Canada Never Again

[Jim_and_Barb]

A friend and I were accused of being drug dealers at the boarder by the Canadian BP. Here is what happened We were flagged by BP to secondary because of my friends past 42 years ago when he was 18. When they were searching the Fiver they found three bottles of medications that belong to my wife. Who was scheduled to fly up and meet us in Anchorage next week. She put her Meds in the fifth wheel so she would not be without while touring Alaska. The Canadians were going to fine us for her Meds and accused us of being dealers. They stated that the fines would be in the thousands just for possession and hundred`s for each pill over 200 count, not hard when she gets 90 day supply. Then they wanted to fine me $500 for the pepper spray I had in my door that has been there for years I had forgotten about. In the end they took my spray and returned all of the Meds and asked us if we paid $3000 to see a group of supervisors they might or might not let us in and the fee was not refundable. My question is if we were the bad criminals the treated us as. Why did they give us back the drugs and asked us to leave Canada ??????? So BEWARE IF YOU OR YOUR SPOUSE TAKE MEDS MAIL THEM TO YOUR FIRST STOP IN ALASKA. This is why I will never again will I ever set foot in Canada. :M This was a poor attempt to shakedown us for $$$$$$$$$

[Jack_Diane_Free]

If your travelling friend's conviction years ago was for anything to do with drugs that would put you instantly into the secondary inspection. Then they find a controlled substance that you did not declare (your wife's drugs in large quantity) and then further they found a prohibited weapon (pepper spray) that you did not declare. I think if you had done a little more homework before trying to cross that you would not have a problem. Kind of sucks though that your trip was ruined.

[joe_b_]

This was a situation that could have been avoided if the OP had gotten himself informed of the rules ahead of time.
If he had asked on this forum or checked the published regulations, if
Can I enter Canada with pepper spray?
Can I enter Canada with someone else's prescription drugs?
Can I enter Canada with a friend that has a criminal record?

The answer would have been a resounding NO, you can not do any of these.

The time to ask is before, not after. In this Information Age we now live in, keeping one's self informed is not too difficult, IMHO.

As they say, talk is cheap, until you hire an attorney to represent you, as the friend would have had to do to gain entry into Canada. Not hard at all for me to see how $3000 could be spent on the legal process.

[jspence1]

rockhillmanor wrote:
When I read the forums about border crossings and they list what you should do and how you should act just to get across the border like don't wear sun glasses, don't smile, don't say this and don't say that, and god for bid don't look them in the eye etc etc.....reminds me of the horror stories of crossing the borders during world war II.

Do people cross back and forth without a problem yes. But for me hearing the stories like this one and MANY others just convinces me that it is not worth the chance of being the one selected out for this type of abuse by ANY government north or south.

I travel with a bag of meds for my dog that has seizures. I couldn't even fathom what one of these crazy border guards would do with that on board my MH. He can't live without them and I can't cross a border with them. What does that tell you about the governments north and south now a days?

The OP's experience could happen to 'anyone' of us and IMHO he shouldn't be slammed for it just because others have flown thru boarder crossings without incidence.

I find it very disturbing that honest citizens of any country are 'judged' and 'abused' when crossing borders solely because of what criminal drug dealers do.

Border crossings are not difficult, use common sense take your hat and sunglasses off, seriously whats the issue here if they can't see your face why not remove the photo from the passport. Be honest with them and you won't have problems.

You can bring any medications across the border if they are prescribed to a person in the vehicle.

How do you tell the honest citizens from the criminals? Are they wearing a special hat and sunglasses? I have absolutely no problem providing any and all information to border services. I figure it it keeps one nut job with a bomb out of our countries it is well worth the few minutes of inconvenience.

My entire family have NEXUS we all submitted to back ground checks were finger printed and had retinal scans done. We are still required to talk to someone at border services and in my opinion we are asked the exact same questions as before and the interview is the same length. The people working the nexus lanes do seem to be happier and more friendly probably as a result of knowing everyone is pre screened and only having to look for stupidity and ignorance not malicious intent.

[tandkj]

Having read all of the posts, it appears something we left out of the original post. I have traveled into Canada many times in the MH and not been stopped for anything. More to this story than posted. JMHO.

[Tom_N]

1. Your friend probably had a felony conviction 42 years ago.

2. You had a large supply (100's) of prescription drugs with no prescription.

3. You had pepper spray which is illegal to import into Canada.

?

[Luke_Porter]

Jim and Barb wrote:
While traveling the Fifth Wheel as well as a Motorhome`s are considered a your secondary residence that's why there are specific laws that address search and seizure in the states ,you would think Canada would follow the same.

Are you suggesting Canada shouldn't be able to search anything that comes into the country?

[jspence1]

Your treatment at the border was definitely related to the person you were traveling with. I've crossed the border 100's of times and have only had one serious problem when traveling with a friend with a criminal record, had I known he wouldn't have been in my car it was a massive pain in the ass. Fortunately we didn't have anything with us, but the process was scary we got searched in the US before they turned us back to Canada and we got searched again in Canada.

Buy some "Bear Spray" you can travel with it as long as it is clearly marked as animal repellant.

As far as the "extortion" is concerned I'm inclined to believe that they were informing of the possible fines associated with what you were importing.

99% of all my dealings with border services have been great, they have a tough job. I challenge anyone to do their job for a day, you have 60 seconds to access if a person is a threat all while trying to keep a positive attitude and being friendly. People in general can be difficult, put them in a line of idling cars for an hour waiting to talk to the guy in the booth and you have a lot of potential for things to go wrong.

But feel free to blame Canada, we can take it.

[Community Alumni]

rockhillmanor wrote:
........

I travel with a bag of meds for my dog that has seizures. I couldn't even fathom what one of these crazy border guards would do with that on board my MH. He can't live without them and I can't cross a border with them.

............

Actually you can cross with meds, you just need to declare them and provide information as to what they are. My wife and I cross weekly with either my Jeep or the motorhome and we carry many medications including one that I require on occasion that is a considered a narcotic. I carry a copy of the prescriptions from the drug store with us and never have an issue crossing them.

[Community Alumni]

Sorry to read about your border experience.

Obviously there are lessons to be learned here for those of us who travel across the border on a regular basis. We really need to clearly understand what the regulations are, what we are crossing with and the history of any passengers that may be with us.

Even as Nexus card holders, my wife and I have had a problem from time to time due to misinterpretation if a situation while crossing on both sides of the border. Unfortunately there is really never any room for opinions, border agents on both sides have to deal with thousands of people while applying the rules in black & white.

[rockhillmanor]

When I read the forums about border crossings and they list what you should do and how you should act just to get across the border like don't wear sun glasses, don't smile, don't say this and don't say that, and god for bid don't look them in the eye etc etc.....reminds me of the horror stories of crossing the borders during world war II.

Do people cross back and forth without a problem yes. But for me hearing the stories like this one and MANY others just convinces me that it is not worth the chance of being the one selected out for this type of abuse by ANY government north or south.

I travel with a bag of meds for my dog that has seizures. I couldn't even fathom what one of these crazy border guards would do with that on board my MH. He can't live without them and I can't cross a border with them. What does that tell you about the governments north and south now a days?

The OP's experience could happen to 'anyone' of us and IMHO he shouldn't be slammed for it just because others have flown thru boarder crossings without incidence.

I find it very disturbing that honest citizens of any country are 'judged' and 'abused' when crossing borders solely because of what criminal drug dealers do.

[JaxDad]

While I sympathize with the unpleasant time you had at the border, it seems that the issue was self-inflicted.

You're posting here so you have access to the Internet, the Canadian Border Services Agency has all the information you need regarding what is or is not allowed across the border. Similarly you can 'pre-clear' a person online to avoid the time & effort at the border.

As for your 5'er being a "secondary residence", the rules are almost the same in Canada & the US, if its parked on private property it could be (subject to certain conditions) a secondary residence, but when it's rolling down the road with a license on the back, it's a vehicle and no different than the truck pulling your 5'er.

I'm willing to bet the nice folks on the US side of the border would take issue with someone trying to enter the country with controlled drugs not prescribed to them and a prohibited weapon.

[michelb]

I'm sorry for your trouble but I don't think you can get mad because you were caught breaking multiple laws. As far as the pills, you were caught smuggling controlled substances that aren't in your name - that's against the law and it's against the law entering the US as well. You were also caught smuggling a restricted weapon in Canada (see page 3 here http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/pub/bsf5044-eng.pdf).

I suspect you might have been treated better if you had disclosed these things when you first entered but it doesn't sound like you did. Among the questions border guards always ask is 'Do you have anything to declare?' (pretty much open-ended, all encompassing), 'Do you have any firearms or weapons?' (you did) and 'Do you have any alcohol, tobacco or controlled substances?' (you did) Even if they didn't ask you, it's still your responsibility to be aware of the law (e.g. Border guards don't usually ask if you are carrying any heroin or any radiactive material but that doesn't mean you're allowed to if they don't ask ...)

As far as your friend past from 42 years ago, unfortunately, there's nothing you can do about that and it's going to come up every time. My wife was refused access to the US about 15 years ago because she was travelling with me and I had a US work permit. Since we were not legally married in the eyes of the US (we were common-law which is considered married in Canada but not in the US), she did not qualify as my dependant so could only enter as a tourist which is for up to 6 months. We had called ahead and had been told that it shouldn't be a problem but it's always at the discretion of the border guard. We were only going to the US for 6 weeks and told them that right from the start but because technically I could stay in the US indefinitely, she was denied entry because the border guard did not think she'd return to Canada if I decided to stay in the US longer ... Since she was refused entry to the US that time, now, whenever she tries to enter the US, she has to disclose that she was refused entry 15 years ago and is subject to further investigation. We were curious so we asked exactly what that meant a few years: If she doesn't disclose it and the guard notices it (it shows up on her profile at the border), she would probably be refused entry and likely banned from the US. The Border Guard are also entitled to seize the vehicle she is travelling in and anything in the vehicle since she tried to enter illegally.

As far as the indiscretion being 40 years ago and your friend having paid for it. That's not in the eyes of Border Guards. I have a friend who was charged with assault as a minor about 25 years ago in Canada. He spent 1 weekend in prison and several years ago was granted a pardon for the offence. A few years he was denied entry into the US at the airport (flying to Miami to go on a cruise) and was told that although he was pardonned in Canada, that doesn't mean he was pardonned in the US and as such he was still convicted of a felony and for that reason being denied entry. He had entered the US tons of times before that and has entered tons of times since but our border laws (both sides) are such that, for right or wrong, border guards can make unilateral decisions and there's nothing you can do about it.

[Tvov]

BobsYourUncle wrote:

About a dozen years ago, we hosted a student from France in our home. One of his dreams was to visit the US. My wife, a couple of my children and this teenage student, complete with all the right papers to prove himself, went to cross the border at Blaine Wa. The US border guard directly asked my wife and the student if they were going down to the US to kill the president. True story, no lie. These guys are flamin' idiots!

My first thought is that is one of those questions that they ask to judge how you respond, what your reaction is. When we went through the border a few years ago I was first asked how long we were staying, then at the end of the questions I was asked when we were leaving - same question, just asked differently to see what happens.

Sorry about your issues at the border.

[AKsilvereagle]

A friend and I were accused of being drug dealers at the boarder by the Canadian BP. Here is what happened We were flagged by BP to secondary because of my friends past 42 years ago when he was 18.

I do feel your pain as far as getting denied on a great RV trip with ruined plans to Alaska and all that over someone's past history that spoiled it for you and your wife, however Canada takes their entry requirements very seriously for visitors and non citizens just the same as the United States does upon their entry requirements for visitors and non citizens....

I do not know how many times the OP has crossed into or visited Canada, however whether you are a first time visitor or a returning visitor in Canada - always do your homework and check all the regulations and restrictions prior to each crossing with whatever you are bringing with you, and that includes other people joining your company that might have a criminal history or record of sorts.

The last I checked with both US Customs and Canada Customs entry criteria for non citizens, a person with any criminal history record is broken down to two classifications :

-Minor offenses and -Major offenses

Both countries take any form of offenses on record very seriously, especially if there was any record of incarcerated time served by the offender.

Furthermore the last I knew upon Canada Customs guidelines on visiting individuals with criminal history, there is a minimum of one to three years of inadmissibility for classified minor offense(s) at the discretion of the officer if declared inadmissible....

For classified major offense(s) the last I knew, Canada Customs in most cases will not permit someone to cross into Canada if the offense occurred within a 5 year period of the time of crossing (which the OP's friend's situation mentioned does not apply here).

If the major offense occurred well after the 5 year period, or any minor offense at the discretion of the officer, an individual can apply for a rehabilitation permit to enter Canada (or waiver to the words of choice) as the last I knew was a $200 non refundable fee to apply, with a potential additional cost at the discretion of the official reviewing the application that is solely based on the seriousness of record or incident ...

However the unforgiving part of weighing the individual's record at hand that will shadow permanent denied entry is how much incarceration the individual has served which will also be on record....

In the eyes of Canada if a non citizen person has served at least 5 years total incarceration no matter how long ago the offense(s) had occurred, that pretty much will keep a person inadmissible for entry....a total of 10 years incarcerated for any visitor attempting to enter Canada is permanently inadmissible the last I knew.

Even if the person has served their time and paid their debt to society well over 40 years ago which only happened one time, the incarcerated time served (or especially in some cases the nature of the crime) has a strong bearing in permanent inadmissiblity for a foreign visitor entering in the United States or Canada.

When they were searching the Fiver they found three bottles of medications that belong to my wife. Who was scheduled to fly up and meet us in Anchorage next week. She put her Meds in the fifth wheel so she would not be without while touring Alaska.

As noted, I do believe Canada has similar rules to the US upon possessing prescription medication that is clearly designated for the name on the label, as US federal law states unlawful possession of controlled substances to other than the individual who is prescribed for is prohibited....If the prescribed person (the wife) was present upon entering Canada with the medication, the situation would have been a non issue and there would not have been a temporary seizure of those medications.

When someone enters a foreign country (in this case Canada) with someone else's medications that do not belong to them, that is grounds for more than a secondary inspection (especially when they "found" them) as Canada's controlled substance laws clearly covers as such....Canada has the same problems as the US when it comes to drug smuggling across it's borders as they take any form of controlled substances or illicit drugs very seriously, for all Canada Customs knows in the immediate finding, those prescriptions could have been stolen and potentially used to distribute, or used as a cover to conceal something else in it's form.

My question is if we were the bad criminals the treated us as. Why did they give us back the drugs and asked us to leave Canada ???????

Did I forget to say the Fifth Wheel also my wife`s too as she is on the registration.

The reason why they gave you back the medication is :

1 - You and your friend were both deemed inadmissible into Canada for whatever official reason(s).

2 - While officials had temporary seized those medications during the shakedown inspection, you can bet they swabbed and checked samples in their analyzer that can detect and identify the exact substance or particle, in which case they confirmed the medications as such, along with declaring the reason and purpose of your visit in Canada....furthermore to my guess stating your wife's name on the fifth wheel registration while officials running her name in a background check concluded that the prescription medication was more likely intended for her personal use although she not present, so there was no need to permanently seize the medication as the parties involved were denied entry into Canada anyway.

While traveling the Fifth Wheel as well as a Motorhome`s are considered a your secondary residence that's why there are specific laws that address search and seizure in the states ,you would think Canada would follow the same

Although Canada and the United States are similar in many ways, specific laws in the states is just that :

Jurisdiction in a sovereign state means a place within any country, state or province, county or borough, city, zone, etc. which enforce their own laws....

Canada too has their own specific laws and do not always follow the same rules as the states.....I tell people that mention travelling abroad to always keep in the back of your mind that once you leave the United States, the US constitution does not follow you around as you are in some else's country, never assume some other country is going to enforce a similar law or procedure the same way as the United States does or doesn't do or suppose to do in a lot of cases.

Then they wanted to fine me $500 for the pepper spray I had in my door that has been there for years I had forgotten about.

I found out the hard way of forgetting something as well once upon a time, clearing thru security at Fairbanks Int'l Airport as their metal detector found my long lost butterfly knife in the back of my thick coat, a prohibited item....had to leave the building and dispose of it back in the car and then make a second attempt to clear security again.

Pepper spray is clearly listed as a prohibited item when entering Canada, and practically every time I enter Canada they ask me if I am carrying any such item, as I am sure officers also ask most every body else upon visiting Canada as to my guess the OP answered no or was not asked, well the fact of the matter is they "found" the prohibited item as stated it was forgotten about.

In the end they took my spray and returned all of the Meds and asked us if we paid $3000 to see a group of supervisors they might or might not let us in and the fee was not refundable

Are you sure officials didn't state that you might pay up to $3000 for both of you if approved for permitted entry ?

The last I knew each rehabilitation application only costs $200, as to my understanding if approved for permitted entry, officials would then decide on any imposed fee based on the nature of the individual's situation.

So BEWARE IF YOU OR YOUR SPOUSE TAKE MEDS MAIL THEM TO YOUR FIRST STOP IN ALASKA.

I do feel bad for your situation that got spoiled by Canada Customs, however your isolated incident to bring prescribed meds that belong to someone else without their presence was not a smart thing to do should those items be discovered (and or not declared) by officials in which they were, as this quote should be re-worded as such :

If you or your spouse take meds, make sure the person they are prescribed for is physically present when crossing international borders.... or :

If your spouse takes meds who is not present when crossing into Canada, do not possess with you and mail them to your first stop in Alaska.


Although the OP has no control over a friend's criminal history, two other strikes could have been avoided with the possession of both the pepper spray and some one else's meds as these were three main reasons why Canada Customs were very vigilant about the situation at hand, can't blame them for finding the meds and the pepper spray as they were enforcing their duties, as they find all kinds of prohibited items from travelers entering their borders everyday.

I am willing to bet things would have went smoother if the Op's wife was present crossing into Canada (along with carrying her meds) while the friend with the 42 year old conviction had flown to Alaska instead....the pepper spray would have been the only issue of the events that took place according the OP.


I have crossed into the Huntington (Abbortsford) station a total of 5 times and I had to clear thru immigration the first four of the five times I crossed there, and yes my car was panty searched thoroughly each of the four times before permitted entry.

[Little_Kopit]

I travelled to Australia last fall with sufficient meds for myself. Prominent in my purse was a letter from my doctor listing the prescriptions and a letter from my pharmacist listing the same meds. I understood that the purpose of the letters and lists was to permit me carrying these meds in my carry on luggage.

Clearly the letters also served a purpose all border guards would understand. & both my doctor and my pharmacist know about it.

The pharmacists said: "We prepare people to go to Florida and other states for 6 months each year."

There is your lesson - documentation.

:C