Forum Discussion

KBOnTheRoad's avatar
KBOnTheRoad
Explorer
Dec 12, 2016

WiFi and Outhouses

When I was very young some people living in rural areas still had outhouses as their primary and only toilets. Not mind you in California where I grew up, but some of my relatives back in Michigan. Well that (thankfully) was soon replaced with universal indoor plumbing for virtually every household in America.

It strikes me that RV Parks are in somewhat a similar backwards time warp regarding WiFi.

virtually every store, institution, cafe, restaurant, home and office has dependable FAST, Fat Tube WiFi. ...except most RV Parks.

This is frankly the 21century corollary to the Out House.

It is time for RV Parks to come into this century and get with modernizing (or just obtaining) Good dependable and Fast WiFi.

Why is it that as a business segment they have been slower than almost any other to adapt? My guess is there are two fundamental reasons:

Many are "Mom an Pop" businesses who just don't get the necessity or understand the benefits of having up to date wiFi systems.

Others are laboring under the misperception that the demographics of their customer base means we are less proficient at or don't use computers at all. This is pure baloney.

I am 64 and it was MY generation that brought forth this technology. Bill Gates and Steve Jobs are both from my generation. I have been using computers in my work since well before there was such a thing called "Windows".

The Rving public are not a bunch of hopeless technophobes and Luddites.

It is time for RV Parks to wake up and get with what is going on in the society has a whole.

Not having Fast Reliable WiFi 17 years into the 21st Century is equivalent to still having an outhouse in 1980.
  • winnietrey's avatar
    winnietrey
    Explorer
    Dec 13, 2016
    Unless the campground owner receives a return on his investment, he would be a poor businessman to spend money on things that do not maintain his market share or increase profit.

    So if he she spends 10k on Wi-Fi, how long does it take him, or her to make it back?

    I would suspect from the responses, some have not considered this from a business prospective
  • dapperdan's avatar
    dapperdan
    Explorer
    Dec 13, 2016
    lbrjet wrote:
    Campground wifi was just fine until everyone wanted to stream Netflix.


    I TOTALY agree! Last September when we were in the UP of Michigan I had a neighbor ask me about the WIFI, he was whining about his "slow" connection, said he could hardly stream his Netflix. Too bad, so sad...... :S

    Dan
  • 2oldman's avatar
    2oldman
    Explorer II
    Dec 13, 2016
    lbrjet wrote:
    Campground wifi was just fine until everyone wanted to stream Netflix.
    I don't know the cost or difficulty of disallowing that service, but they don't do that either. Most CG wifi's I've seen are just a token service to attract the unwary.
  • lbrjet's avatar
    lbrjet
    Explorer
    Dec 13, 2016
    Campground wifi was just fine until everyone wanted to stream Netflix.
  • Johno02's avatar
    Johno02
    Explorer
    Dec 13, 2016
    rhagfo wrote:
    pconroy328 wrote:
    KBOnTheRoad wrote:

    Many are "Mom an Pop" businesses who just don't get the necessity or understand the benefits of having up to date wiFi systems.

    Others are laboring under the misperception that the demographics of their customer base means we are less proficient at or don't use computers at all. This is pure baloney.


    For a campground owner who does not cater to the folks that cannot live without internet access, there is NO necessity or benefits to having modern, fast internet. For those that have to have instant access, they should stay where it is available. Up until less than ten years ago, we did very well without internet or cell phones, and before that even having a phone was a benefit. Our country was founded and did very well without, and we would still probably be a lot better off without so much communication.
  • rhagfo's avatar
    rhagfo
    Explorer III
    Dec 13, 2016
    pconroy328 wrote:
    KBOnTheRoad wrote:

    Many are "Mom an Pop" businesses who just don't get the necessity or understand the benefits of having up to date wiFi systems.

    Others are laboring under the misperception that the demographics of their customer base means we are less proficient at or don't use computers at all. This is pure baloney.


    Orrrrrrrr - you don't understand bandwidth and the boonies. ;)

    I used to work for a Bandwidth company. Think of it this way - your RV park can have the best WiFi on God's Green Planet. All 9000 of the motorhomes connect wonderfully to the local park's connection.

    But - because you're in the boonies, there's a soda-straw sized connection: from the RV park to the Local Telephone company.

    Blammo - slow internet.

    Or, maybe the RV park uses Cable and there's a decent sized connection between the park and the cable company. But, again, because you're in the boonies - there's a soda-straw sized connection between the cable company and the RBOC.


    Point being - you're only going to go as fast as the slowest link in the chain.

    There are still only a handful of ways to drag any connection out to the boonies: telephone, cable, microwave and satellite. All of them pale in speed to what fiber optic cable can provide.

    Trenching fiber into the boonies is ridiculously expensive.

    4G/LTE cell towers are probably the current, best hope for connecting the boonies. Right now, that's expensive and still can't provide the bandwidth to support a packed RV park filled with campers streaming Hulu episodes of Lawrence Welk. ;)


    Ouch! the truth hurts!!

    Getting good service and bandwidth even to the outer parts of suburbia can be extremely costly.
    Look at it this way 100 mbs service to campground. 100 camp site park, half the campers using their computers, that equates to 2mbs for each camper. That is a simplistic way of stating it, but you get the picture. Then there is the cost of the 100 mbs connection to the outside world.

    I would rather have 50 amp electrical and full hook ups.
  • KBOnTheRoad's avatar
    KBOnTheRoad
    Explorer
    Dec 13, 2016
    pconroy328 wrote:

    .... Right now, that's expensive and still can't provide the bandwidth to support a packed RV park filled with campers streaming Hulu episodes of Lawrence Welk. ;)


    This is the kind of ageist attitude that I claim holds some RV Parks back. It's clear that it's not only the RV Parks that don't understand the demographics.

    Larwence Welk was a show MY GRANDMOTHER watched (I am 64)...even my Mother thought he was too hokey for words.

    I think you will find we are actually streaming Game of Thrones, Breaking Bad and Downton Abbey out here in these geriatric RV's
  • KBOnTheRoad's avatar
    KBOnTheRoad
    Explorer
    Dec 13, 2016
    I appreciate all of the discussion.

    But I think some are skewing my point. I made it clear I was talking about RV Parks NOT Campgrounds.

    "What about the RV Park thats 100 miles from the nearest town?" One poster posited...Well name one. My guess is there isnt a single one that is actually 100 miles from the nearest small town...and that is missing my point.

    As for cost in reality WiFi via fiber optic cable, which is nearly universal even in many many rural areas is cheaper by far to get into the ground and up and working than any other utility we lay. I have actually had better WiFi at parks in Alaska in small towns than I have in many parks in major metro areas in the lower 48.

    And let me give you some background on my experience with business and WiFi: I built and operated a medium sized boutique hotel in a South East Asian Beach Resort... in a country so technologically far behind most of the world that the ONLY ATM was in the capital city. You couldnt take credit cards because there were no POS machines. A year later WiFi became available and I was the first Hotel to offer it FREE. Every place else was charging for it. That didnt last long.

    I know well how expensive it can be and I fully understand the challenges of dealing with customer expectations. At every turn I pushed to get faster and faster WiFi and was well aware of the size of the Pipe coming into That part of Asia. And I fully understand the limitations of the infrastructure.

    BUT...every upgrade in infrastructure this nation has taken be it rural electrification, Cell coverage, Dams, Telephones...has cost money. Those RV Parks that continue to devalue WiFi will in the end find themselves non competitive especially as more and more people are working on the road.

    I also find an interesting fact as I have been on the road all across this country now for almost two years there are still quite a few RV Parks that do not even have their own website. And when I have stayed at a few of those I find they are also way behind the eight ball on WiFi too. This must be the last holdout of business segment that doesnt understand the sheer necessity of a Web Site.

    And that was essentially my main point that RV Parks as a group are behind the times tech-wise. Certainly not all mind you but a significant percentage are.
  • pconroy328's avatar
    pconroy328
    Explorer
    Dec 13, 2016
    KBOnTheRoad wrote:

    Many are "Mom an Pop" businesses who just don't get the necessity or understand the benefits of having up to date wiFi systems.

    Others are laboring under the misperception that the demographics of their customer base means we are less proficient at or don't use computers at all. This is pure baloney.


    Orrrrrrrr - you don't understand bandwidth and the boonies. ;)

    I used to work for a Bandwidth company. Think of it this way - your RV park can have the best WiFi on God's Green Planet. All 9000 of the motorhomes connect wonderfully to the local park's connection.

    But - because you're in the boonies, there's a soda-straw sized connection: from the RV park to the Local Telephone company.

    Blammo - slow internet.

    Or, maybe the RV park uses Cable and there's a decent sized connection between the park and the cable company. But, again, because you're in the boonies - there's a soda-straw sized connection between the cable company and the RBOC.


    Point being - you're only going to go as fast as the slowest link in the chain.

    There are still only a handful of ways to drag any connection out to the boonies: telephone, cable, microwave and satellite. All of them pale in speed to what fiber optic cable can provide.

    Trenching fiber into the boonies is ridiculously expensive.

    4G/LTE cell towers are probably the current, best hope for connecting the boonies. Right now, that's expensive and still can't provide the bandwidth to support a packed RV park filled with campers streaming Hulu episodes of Lawrence Welk. ;)
  • camperfamily's avatar
    camperfamily
    Explorer
    Dec 13, 2016
    Sometimes I miss wifi. Or even fast internet. Some other people's idea of fast isn't the same as mine. I'm used to connections no slower then 50mbps, and often 300 mbps or faster. When I go visit my parents and they only have 10 down/1 up it seems archaic.

    That said sometimes I choose to camp where the is NO wifi, NO cell service and even NO electricity. Why you may ask? Simple. I want to get away from all that noise. Not actual noise you hear, but everything that competes for your attention. My RV can supply battery power, water and basics for a few days.

    A few years ago I visited a area near a large radio telescope. No cell service, wifi, radio signals, nothing. It was fun watching people holding phones up hoping for a signal like a scene out of the movie "RV" with Robin Williams.

    No if I'm in a resort paying premium prices for amenities, then yes, I'd expect fast wifi access.

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