DRW or SRW

[moman1]

I've read a lot of topics on here about how safe (or not safe) it is to pull a trailer that is close to the max towing capacity of the truck. What I'd like to read here is actual experience (not opinions) of those that are towing close to their limits. Here's why: I'm looking at getting into a Fuzion 422 Chrome. The tow vehicle I get is going to be my daily driver. I really don't want to drive a dually as a daily driver. The max capacity of the 2016 GMC Denali 3500 SRW is 17,100 lbs. The Fuzion with fuel, fresh water and toys is going to be right at 17k lbs. Does anyone have any similar experiences? Again, I realize a dually would be more stable. I also know these trucks are much more capable than what the limits may say.

Thanks in advance!

Kevin

[moman1]

Lantley wrote:

lawnspecialties wrote:

moman1 wrote:
..... Do you notice much with the wind?

Not at all.

The rear axle weight is mostly my fault. Full of fuel, I'm holding over 120 gallons of diesel. That's an extra 600 lbs. of fuel that the truck usually wouldn't carry. So I rarely don't run it full of fuel when towing.

I agree for the most part of "more truck is always better". But I have to ask an honest question that merits an honest answer. No fights or yelling please.

How often do we see or hear of a truck/camper failure because the truck was overloaded? We see F150s pulling big campers and old F250s almost dragging the ground with big triple-axle fivers. But I have never seen a truck break because it was overloaded. I'm sure it happens but in the grand scheme of things and how often it happens every day, I have no worries about my set-up whatsoever.

We're heading to Disneyworld in December. That's over 1200 miles round trip. We'll probably put everything (clothes, coolers, golf cart) in the garage of the camper and then unload when we arrive. I have no doubt we'll be fine.

I had a F250 that I replaced springs on twice simply because I overloaded the truck with work tools. I also replaced the tranny twice.
I'm sure the excess weight wore things out a bit faster.
Failure does not have to be catastrophic. You don't need to snap the frame in half to feel the effects of being overloaded.
We all have our comfort level what you describe as OK I see as being overloaded.
Your reasoning for preferring a SRW is you don't want a dually as a DD. I understand that. However I don't think that makes it OK to exceed axle ratings or to have a vehicle that is something less than stable at 70 MPH.
I prefer to put up with the inconveniences of having a dually as a DD because I want the added stability and performance when towing.

Didn't think about how things might wear out quicker when pushed to the max. Great point. Thanks.

[moman1]

NC Hauler wrote:

moman1 wrote:

lincster wrote:
I always get a kick out of folks that will wait to see the answer they want to hear and then acknowledge that one....

If you already have your mind made up against a dually, then why post?

I don't have my mind made up yet. I have to use the equity in my current truck to get out of my MH. So I'm trying to decide between a used special purpose dually with another livable daily driver truck or a really nice SRW brand new Denali 3500 that can be dual purpose. I'm just responding to the ones that share what I asked for. I asked for real experiences, not advice. So to all of those that shared their advice, thank you and no offense intended. I welcome the advice since I'm new to a fifth wheel. But, I'm mostly interested in the experiences. So why do you feel the need to troll? What's it to you?

Some of these aren't opinion's, BUT life's learned lessons from real life experiences a lot of had, and learned, the hard way...which it cost even more to fix the mistake...That's how I learned, and it cost me tis I got it right..So some of us ARE sharing our opinions BASED on actual experiences.

If I didn't want to drive around in a Dually..I'd purchase a TH/5er, I could safely tow and be under my trucks recommended towing numbers...again, simple math and some common sense is all it takes.

I'd let this thread die and just do what you want to do..

I understand and have already stated I appreciate the opinions as well. My point was to the guy who thought my mind was already made. It is not. If anything, my mind has been changed a bit. I'm leaning more towards a dually at this point. What I don't understand is why I'm getting **** from some people. I've always had luck on this forum getting good advice. Now I'm getting some good advice, some good experiences (what I asked for) and getting others telling me to "let the thread die". I don't get it. For those providing advice and experiences, I truly thank you.

[Bedlam]

moman1 wrote:

lincster wrote:
I always get a kick out of folks that will wait to see the answer they want to hear and then acknowledge that one....

If you already have your mind made up against a dually, then why post?

I don't have my mind made up yet. I have to use the equity in my current truck to get out of my MH. So I'm trying to decide between a used special purpose dually with another livable daily driver truck or a really nice SRW brand new Denali 3500 that can be dual purpose. I'm just responding to the ones that share what I asked for. I asked for real experiences, not advice. So to all of those that shared their advice, thank you and no offense intended. I welcome the advice since I'm new to a fifth wheel. But, I'm mostly interested in the experiences. So why do you feel the need to troll? What's it to you?

If you scale back that fifth wheel, there are lighter toy haulers your desired Denali will tow within ratings and without modifications. What you are proposing is not a good match, so the truck needs to be bigger or the toy hauler needs to be smaller.

[taken]

To the OP, you could always go with a different brand of hauler with a lighter pin if you want to stay SRW. Our XLR goes over 19k with the garage, fuel, and fresh tanks full but never exceeds 2900# on the pin. So, even though I am over on GCWR which is not of concern to me, I'm under on GAWR, GVWR, and tire ratings. XLR has the lightest pin weights in the industry compared to similar floorplans from their competition due to axle placement. So, like I said, if you are determined to stay with a SRW, think about a hauler with a lighter pin.

[NC_Hauler]

moman1 wrote:

lincster wrote:
I always get a kick out of folks that will wait to see the answer they want to hear and then acknowledge that one....

If you already have your mind made up against a dually, then why post?

I don't have my mind made up yet. I have to use the equity in my current truck to get out of my MH. So I'm trying to decide between a used special purpose dually with another livable daily driver truck or a really nice SRW brand new Denali 3500 that can be dual purpose. I'm just responding to the ones that share what I asked for. I asked for real experiences, not advice. So to all of those that shared their advice, thank you and no offense intended. I welcome the advice since I'm new to a fifth wheel. But, I'm mostly interested in the experiences. So why do you feel the need to troll? What's it to you?

Some of these aren't opinion's, BUT life's learned lessons from real life experiences a lot of had, and learned, the hard way...which it cost even more to fix the mistake...That's how I learned, and it cost me tis I got it right..So some of us ARE sharing our opinions BASED on actual experiences.

If I didn't want to drive around in a Dually..I'd purchase a TH/5er, I could safely tow and be under my trucks recommended towing numbers...again, simple math and some common sense is all it takes.

I'd let this thread die and just do what you want to do..

[moman1]

NC Hauler wrote:

Bedlam wrote:

moman1 wrote:
Thank you for sharing lawnspecialties. That is exactly what I was looking for. I don't speed anyway. I have a class a diesel and I rarely go above 70 mph and I'm usually around 65 or so. Do you notice much with the wind?

Do you realize he is exceeding his rear rim capacities at 7200 lbs and his pin weight is lighter than the FW you selected?

Expect to spend to $3K or more on 19.5" wheel upgrades to have sufficient rear capacity and probably another $1K on suspension to make s SRW safely tow a TH of that size. GVWR and GCWR are not legal ratings, but they are warranty ratings and may get you denied coverage if exceeding them during the warranty period.

In my previous post I said it could be done safely, but there are hard and potential costs associated with it. My F250 was typically loaded 7000-8000 lbs on the rear axle, but it had the following options and upgrades:

OEM Camper Package
- F350 rear upper overload springs
- Higher rated front coils
- Front and rear stabilizer bar
19.5" wheel upgrade
- 19.5 alloy rims rated at 4500 lbs
- 245/70R19.5 LRH 16PR tires rated at 4805 lbs
Suspension upgrade
- Rancho RS9000XL adjustable shocks
- Upper and lower Torklift StableLoad spring pads and wedges
- Firestone Ride-rite airbags

Agree.. I too figured the OP was just hoping one or more would agree with him to justify pushing rear axle limits of his truck...There is a huge difference in stability when towing with a dually on mountainous curvy roads versus a SRW truck, most who have had both will agree..It's also best to not push the limits of the truck..Thus the reason, I have the truck to tow what I'm towing..I didn't have to ask anyone what they thought of the combo..I KNEW truck could handle the load..My daily driver for the last 11 years has been a dually...No big deal, and I know how to park it, so no pictures of me by a close minded community that's a bit "uppity"...glad I don't have neighbors like them.

Buy the right truck for the job..if one doesn't want the right truck, buy a lessor weight TH/5er...its just a safety choice and common sense...something that isn't real popular now a day's.

That's what I'm trying to find out. I'm new. Accordingly to the spec sheet, I'm good. That's why I'm on here asking the question of real experiences. I have not made up my mind. That one experience I responded to happened to be the way I was thinking. Doesn't mean I made up my mind.

[moman1]

Bedlam wrote:

moman1 wrote:
Thank you for sharing lawnspecialties. That is exactly what I was looking for. I don't speed anyway. I have a class a diesel and I rarely go above 70 mph and I'm usually around 65 or so. Do you notice much with the wind?

Do you realize he is exceeding his rear rim capacities at 7200 lbs and his pin weight is lighter than the FW you selected?

Expect to spend to $3K or more on 19.5" wheel upgrades to have sufficient rear capacity and probably another $1K on suspension to make s SRW safely tow a TH of that size. GVWR and GCWR are not legal ratings, but they are warranty ratings and may get you denied coverage if exceeding them during the warranty period.

In my previous post I said it could be done safely, but there are hard and potential costs associated with it. My F250 was typically loaded 7000-8000 lbs on the rear axle, but it had the following options and upgrades:

OEM Camper Package
- F350 rear upper overload springs
- Higher rated front coils
- Front and rear stabilizer bar
19.5" wheel upgrade
- 19.5 alloy rims rated at 4500 lbs
- 245/70R19.5 LRH 16PR tires rated at 4805 lbs
Suspension upgrade
- Rancho RS9000XL adjustable shocks
- Upper and lower Torklift StableLoad spring pads and wedges
- Firestone Ride-rite airbags

Sorry, don't know the specs for his setup to that detail. However, the specs I'm looking at with the vehicle and TH I want, I'm within the factory specs/limits. Therefore the warranty should be just fine.

[moman1]

lincster wrote:
I always get a kick out of folks that will wait to see the answer they want to hear and then acknowledge that one....

If you already have your mind made up against a dually, then why post?

I don't have my mind made up yet. I have to use the equity in my current truck to get out of my MH. So I'm trying to decide between a used special purpose dually with another livable daily driver truck or a really nice SRW brand new Denali 3500 that can be dual purpose. I'm just responding to the ones that share what I asked for. I asked for real experiences, not advice. So to all of those that shared their advice, thank you and no offense intended. I welcome the advice since I'm new to a fifth wheel. But, I'm mostly interested in the experiences. So why do you feel the need to troll? What's it to you?

[Lantley]

lawnspecialties wrote:

moman1 wrote:
..... Do you notice much with the wind?

Not at all.

The rear axle weight is mostly my fault. Full of fuel, I'm holding over 120 gallons of diesel. That's an extra 600 lbs. of fuel that the truck usually wouldn't carry. So I rarely don't run it full of fuel when towing.

I agree for the most part of "more truck is always better". But I have to ask an honest question that merits an honest answer. No fights or yelling please.

How often do we see or hear of a truck/camper failure because the truck was overloaded? We see F150s pulling big campers and old F250s almost dragging the ground with big triple-axle fivers. But I have never seen a truck break because it was overloaded. I'm sure it happens but in the grand scheme of things and how often it happens every day, I have no worries about my set-up whatsoever.

We're heading to Disneyworld in December. That's over 1200 miles round trip. We'll probably put everything (clothes, coolers, golf cart) in the garage of the camper and then unload when we arrive. I have no doubt we'll be fine.

I had a F250 that I replaced springs on twice simply because I overloaded the truck with work tools. I also replaced the tranny twice.
I'm sure the excess weight wore things out a bit faster.
Failure does not have to be catastrophic. You don't need to snap the frame in half to feel the effects of being overloaded.
We all have our comfort level what you describe as OK I see as being overloaded.
Your reasoning for preferring a SRW is you don't want a dually as a DD. I understand that. However I don't think that makes it OK to exceed axle ratings or to have a vehicle that is something less than stable at 70 MPH.
I prefer to put up with the inconveniences of having a dually as a DD because I want the added stability and performance when towing.

[otrfun]

moman1 wrote:
I've read a lot of topics on here about how safe (or not safe) it is to pull a trailer that is close to the max towing capacity of the truck. What I'd like to read here is actual experience (not opinions) of those that are towing close to their limits. Here's why: I'm looking at getting into a Fuzion 422 Chrome. The tow vehicle I get is going to be my daily driver. I really don't want to drive a dually as a daily driver. The max capacity of the 2016 GMC Denali 3500 SRW is 17,100 lbs. The Fuzion with fuel, fresh water and toys is going to be right at 17k lbs. Does anyone have any similar experiences? Again, I realize a dually would be more stable. I also know these trucks are much more capable than what the limits may say.

Thanks in advance!

Kevin

Our TV is a '16 Ram 3500 Cummins SRW with a payload capacity of 3964 lbs. Maximum tow capacity is 17K+, just like your GMC 3500. However, maximum tow capacity is not really an issue with a SRW. Payload becomes an issue way before tow capacity does.

We purposely purchased the smallest 5th wheel toy hauler that Voltage makes (32 ft.) just to make sure we didn't exceed the payload capacity of our truck. For almost the same amount of money we could have purchased a heavier 37 ft. Voltage with a 12 ft. garage, but elected to put a safety margin first--no regrets.

Depending on how we have it loaded, our 32 ft. 5th wheel toy hauler is within 500-750 lbs. of the maximum payload of our 3500 SRW.

FWIW, the 43 ft. Fuzion 422 Chrome toy hauler weighs 5,000 lbs. more (OEM empty), plus it has 1,400 lbs. more pin weight (OEM empty) than our unit. There's no way I would ever consider pulling that high of pin weight with a 3500 SRW.

Buy, hey, that's just me. YMMV.

[Craig_A]

I have a SRW diesel pulling at my limit and have done great, however, if I had it to do over again, I would get a dually. After towing for a while, I finally figured a dually would let you get safely to the side of the road with less drama than a SRW in the case of a blowout. Unfortunately, I experienced that about 5 weeks ago. I did get to the side of the road safely, but there was more drama than I wanted. Fortunately, I didn't leave any stains in the seat, but there were a few seconds where I had to steer out of a possible jackknife while the trailer was pushing pretty hard.

One thing to consider before getting a dually, check with your insurance company. A friend had a F350 and was able to insure with USAA, but he traded for a F450, and USAA dropped him because now he had a commercial vehicle and USAA would not insure it.

[Bedlam]

These are the options:

1. Run a SRW overloaded outside of component capacities
2. Run a SRW outside of ratings with component upgrades to mitigate failure
3. Run a DRW within ratings and capacities

[lincster]

This is going towards sounding like a tire thread......

Folks listen to what they want to hear.

Truth hurts sometimes, and most don't want to hear the truth.....

[NC_Hauler]

lawnspecialties wrote:
My favorite dealer has a 422. They list the pin at almost 3700 lbs.. That's pretty stout. Just get the truck weighed and the pin weighed if you can. If its really close empty, I would do it. The toys will pull a little off the pin. The total weight will be strong but just don't go flying down the highway.

The 422 Fusion Chrome has a GVW of 19K. pin weight could go 3800#..Dually territory when I factor "Safety First" in..but I'm told that's subjective....Tow what you want with what you want...it's your truck, your trailer, your family..no one else's business, but the one who purchased the combo... It's just when someone ask..there will be answers they might not want to hear, even if the answers are right..such is life as we know it in 2016.

[Mmaxed]

I tow a Fuzion 302 at about 14k with a SRW 3500. If I go to a bigger trailer I will have a dually. Colorado Springs area tells me you will tow in mountains and wind. Get the dually. The SRW will do the job fine most of the time but when conditions get tougher the dually wins hands down over a rig that is on the edge of the ratings on the tires, wheels, axle, etc. Buddy tows heavier with a dually, so I've seen the difference.