How Legit is FifthWheelSt's Calculator?

[hopeisnotastrat]

i'm looking to purchase a new truck and 5th wheel. The 3 trailers we've narrowed it down to are all very similar in terms of GVWR: roughly 15,500 lbs.

The frustrating thing is that I've entered the specs for 2016 GMC HD 3500, 2016 Ram 3500 HD, and 2016 Ford F-350 into the fifthwheelst calculator and it says that none of them can pull any of these trailers.

How is that possible?

I see 5th wheels all over campgrounds with less truck.

[Dandy_Dan]

Old-Biscuit wrote:
15,500# GVWR 5vr....WET Pin Weight roughly 3400# (or higher)

ANY current model DUALLY can handle that pin weight

IF you are looking for a SINGLE rear wheel the available payload, trucks GVWR and the GCVWR will be an issue

I believe the new Chev 3500 HD will tow 22,000

[Dandy_Dan]

Old-Biscuit wrote:
15,500# GVWR 5vr....WET Pin Weight roughly 3400# (or higher)

ANY current model DUALLY can handle that pin weight

IF you are looking for a SINGLE rear wheel the available payload, trucks GVWR and the GCVWR will be an issue

I believe the new Chev 3500 HD will tow 22,000

[mekkerl]

hopeisnotastrategy , I'd love to hear what you decided as I'm in the same point of our search.

[DW-gray]

NC Hauler wrote:
I still don't think one needs a "5th. wheel tow calculator".

That may be true for well-educated and experienced RVers like yourself. Considering that 60% of all tow vehicles are towing while exceeding at least one weight safety rating, RV Tow Check is the only mobile friendly SAE J2807 compliant app that assists buyers with selecting a compatible tow vehicle. None of the previous written resources have done anything to reduce the percentage of those exceeding the weight safety ratings according to the RV Safety and Education Foundation stats.

[Dandy_Dan]

hopeisnotastrategy wrote:

BobKrogstie wrote:
Your tow vehicle weight is wrong. Not even a semi tractor weighs 15500.

OK - I'm an idiot. I understood that field to be for the weight of the trailer.

Thanks for pointing out my error.

Having said that, when I correct that with the weight of the tow vehicle (7082 lbs) it still shows that I'm 2000 lbs short of being able to tow the trailer.

I have a 2014 Chevy 3500HD and the GVWR specs are 13,200 and can tow a Older 3500's used to be 10,000

[hopeisnotastrat]

avvidclif1 wrote:
The Ford in my signature weighed 8240 with a full tank of diesel, hitch, myself and grandson. Nothing else.

I just have to say that your description of your dog in your signature made me laugh. 🙂

[avvidclif1]

The Ford in my signature weighed 8240 with a full tank of diesel, hitch, myself and grandson. Nothing else.

[TXiceman]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

hopeisnotastrategy wrote:

B.O. Plenty wrote:
Gas or diesel? BIG difference in what each will haul..

B.O.

Every truck I'm looking at is diesel.

Please tell what "DIESEL" truck you are looking at that weighs 7,082#?

My 2012 F350 Crewcab DRW with full fuel (38 plus 40 gallons), TS3 Trailer Saver hitch and a few tools is a bit over 9200#.

Ken

[Dayle1]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

hopeisnotastrategy wrote:

B.O. Plenty wrote:
Gas or diesel? BIG difference in what each will haul..

B.O.

Every truck I'm looking at is diesel.

Please tell what "DIESEL" truck you are looking at that weighs 7,082#?

According to GM's weight calculator, a 2015 2500HD long bed 4wd crew cab with 10K GVWR and D/A has an as built weight of just over 6425 lbs. Heck, even my 3500 short bed crew cab 2wd D/A was right at 7000 lbs. Most likely, the majority of GM SRW diesels are under 7k lbs.

[laknox]

NC Hauler wrote:

hopeisnotastrategy wrote:

golf_bears wrote:
Any one of those trucks will pull those RVs. That is not the problem. The real issues to be concerned about are:
1--- Will the TV rear axle carry the load? What's the TV rear axle rating.
2--- Will the TV tires carry the load? What are they rated for?
3--- Will the truck stop the load?

As suggested, you can change the gear ratio and/or go to a dually.

Personally, I would get a dually with at least a 4.1 gear ratio.

The FifthWheelSt calculator doesn't account for gear ratio. I was always told it impacted your towing, so I'm not sure how to determine how much more (or less) I tow going from the standard 3.42 gear ratio to the 4.1 gear ratio.

Also, how do you determine if the axle will carry the load and if the tires will carry the load?

Though not many care, but one could use the GCWR ratings that the manufacture assigned to said vehicle...That is what is effected by the gearing.

You weigh the truck at a CAT scale, full of fuel, DEF, people, pets,hitch etc....just like you're going camping...Let's say drive axle weight is 3,000# and RAWR is 7,000#, subtract 3,000# from the 7,000# and you have 4,000# left to put toward pin weight. I don't do it this way, but almost everyone else does, and the Law looks at axle ratings/tire weight ratings

I've never seen, ( in my case) A truck sold at a dealership, that didn't have high enough weight rated tires to cover rear axle weight rating...but guess there could be:h...I never owned one that came with tires that couldn't handle RAWR.

My '02 D'max 2500HD came with OEM 245/75R-16 E rated tires, at 3,042 lbs each. Total tire capacity was a few hundred lbs less than my RAWR (don't have the # at my fingertips). By going to a 265/75R-16 E rated tire, I picked up almost 800 lbs tire capacity, at 3,415 lbs each, with puts me =over= my RAWR. A weakness for all those D'maxes until GM went to 17" wheels.

Lyle

[laknox]

golf_bears wrote:
Any one of those trucks will pull those RVs. That is not the problem. The real issues to be concerned about are:
1--- Will the TV rear axle carry the load? What's the TV rear axle rating.
2--- Will the TV tires carry the load? What are they rated for?
3--- Will the truck stop the load?

As suggested, you can change the gear ratio and/or go to a dually.

Personally, I would get a dually with at least a 4.1 gear ratio.

Like many RVers, you get a TV with more capacity than you need to start with because down the road Ma-Ma most likely will want a bigger RV.

As your user name implies, "hopeisnotastrategy", get it right the first time!!!!

#3 is not a real issue. The truck stops itself and the trailer stops =itself=. Only in an emergency do you have to worry about the truck stopping a trailer by itself. Even a semi doesn't have the braking power to quickly stop a max load. Yes, in dry, flat conditions, you'll stop it, but on a downhill or in an emergency stop, you're going to jackknife, almost certainly; roll in a worst case. Yes a larger truck would be better, a dually ideal.

Lyle

[Cummins12V98]

hopeisnotastrategy wrote:

B.O. Plenty wrote:
Gas or diesel? BIG difference in what each will haul..

B.O.

Every truck I'm looking at is diesel.

Please tell what "DIESEL" truck you are looking at that weighs 7,082#?

[MFL]

NC Hauler wrote:

Coach-man wrote:
OK, given the litigation prone society we live in, if I were to publish a 5th wheel tow calculator I would err on the conservative side of every calculation! The result would be a good estimate of 80% of the people using it, but when you start using it for the upward side, you would not get an accurate result! As shown in the calculations. As far as the axel ratings, I read in another blog site that with the Dodge Asian tranny, a 3:83 is the equivalent of a 4:10 rear end, not sure of that but just what I read. In any event axel ratios should not effect weight carrying capacities of the TV.

Correct..,.As I stated in an earlier post, gear ratio affects GCWR..doesn't affect GVWR or RAWR. I have the Cummins with the Aisin tranny and it came with 4.10 gearing, (not a 3.83 that is same as a 4.10 with Aisin:h). You can get 3.42, 3.73 or 4.10 with the Aisin in the Dually configuration. GCWR is highest with the 4.10 in a long bed configuration. (my 13' has a GCWR of 37,500#), the 3.73 in long bed offers 32,000#, and 3.42 in long box is 29,000#, .


I still don't think one needs a "5th. wheel tow calculator". You have all the info you need by using GVW of 5er and take 20-22% of that to get pin weight, Then in your trucks drivers side door, you have the data plate telling you payload and RAWR, ( as well as GVWR), Weigh the truck ready to hook up to the 5er, get drive axle weight, subtract that from RAWR...It's some common sense and uses very basic Math skills..So easy, a caveman could do it.:B

I totally agree!! Very well said Jim!!

Jerry

[NC_Hauler]

Coach-man wrote:
OK, given the litigation prone society we live in, if I were to publish a 5th wheel tow calculator I would err on the conservative side of every calculation! The result would be a good estimate of 80% of the people using it, but when you start using it for the upward side, you would not get an accurate result! As shown in the calculations. As far as the axel ratings, I read in another blog site that with the Dodge Asian tranny, a 3:83 is the equivalent of a 4:10 rear end, not sure of that but just what I read. In any event axel ratios should not effect weight carrying capacities of the TV.

Correct..,.As I stated in an earlier post, gear ratio affects GCWR..doesn't affect GVWR or RAWR. I have the Cummins with the Aisin tranny and it came with 4.10 gearing, (not a 3.83 that is same as a 4.10 with Aisin:h). You can get 3.42, 3.73 or 4.10 with the Aisin in the Dually configuration. GCWR is highest with the 4.10 in a long bed configuration. (my 13' has a GCWR of 37,500#), the 3.73 in long bed offers 32,000#, and 3.42 in long box is 29,000#, .


I still don't think one needs a "5th. wheel tow calculator". You have all the info you need by using GVW of 5er and take 20-22% of that to get pin weight, Then in your trucks drivers side door, you have the data plate telling you payload and RAWR, ( as well as GVWR), Weigh the truck ready to hook up to the 5er, get drive axle weight, subtract that from RAWR...It's some common sense and uses very basic Math skills..So easy, a caveman could do it.:B