Tired of Land Yacht Toy Haulers: Challenge to the Industry

[miboje]

You know, I think every toy hauler manufacturer out there has catered to all the elite toy hauler buyers. It's been overdone at this point. And it's frustrating to see that most of the new toy haulers being introduced are no different. There is little that is new or innovative at this time, and the toy haulers just seem to get bigger and heavier.

It would be nice to see some innovations that bring lighter, well-insulated, and more affordable luxury toy haulers to the rest of us. Just because I don't want to spend $50,000+ doesn't mean I deserve a piece of crap. So that's my challenge to the industry. We are just about slipping through the cracks with our one ton turbo diesel truck. There are just so few options. Many of us are not in a position, or do not want, to buy a special, expensive truck just to haul a toy hauler. That just doesn't make any financial sense to me, and my frugal mind cannot justify doing that unless you are going full-time. So, come on manufacturers - how about some more choices for the rest of us?

[dedmiston]

Too much drama for what should be a fun Friday. Time to close it.

[miboje]

Bedlam wrote:
I don't make six figures and my DW takes care of her mom so does not work. No kids have lessened our expenses and paying off all our debt has allowed us to save for new toys without financing.

That's a great place to be! :)Thank you for adding a helpful response. I appreciate it.

We have really been focusing on paying off debt the past few years also, but I am afraid I am the one who has made that part the most difficult. 😞 I had the bright idea to go to college at the ripe old age of 38 and get a degree. So the economy tanked in 2008...the year of my graduation. I stuck us with student loan debt for a degree that I may never be able to actually use. This has really slowed us down. I feel so bad about it.

[SolidAxleDurang]

Hmm... I wonder how long before my post is taken down?

[SolidAxleDurang]

miboje wrote:

SolidAxleDurango wrote:

miboje wrote:
….I still think that even $50,000 is still pretty high considering that an RV is a "want" rather than a "need”..

You say ^^

miboje wrote:
Each of us can afford different things and we all have different needs…

But just before, you said this ^^ So I’m not sure your point.

miboje wrote:
…RVs, just like most vehicles, depreciate as soon as you drive them off the lot....and depreciate and depreciate pretty much into infinity. Unless a person/family is going to go full-time, my mind simply cannot justify spending soooo much money on a depreciating asset that is really just a want/toy. …

How much is the correct amount for a toy?

miboje wrote:
…Maybe we aren't a typical family, though. We work hard for every dollar…

Typical families don’t work hard?

miboje wrote:
…Neither of us come from a wealthy family, we don't have high-paying, elite or exclusive jobs despite both of us being highly skilled, intelligent and resourceful. ..

No matter how much or how little you have… There’s ALWAYS someone with less, that thinks you’re wealthy… And there’s ALWAYS someone with more that could make you feel poor.

miboje wrote:
…We scrimp, save, do without, make due with what we have…

So does everyone in their own way.

miboje wrote:
…I am just amazed that I see quite a number of people on these RV forums that are driving new or fairly new and expensive TD trucks, and having new or fairly new and expensive RVs...at that same time. I just cannot imagine how anyone affords to do that….

So….. You’re amazed that everyone is not the same as you? I don’t get it. See my response about comparing yourself to others.

miboje wrote:
…If anyone cares to enlighten me, I'm all ears. I do think, however, that it is *mostly* retired folks that can afford to do that. Is that actually how much money we'll have after our kids are out of the house? :B

I am an IT professional in my 40s with 20 years experience in my field. I earn well over 6 figures. My annual bonus last year alone was more than some people earn in total. My wife works as well. One adult child out on their own. We live in an area with a very low cost of living (energy, insurance, food, real-estate) - while some have to live “near the action”. We carry no revolving debt - while some we know consider credit cards a part of their ‘income’. We cook and eat at home each night for dinner - while many eat out ever night. We don’t go out much - many of my friends ‘check-in’ from the movie theater or Starbucks quite frequently. Although I think I look nice when I dress for work (khakis and golf style polo shirts), I buy nearly all my clothes at Walmart - I have coworkers that on ‘casual friday’ wear “$200 jeans - that’s just stupid. My iPhone is 3 years old - while most can’t stand to not have the latest. I ~do~ have a last years model iMac - but only after using my last iMac for 6 years before giving up.

Success is not an income level, size of your home, or number of toys you have…. Success is being satisfied with the level of effort necessary to maintain your desired standard of living.

What more do you want to know?

The fact that you make more than six figures a year explains everything. You really could have said that part alone and that would have been enough. The first part of your response, however, is condescending and arrogant.

I do not believe I was condescending and arrogant. I was simply addressing the many points in your post.

I'm sorry if you took it that way.

[miboje]

SolidAxleDurango wrote:

miboje wrote:
….I still think that even $50,000 is still pretty high considering that an RV is a "want" rather than a "need”..

You say ^^

miboje wrote:
Each of us can afford different things and we all have different needs…

But just before, you said this ^^ So I’m not sure your point.

miboje wrote:
…RVs, just like most vehicles, depreciate as soon as you drive them off the lot....and depreciate and depreciate pretty much into infinity. Unless a person/family is going to go full-time, my mind simply cannot justify spending soooo much money on a depreciating asset that is really just a want/toy. …

How much is the correct amount for a toy?

miboje wrote:
…Maybe we aren't a typical family, though. We work hard for every dollar…

Typical families don’t work hard?

miboje wrote:
…Neither of us come from a wealthy family, we don't have high-paying, elite or exclusive jobs despite both of us being highly skilled, intelligent and resourceful. ..

No matter how much or how little you have… There’s ALWAYS someone with less, that thinks you’re wealthy… And there’s ALWAYS someone with more that could make you feel poor.

miboje wrote:
…We scrimp, save, do without, make due with what we have…

So does everyone in their own way.

miboje wrote:
…I am just amazed that I see quite a number of people on these RV forums that are driving new or fairly new and expensive TD trucks, and having new or fairly new and expensive RVs...at that same time. I just cannot imagine how anyone affords to do that….

So….. You’re amazed that everyone is not the same as you? I don’t get it. See my response about comparing yourself to others.

miboje wrote:
…If anyone cares to enlighten me, I'm all ears. I do think, however, that it is *mostly* retired folks that can afford to do that. Is that actually how much money we'll have after our kids are out of the house? :B

I am an IT professional in my 40s with 20 years experience in my field. I earn well over 6 figures. My annual bonus last year alone was more than some people earn in total. My wife works as well. One adult child out on their own. We live in an area with a very low cost of living (energy, insurance, food, real-estate) - while some have to live “near the action”. We carry no revolving debt - while some we know consider credit cards a part of their ‘income’. We cook and eat at home each night for dinner - while many eat out ever night. We don’t go out much - many of my friends ‘check-in’ from the movie theater or Starbucks quite frequently. Although I think I look nice when I dress for work (khakis and golf style polo shirts), I buy nearly all my clothes at Walmart - I have coworkers that on ‘casual friday’ wear “$200 jeans - that’s just stupid. My iPhone is 3 years old - while most can’t stand to not have the latest. I ~do~ have a last years model iMac - but only after using my last iMac for 6 years before giving up.

Success is not an income level, size of your home, or number of toys you have…. Success is being satisfied with the level of effort necessary to maintain your desired standard of living.

What more do you want to know?

The fact that you make more than six figures a year explains everything. You really could have said that part alone and that would have been enough. The first part of your response, however, is condescending and arrogant.

[Bedlam]

I don't make six figures and my DW takes care of her mom so does not work. No kids have lessened our expenses and paying off all our debt has allowed us to save for new toys without financing.

[SolidAxleDurang]

miboje wrote:
….I still think that even $50,000 is still pretty high considering that an RV is a "want" rather than a "need”..

You say ^^

miboje wrote:
Each of us can afford different things and we all have different needs…

But just before, you said this ^^ So I’m not sure your point.

miboje wrote:
…RVs, just like most vehicles, depreciate as soon as you drive them off the lot....and depreciate and depreciate pretty much into infinity. Unless a person/family is going to go full-time, my mind simply cannot justify spending soooo much money on a depreciating asset that is really just a want/toy. …

How much is the correct amount for a toy?

miboje wrote:
…Maybe we aren't a typical family, though. We work hard for every dollar…

Typical families don’t work hard?

miboje wrote:
…Neither of us come from a wealthy family, we don't have high-paying, elite or exclusive jobs despite both of us being highly skilled, intelligent and resourceful. ..

No matter how much or how little you have… There’s ALWAYS someone with less, that thinks you’re wealthy… And there’s ALWAYS someone with more that could make you feel poor.

miboje wrote:
…We scrimp, save, do without, make due with what we have…

So does everyone in their own way.

miboje wrote:
…I am just amazed that I see quite a number of people on these RV forums that are driving new or fairly new and expensive TD trucks, and having new or fairly new and expensive RVs...at that same time. I just cannot imagine how anyone affords to do that….

So….. You’re amazed that everyone is not the same as you? I don’t get it. See my response about comparing yourself to others.

miboje wrote:
…If anyone cares to enlighten me, I'm all ears. I do think, however, that it is *mostly* retired folks that can afford to do that. Is that actually how much money we'll have after our kids are out of the house? :B

I am an IT professional in my 40s with 20 years experience in my field. I earn well over 6 figures. My annual bonus last year alone was more than some people earn in total. My wife works as well. One adult child out on their own. We live in an area with a very low cost of living (energy, insurance, food, real-estate) - while some have to live “near the action”. We carry no revolving debt - while some we know consider credit cards a part of their ‘income’. We cook and eat at home each night for dinner - while many eat out ever night. We don’t go out much - many of my friends ‘check-in’ from the movie theater or Starbucks quite frequently. Although I think I look nice when I dress for work (khakis and golf style polo shirts), I buy nearly all my clothes at Walmart - I have coworkers that on ‘casual friday’ wear “$200 jeans - that’s just stupid. My iPhone is 3 years old - while most can’t stand to not have the latest. I ~do~ have a last years model iMac - but only after using my last iMac for 6 years before giving up.

Success is not an income level, size of your home, or number of toys you have…. Success is being satisfied with the level of effort necessary to maintain your desired standard of living.

What more do you want to know?

[miboje]

SolidAxleDurango wrote:

westernrvparkowner wrote:

Strabo wrote:

azdryheat wrote:
What would you consider to be new or innovative?

The Price......

And what would that magic number be?

$49,995

Each of us can afford different things and we all have different needs, of course, but I still think that even $50,000 is still pretty high considering that an RV is a "want" rather than a "need". Secondly, RVs, just like most vehicles, depreciate as soon as you drive them off the lot....and depreciate and depreciate pretty much into infinity. Unless a person/family is going to go full-time, my mind simply cannot justify spending soooo much money on a depreciating asset that is really just a want/toy.

Maybe we aren't a typical family, though. We work hard for every dollar. We just don't have thousands of dollars to throw around or be indiscriminate with. Neither of us come from a wealthy family, we don't have high-paying, elite or exclusive jobs despite both of us being highly skilled, intelligent and resourceful. We scrimp, save, do without, make due with what we have, fix stuff rather than throw it away, and don't have much in the way of toys -- or at least toys that aren't also intended to help us perform work...like our old four wheelers helping us to pull logs for firewood out of the woods.

I am just amazed that I see quite a number of people on these RV forums that are driving new or fairly new and expensive TD trucks, and having new or fairly new and expensive RVs...at that same time. I just cannot imagine how anyone affords to do that. If anyone cares to enlighten me, I'm all ears. I do think, however, that it is *mostly* retired folks that can afford to do that. Is that actually how much money we'll have after our kids are out of the house? :B

[SolidAxleDurang]

westernrvparkowner wrote:

Strabo wrote:

azdryheat wrote:
What would you consider to be new or innovative?

The Price......

And what would that magic number be?

$49,995

[miboje]

tinner12002 wrote:
Quality is barely there on most of them, but that's not what it's about, it's about getting this many units out the door each day!
It would be interesting to know just what it costs to build one, say a 3950 Voltage. Manufacturers actual cost to manufacture it.

Right, and this is a complaint I have seen across many brands.
Good question re: actual cost to build. I have no idea what the markup is in the RV industry, but I did see a HL Cyclone or Road Warrior, brand new overstock from the previous year, listed by a dealer on eBay back in the summer. The listing said that it was listed at wholesale, and I was totally shocked at the price. It was something like $36 or $38,000 for something that probably sold for at least $60,000 normally, and I don't mean $60 grand MSRP.

[tinner12002]

Quality is barely there on most of them, but that's not what it's about, it's about getting this many units out the door each day!
It would be interesting to know just what it costs to build one, say a 3950 Voltage. Manufacturers actual cost to manufacture it.

[miboje]

jgos929 wrote:
I have a KZ MXT301 an love it

I have, and we'd prefer a fifth wheel and something with good insulation. Thanks for mentioning it, though. The insulation is very important to us since we want to extend the camping season as long as possible.

[miboje]

4monkeys wrote:
Have you looked at the all-aluminum VRVs? Originally made by Livin Lite but I think the company sold recently.

I have. We'd prefer a fifth wheel, and the insulation in those isn't quite what I'd like to see. But thank you for mentioning it. 🙂

[jgos929]

I have a KZ MXT301 an love it