyone in Mexico believes, Americans really are rich.