Full timing rig; the search continues

[norfla71]

My family is planning on a full year tour of the states in a few years. Original plan was to use our current rig, but plans have changed; truck and fiver are gone, which opens up a motorhome purchase.

One question remains; A or C? We will be pulling a toad, most likely an older LeSabre or Equinox. We also need bunks (mainly for extra clothes storage, as the kids will be sleeping in the main cabin on the extra beds). I really like having extra reserve for pulling through the mountains with a diesel pusher, but dread the extra costs. I also would like to make one purchase, to be used with the kids and later in our retirement, and have it paid off before social security age; any choice will be purchased used. A about 38', C no longer than 32', and at least 2 slides, including bedroom.

The A's we're considering are the Allegro Red 38QB and Berkshire 39QB; there are many choices for C. It boils down to a simple question; can we live with a smaller unit, and smaller payments, or more room and comfort, but with the higher costs? To start, we are going to rent a C over a long weekend in the next few months.

Affording either is not the issue; proper planning will get us any of these units new. I'm trying to figure out which is best for a family of 4, then empty nesters later on.

[norfla71]

Like those morons who set the cruise, get up and make a sandwich, thinking Cruise Control is the same as Auto Pilot :S.

We also recline and sleep on long trips, which is also unadvised.

[GMandJM]

Most of us do it anyway. About the same as walking down an airplane aisle while in flight - hold on to furniture, countertops, etc along the way (and don't dawdle if you're back in the loo).

Getting up and changing drivers without stopping....now THAT'S unsafe and ill-advised 😉

[2gypsies1]

One thing you've mentioned is being able to get up and walk around in the motorhome. That really is not advised. It is not safe.

[Nutinelse2do]

norfla71 wrote:

It's bad enough being on the road for hours on end, without having to extend it due to a bad decision.

Reading this statement on your post confuses me.

If you and your wife do not like traveliing, why would you consider fulltiming? Just a thought.

JMO... We gladly gave up some closet space to have a w/d, but there are plenty of fulltimers who use a laundry mat without any issues.

Good luck with your decision. Hope it all works out for you, since needs and desires will change a whole lot over the next 5-10 years.

[norfla71]

Maintenance will be an issue, as most parks tend to frown on changing oil and other fluids in the sites. :h :B Having dealt with this CW for maintenance, I can say Ibroadin is on the money, if not a little low, for prices (gasser oil change was almost $100, but that also included a full mechanical inspection and tire rotation). In comparison, Dodge wanted $120 to change the oil in my ram (12qts + filter) and that's just for the oil and filter (no other services provided). However, a couple of local big rig shops have special RV pricing for the service; it's all a matter of investigation to find the best deal.

Privacy is the last concern; the kids needs someplace to sleep, eat and keep their stuff. This is similar to being deployed on USS Whatever (did it for 20 years); we're all stuck in one place, and have to deal with the close quarters. We'll either be able to cope, or look like a Simpsons episode where Homer chokes out Bart. :W

Price for a new coach is a loosing proposition; only true wealth can afford that kind of depreciation and payment for the loan term. Not saying I haven't thought about it, or drooled over one. However, we're not 100% about anything over the next 20 years, but have narrowed down our choice to a pusher; we're going to be pulling an Enclave sized vehicle, and that's too heavy to be taxing a gasser anything. The next issue will be finding the right floor plan and cost. Thankfully, we have time; we rushed into our TH fiver and have regretted it since.

[GMandJM]

You're a tad high on the price of an oil change. Had one done a couple months ago at Freightliner on our DP (450hp Cummins) and it was $125 and change for 23 quarts of oil and a filter. $46 of that was for the filter.

The OP mentioned that he's set on a used coach because he wan't to avoid all the "emissions garbage" (DPF, DEF, EGR). You're right: The bugs will (hopefully) have been already worked out.

[IBroadin]

We wrestled with the same issues. Gas vs Diesel. We opted for gas because of the long-term expenses. $80 for an oil change in a gas powered beats $250 for a diesel oil change any day plus you don't have to find that "special" garage to have it done. Heck, even in the valley, Joe the mechanic can change oil(makes me think that even I can do this). There is a BH model in both diesel and gas models. With or without washer/dryer is a personal option. We opted not to have one as we wanted the storage space. The last issue is if you want used or new. There is good and bad in both. Used have all of the bugs worked out but unless you know the history, you could be buying a "pig in the pole". However, we bought new and are still returning the MH to the dealer to fix the "bugs". Best advice is read, look, listen, look, look and then look again.

[GMandJM]

I'm sure the OP knows his kids well enough to make that call, Friend. Good luck with the sale of your book and your RV inspection service.

[Rlaubert]

You haven't said the ages and sex of the kids. I assume they are the same sex. I am confused why they would be sleeping in the main cabin. Kids need their own space especially when they get older. If nothing more than for privacy.

Both of those units are nice. It seems you have looked into quite a bit. In my book Finding the Perfect RV, I discuss some things you might want to consider (if you haven't already). Your needs are going to change when you go from weekend camping to full timing and from a family of four to just the two of you. Clothing, food, cooking, travel, length of stays and even maintenance time will all change. Which are some of the reasons people change rigs so often. It might be better to purchase on older unit now (and save depreciation as well as gain experience on what you need vs want vs would be nice to have).

Best of luck, full-timing is great.

[norfla71]

There used to be several online; all I can find now is a Super Duty shooting fire out of the tip.

Deleted; all emissions garbage removed. Had I left it on the turbo would have gone sooner; the soot destroyed the bushings, which seized the vanes in the open position - no low end power. Other issues with the were injectors, sensors and other emissions equipment.

[GMandJM]

You were "deleted" for over 50,000? I'm not sure what you mean. Whatever it was certainly soured you on the emissions stuff.

There was (supposedly) a bad bunch of DPF's a few years back. Manufacturing defects of some kind. And there were some faulty injectors that ended up taking out DPF systems. I could see why that would make someone hesitant.

Hard to imagine anyone would do a parked regen on asphalt. Gonna have to check out YouTube.

[norfla71]

GMandJM wrote:
I can't speak as to the EGR on a gasser, but I wouldn't let the DEF and DPF systems be the biggest factors in deciding not to buy newer diesel model.

DEF is easy to get and I've had no issue with it yet. Any particular issue you have in mind?

Most soot burns off in the DPF system during normal driving. I'm not sure how much mileage difference we're talking for brief active regen. I can't imagine it would be all THAT much.

One thing I'm not sure I like about Tiffin is that they've disconnected the manual regen option. I guess to keep people from starting fires by doing a regen while parked on dry grass. Not sure if other makers have done this.

I'd like the option of choosing when and where to do a regen, but that's just me being a control junky 😉

The emissions equipment on modern diesels are notorious for clogging and, yes, your mileage drop should be noticeable. When my truck went into regen I lost at least 50% of my mileage instantly. You can search Youtube to find people setting asphalt on fire when they manually send their trucks into regen. I've had real world experience with these systems, and I don't want to deal with the issues. As much as most RV shops charge for labor and parts, and what my truck cost to fix, I dread that repair bill.

I was deleted for over 50,000 and still lost the factory turbo after 90,000; I also removed the grid heater, and found about a MM of soot built up inside the intake. Essentially, modern emissions keep the tailpipe clean at the expense of engine longevity. All that garbage goes through the entire intake system, from the turbo through the charge cooler and into the cylinder; that's a lot of trash that, eventually, winds up in your bearings and cylinder walls.

Tiffin probably did that due to liability issues, i.e. setting things on fire during idle, and/or increasing regulations.

[norfla71]

rmalik1 wrote:

C-Bears wrote:

norfla71 wrote:
I'll try to address everyone's concerns as best I can:

We are done with towables; everyone is cramped inside the truck, even after an hour. Kids would be fine with Mega, Suburban, Expedition, etc, but wife and I can't sit for too long anymore without moving around. Motorhome gives us that freedom. Bonus; we don't have to get out to eat or use the facilities when pulling into rest stops and fighting all the bugs.

Initial costs are going to be crazy expensive, so will maintenance. However, we should come out ahead not long after purchase; plan on buying used, buying well and putting a large chunk down, maybe get out the door under $90k. For that kind of money, I would rather have a DP than a C.

Washer and dryer are a must and have yet to see a used coach without.

Sounds like you have experience with TT's. If you want maximum space, especially for 4 people, why not consider a fifth wheel. If you go with a 38' to 40' gently used fiver and dually you can have tons of room plus your washer/dryer.

When we stop at rest areas, or truck stops, we can enter our fiver and get to our frig, pantry, and bathroom. All without putting any of the slides out. A lot of the newer fivers are designed that way.

If your family gets "cramped" after an hour of riding then make a stop every hour or two. RVing is not a road race. We only try to do about 250 to 300 miles a day when traveling. To us RVing is more of a slow motion process to see and enjoy as much as we can.

Gently used 39' fiver = $40,000
Used 1-ton diesel dually crew cab = $40,000
TOTAL for 330-400 sq. ft. living space = $80,000 or under

X2

Read further into the thread to find the answer as to why I'm not buying another fifth wheel; I have experience with all towables, and we're done with them.

[GMandJM]

I can't speak as to the EGR system, but I wouldn't let the DEF and DPF systems be the biggest factors in deciding not to buy newer diesel model.

DEF is easy to get and I've had no issue with it yet. Any particular issue you have in mind?

Most soot burns off in the DPF system during normal driving. I'm not sure how much mileage difference we're talking for brief active regen. I can't imagine it would be all THAT much.

One thing I'm not sure I like about Tiffin is that they've disconnected the manual regen option. I guess to keep people from starting fires by doing a regen while parked on dry grass. Not sure if other makers have done this.

I'd like the option of choosing when and where to do a regen, but that's just me being a control junky 😉