Fighting for campsites 6 months in advance!

[bgradert]

All-

Is it me or is booking campsites getting harder and harder? I have spent the last couple weeks trying to book a week in July at Ludington SP in Michigan and it was darn near impossible. There were about 15 sites available from July 8-14 this morning and within seconds they were gone. I was lucky enough to snag one of them just a few seconds after the six month reservation window opened. I also experienced the same difficulty booking Grand Haven for the 4th but a site did open and I was a able to book.

Last year I had to book 15 days at Platte River so I could get the week I wanted. I then went back and cancelled the days I did not want.

Have you all experienced the same frustration when booking sites?
I was speaking to my 75 year old parents who have camped all their life and they are very frustrated with trying to book sites. In fact so frustrated they sold their fifth wheel.

I heard the millennial's are buying campers left and right. Not sure if this is true.

[GordonThree]

Ralph Cramden wrote:

1stgenfarmboy wrote:
As long as the camping crowd keeps growing the prices are going to keep going up, for the folks that live in the Bible belt there is basicly zero BLM land so you must stay at a state park or private CG, S.P. CG are still cheap at 9-12 a night but if you want a weekend in the summer months you need to be there on Wed.

Where are the state parks with campsites @ 9-12 per night?

We've been to quite a few states and have not found those.

Rustic SP used to be 13 in Michigan. Now 17. Same for State Forest. Maybe using Gold Eagle 50% discount at National Forest CG?

[Ralph_Cramden]

1stgenfarmboy wrote:
As long as the camping crowd keeps growing the prices are going to keep going up, for the folks that live in the Bible belt there is basicly zero BLM land so you must stay at a state park or private CG, S.P. CG are still cheap at 9-12 a night but if you want a weekend in the summer months you need to be there on Wed.

Where are the state parks with campsites @ 9-12 per night?

We've been to quite a few states and have not found those.

[drsteve]

1stgenfarmboy wrote:
As long as the camping crowd keeps growing the prices are going to keep going up, for the folks that live in the Bible belt there is basicly zero BLM land so you must stay at a state park or private CG, S.P. CG are still cheap at 9-12 a night but if you want a weekend in the summer months you need to be there on Wed.


When we paln a trip to the Appalachains or Smoky MTS, I reserve as soon as the window is open, and alot of the places I want to stay are first come first serve, so those places are pretty much out of the question because I can't travel 9 hours with the " hope " of getting a spot.

Come on up to Michigan! There are millions of acres of federal and state forest lands that are open to boondocking, as well as primitive campgrounds that seldom if ever fill up.

Map of MI public lands

[1stgenfarmboy]

As long as the camping crowd keeps growing the prices are going to keep going up, for the folks that live in the Bible belt there is basicly zero BLM land so you must stay at a state park or private CG, S.P. CG are still cheap at 9-12 a night but if you want a weekend in the summer months you need to be there on Wed.


When we paln a trip to the Appalachains or Smoky MTS, I reserve as soon as the window is open, and alot of the places I want to stay are first come first serve, so those places are pretty much out of the question because I can't travel 9 hours with the " hope " of getting a spot.

[toedtoes]

PawPaw_n_Gram wrote:

austinjenna wrote:
They were doing the same thing in the Ohio parks but they caught on quickly and now if you cancel a reservation, you cancel the whole thing. You cant just pick a few days to cancel.

I like that option.

There have been a few times that I’ve had to adjust dates, but it is a small percentage of the reservations I do make.

The occasional inconvenience to me would be offset by frustrating the gamers.

It won’t stop all gaming, but it would help.

The NF campgrounds do that out here. I only had to change plans for one trip (twice). The first, I just dropped the number of nights. I had to cancel the whole thing, then quickly reserve the site again for only two of those original nights. Then I had to change the dates completely - that change was the same I had to cancel the entire thing then reserve for the new dates. I couldn't just adjust the reservation either time.

It was actually for a work trip and my plans were dependent upon weather and other employee availability. I paid the cancellation fees with no complaint as I was just glad I didn't forfeit the entire amount each time. The camping fees and cancellation fees came out of my own pocket. It was a great work trip.

[PawPaw_n_Gram]

austinjenna wrote:
They were doing the same thing in the Ohio parks but they caught on quickly and now if you cancel a reservation, you cancel the whole thing. You cant just pick a few days to cancel.

I like that option.

There have been a few times that I’ve had to adjust dates, but it is a small percentage of the reservations I do make.

The occasional inconvenience to me would be offset by frustrating the gamers.

It won’t stop all gaming, but it would help.

[toedtoes]

Hmm. I guess it gets them their income, but doesn't do anything for the folks not gaming the system.

But, then as I've said before, no matter what they do, someone will game it and someone will lose from it. 😞

In California at the NF campgrounds, I don't see a lot of reserving longer than you need and dumping what you don't want. Part of it is that you have to be camping there the first night or you lose the entire reservation. If the campground is really busy they will go around about 10 am and remove cards for no shows. If the campground isn't busy, they'll leave them up and allow your late arrival. Last fall, I had a situation where I couldn't arrive that first night (no cell service so I couldn't call and explain) - I arrived the next day fully expecting to have lost my spot. Fortunately, it was a Tuesday and most sites were empty. I wandered the campground to see if there was anything available to stay an extra night, and on Friday, the place was completely booked through the weekend. So it does not appear the NF has that issue in the northern Sierras that other areas have with over booking the length of the stay.

[austinjenna]

People who wanted a Friday and Saturday night would jump on the website on a Wed / Thur or earlier when the 6 month window opened and reserve Wed through Sun. Then They would wait awhile or to the last minute and cancel the days they did not intend to use. When someone who wanted the Fri/Sat and was not gaming jumped on the site on the Friday 6 months prior when the window opened the sites were already booked

They were doing the same thing in the Ohio parks but they caught on quickly and now if you cancel a reservation, you cancel the whole thing. You cant just pick a few days to cancel.

[Ralph_Cramden]

toedtoes wrote:


My apologies. I had read it quickly and focused on the chart so I got it wrong.

I don't know the Michigan system well, but it sounds from above posts that sites are being booked up way in advance and then folks are changing them at the last moment. If that's true, then I don't see this strategy being effective as those who book early can change their reservations at the last minute with minimal penalty. So, sites will continue to book up as soon as reservations open.

No apology needed.

The simple version of my long mindedness.

People who wanted a Friday and Saturday night would jump on the website on a Wed / Thur or earlier when the 6 month window opened and reserve Wed through Sun. Then They would wait awhile or to the last minute and cancel the days they did not intend to use. When someone who wanted the Fri/Sat and was not gaming jumped on the site on the Friday 6 months prior when the window opened the sites were already booked.

MI's policy may not prevent it, but the park will still be getting most of the revenue they lose because the site was locked out to others until those people canceled the days,

[toedtoes]

Ralph Cramden wrote:

toedtoes wrote:
Here's the link:
Michigan cancellation

Interesting. They do allow you to show up 2 days after your scheduled arrival. The 40 percent is only for cancellations made 5 months prior to check in. It's less if you cancel closer to the check in date. Which could mean people will wait til the last moment to cancel what they don't want.

No

The 40% is for reservations made more than 5 months in advance, and cancelled at any time prior to the arrival date, or the day of arrival. If canceled prior to day of arrival you're paying the $10 fee + 40% of all the nights reserved, if cancelled on the day of arrival or later you're paying $10 + full price of the day of arrival or days reserved which you were late (max two days) + 40% of all the remaining nights fees. most of the parks in MI that I am familiar with, I would bet the majority of ressie's are made at least 5 months in advance or you're not getting one to begin with, especially for prime/popular sites.

When this policy was announced last year it sure did cause some brouhaha on some other forums from the people who were used to making multiple reservations with the intent of picking and choosing what ones they were actually going to use later.

So if you reserved 5 months or longer out and the nightly price was $30 per night for 4 nights, cancelling that ressie prior to day of arrival just cost you $58

If you cancel day of arrival its $40+$36 = $76.00
If you cancel on the day after the arrival date its $70 + $24 = $94.00

That's structured to try and deter the people who reserve starting Wed/Thu when the 6 month ressie window opens, who only really need the Friday/Saturday, and are trying to beat the people only reserving for the Friday/Saturday. They would already be spending $130.00 for two nights in that case, but if they had to cancel the whole shebang its still going to cost them a $76.00 minimum, which used to be the cancellation fee and the first nights fee, or $40.00 to cancel.

Using the previous system if someone wanted only a Friday and Saturday they would reserve 3 or 4 days starting Wed or Thur when immediately when the 6 month window opened. Then after a specified length of time they could cancel the Wed and/or Thu and get some amount of a refund. Now they effectively get nothing back and the $30 per night site for two nights is $65 per night. I also believe MI went to a graduated fee schedule where high occupancy parks have higher rates to begin with.

My apologies. I had read it quickly and focused on the chart so I got it wrong.

I don't know the Michigan system well, but it sounds from above posts that sites are being booked up way in advance and then folks are changing them at the last moment. If that's true, then I don't see this strategy being effective as those who book early can change their reservations at the last minute with minimal penalty. So, sites will continue to book up as soon as reservations open.

[Ralph_Cramden]

toedtoes wrote:
Here's the link:
Michigan cancellation

Interesting. They do allow you to show up 2 days after your scheduled arrival. The 40 percent is only for cancellations made 5 months prior to check in. It's less if you cancel closer to the check in date. Which could mean people will wait til the last moment to cancel what they don't want.

No

The 40% is for reservations made more than 5 months in advance, and cancelled at any time prior to the arrival date, or the day of arrival. If canceled prior to day of arrival you're paying the $10 fee + 40% of all the nights reserved, if cancelled on the day of arrival or later you're paying $10 + full price of the day of arrival or days reserved which you were late (max two days) + 40% of all the remaining nights fees. most of the parks in MI that I am familiar with, I would bet the majority of ressie's are made at least 5 months in advance or you're not getting one to begin with, especially for prime/popular sites.

When this policy was announced last year it sure did cause some brouhaha on some other forums from the people who were used to making multiple reservations with the intent of picking and choosing what ones they were actually going to use later.

So if you reserved 5 months or longer out and the nightly price was $30 per night for 4 nights, cancelling that ressie prior to day of arrival just cost you $58

If you cancel day of arrival its $40+$36 = $76.00
If you cancel on the day after the arrival date its $70 + $24 = $94.00

That's structured to try and deter the people who reserve starting Wed/Thu when the 6 month ressie window opens, who only really need the Friday/Saturday, and are trying to beat the people only reserving for the Friday/Saturday. They would already be spending $130.00 for two nights in that case, but if they had to cancel the whole shebang its still going to cost them a $76.00 minimum, which used to be the cancellation fee and the first nights fee, or $40.00 to cancel.

Using the previous system if someone wanted only a Friday and Saturday they would reserve 3 or 4 days starting Wed or Thur when immediately when the 6 month window opened. Then after a specified length of time they could cancel the Wed and/or Thu and get some amount of a refund. Now they effectively get nothing back and the $30 per night site for two nights is $65 per night. I also believe MI went to a graduated fee schedule where high occupancy parks have higher rates to begin with.

[toedtoes]

Here's the link:
Michigan cancellation

Interesting. They do allow you to show up 2 days after your scheduled arrival. The 40 percent is only for cancellations made 5 months prior to check in. It's less if you cancel closer to the check in date. Which could mean people will wait til the last moment to cancel what they don't want.

[jim_isham]

I couldn't get the link to work for me to post here, but the Michigan DNR web site says that anyone who overbooks, and then cancels later on, the days they don't want, are going to be charged up to 40% of what they paid when they made the original reservation.

[GordonThree]

jim isham wrote:


Http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,4570,7-153-10365_10883_76135---,00.html

That should work well to decrease the cheaters booking early and overlapping a holiday, then cancelling the early days.

[jim_isham]

TBammer wrote:
The overbooking and cancellation has to be addressed by the DNR. Not sure how they should handle it, but it is a game, for sure.

Michigan is trying to do something about the overbooking and cancellation. It could be expensive. Check out "Cancellation Modification And Reservation Policy"