Dealer refusing to do Warranty work?

[trukeeper]

After owning my new Winnebago Era 70A for a few weeks, I decided to take it to a local Winnebago dealer to have some warranty work done. Nothing major, really, some adjustments/repairs, and a couple of items need to be replaced (a non-functioning tail light, etc.).... In other words, typical warranty items. I went over my list with the service department yesterday and they said it would take a week or so since there were a few parts to order. Today, I get a phone call from the Service Department stating their GM instructed them to do NO Warranty work on my Era since I did not buy it from them!! Bear in mind, this dealer is an authorized Winnebago Dealer and is on Winnebago's official list. I have never heard of an authorized dealer refusing to do warrantly work before. Is this typical of Winnebago dealers? I have contacted Winnebago on this and they are "Looking into the matter".. meanwhile, my RV sits in that dealers lot waiting for me to pick it up. Any sugggestions? Do I have any recourse? Unfortunately, I don't know of any other Winnebago authorized dealers in our metro area and I really don't want to drive 700 miles (rountrip to the dealer where I purchased the RV) to get these issues taken care of. Suggestions?

[Dog_Folks]

PDI is most referred to as Pre-Delvery Inspection, when the buyer is present. That is also what I meant by PDI.

trukeeper: Now that I know this was your first RV, it explains a lot.

Everyone has had a "first." Your learning curve is steeper, at first.

I really feel bad for you now, with all these problems. No one deserves this hassle, especially a "newbie."

If there is any way we can help, just call.

[Bumpyroad]

spadoctor wrote:
PDI = Pre-delivery Inspection? If so, then the answer is yes. Well, actually, they referred to it as an "orientation session".

These are two totally different things. The PDI is what the dealer is paid for going over the unit and making adjustments...ordering parts to make pre-delivery repairs etc. The orientation session is where the dealer walks you through the unit and explains/shows you where things are and how to operate them and answer questions. I have owned rv's since 1983 and every time I purchase one the dealers insist I do a walk thru with them. Then again I am lucky I have dealt with 4 great dealers...but some better then others at that.

Until recently, all discussions of PDI in this forum have always related to the walk through that you make prior to delivery to see how systems work, any fix ups that are required, etc.
only recently has the intent changed to that as you described, without the purchaser present. I would call that dealer prep myself.
bumpy

[spadoctor]

PDI = Pre-delivery Inspection? If so, then the answer is yes. Well, actually, they referred to it as an "orientation session".

These are two totally different things. The PDI is what the dealer is paid for going over the unit and making adjustments...ordering parts to make pre-delivery repairs etc. The orientation session is where the dealer walks you through the unit and explains/shows you where things are and how to operate them and answer questions. I have owned rv's since 1983 and every time I purchase one the dealers insist I do a walk thru with them. Then again I am lucky I have dealt with 4 great dealers...but some better then others at that.

[trukeeper]

Dog Folks wrote:


My apologies. In my old age I forgot just how generic, general and thus worthless these manuals are. Ours is also!

Like others, I really believe you have been wronged, in many ways.

One other question: Did you not have a PDI? When we had our last PDI, the purpose of every knob, appliance, and feature was pointed out to us and then shown how it works. It was about three hours long with the technician.

PDI = Pre-delivery Inspection? If so, then the answer is yes. Well, actually, they referred to it as an "orientation session". We spent over 4 hours with one of their techs. This is our first RV, so I got to be honest here,.. everything we were learning was for the first time. "what do you mean, I have to "winterize" this thing??.. what's that supposed to mean?"" Black water? What the %#$ is that??. you mean the water is literally black for some reason?... yes, this is the kind of conversations we were having. None-the-less, after about 4 hours, they tossed us the keys and sent us out into 0 degree temps, 3 feet of snow, and a combination of rain, sleet, and more snow falling down for us to commence our 325 trip back home. I think their parting words were "when you run low of fuel, look for the pumps with the green handles...." ok, great... I am all over this.... Good times all around. Don't get me wrong, the dealer was great.. but we really are pretty much starting from ground zero with all this RV stuff.

[Dog_Folks]

trukeeper wrote:

Dog Folks wrote:
"Some of the items I had listed were considered invalid (for instance, when I set my stereo to the "b" speakers, there is no sound.. that is because there are no "B" speakers in my RV... ok, I can accept that "

"They said they decided to pursue the fog lamp issue anyway and found out the Era only has one fog light, i.e. everything was working as designed. Ok, good to know."

Well, there are two "warranty" items of 8, noted that could have been fixed by reading the manual! Just sayin.....

Actually, there are two "warranty" items of, noted that could have been fixed if the manuals actually documented how things work. I went through every manual I had and there is nothing, nada documented about the "B" speakers one way or the other. As for the rear fog lights, The Mercedes Sprinter owners manual is ambiguous at best. The only clue documented in the Mercedes owners manual is a heading reference to the rear fog light (i.e. the word "light" is singular rather than plural). Of course the same section also talks about the Front Fog light, too (also a singular usage of the word "light" even though there are two of 'em up front), so there you go. I talked to three different Tech people at Mercedes before one person speculated that there MAY only be one rear fog light because she knew about other Mercedes sedans having only one rear fog light.

My apologies. In my old age I forgot just how generic, general and thus worthless these manuals are. Ours is also!

Like others, I really believe you have been wronged, in many ways.

One other question: Did you not have a PDI? When we had our last PDI, the purpose of every knob, appliance, and feature was pointed out to us and then shown how it works. It was about three hours long with the technician.

[trukeeper]

RespondingBack wrote:
Well, looks like it took the dealer $110 to figure out there was only one fog light in rear.

There is so much stuff on RVs, it's difficult to track down all the info--obviously the dealer didn't know the answer or wouldn't have spent $110 worth of time to figure it out.

Now, here is the way the world works:

1. Winnebago warranty issue. No, Mercedes warranty issue. No, appliance manufacturer issue. No, it's an adjustment and not a warranty issue. No, selling dealer should have shown you in walk-through. No, should have figured it out from reading manual, repair manual, CD, special bulletin, secret manuals.

2. If you had only bought the RV from your local dealer in the first place, it would have been perfect and you'd be their first priority--just like you were their first priority when they had the chance to follow-up on your initial interest. And just like you are a priority opportunity for them to show you why you should use/buy from them in the future and recommend them.

3. It's all your fault anyways. You failed to make enough effort to keep the local dealer informed of your interest in the RV. You failed to give the local dealer a chance to match a competing offer from a hungrier, more interested dealer, and demonstrate how quickly they could get that RV for you. It's your fault for not reading all the manuals and knowing all the details of the new-to-you RV like knowing switches are for missing items. It's your fault for not knowing the intricacies of manufacturer-dealer warranty relationships and expecting straightforward warranty service from any Winnebago dealer (don't drive beyond the towing range of the selling dealer). It's your fault for thinking a big manufacturer with lots of dealers would be a better service network. It's your fault for buying an RV and expecting things to work. It's your fault for thinking that you should not have to coordinate Winnebago, selling dealer, service dealer, extra monies, your priest, the kitchen sink, to get a working RV. It's your fault for not understanding that you should be willing to wait weeks or months to get things fixed. It's your fault for buying an RV.

4. Finally, it's especially your fault for posting on an RV forum and trying to share info. By now, you should have figured out that it's all your fault, or there's two sides to every story and the other side is in the right or is the victim.

5. By the way, why do I recall reading stories about folks who buy from a local dealer and still get no satisfaction?

Yeah, I know... my bad.

[trukeeper]

Dog Folks wrote:
"Some of the items I had listed were considered invalid (for instance, when I set my stereo to the "b" speakers, there is no sound.. that is because there are no "B" speakers in my RV... ok, I can accept that "

"They said they decided to pursue the fog lamp issue anyway and found out the Era only has one fog light, i.e. everything was working as designed. Ok, good to know."

Well, there are two "warranty" items of 8, noted that could have been fixed by reading the manual! Just sayin.....

Actually, there are two "warranty" items of, noted that could have been fixed if the manuals actually documented how things work. I went through every manual I had and there is nothing, nada documented about the "B" speakers one way or the other. As for the rear fog lights, The Mercedes Sprinter owners manual is ambiguous at best. The only clue documented in the Mercedes owners manual is a heading reference to the rear fog light (i.e. the word "light" is singular rather than plural). Of course the same section also talks about the Front Fog light, too (also a singular usage of the word "light" even though there are two of 'em up front), so there you go. I talked to three different Tech people at Mercedes before one person speculated that there MAY only be one rear fog light because she knew about other Mercedes sedans having only one rear fog light.

[RespondingBack]

Well, looks like it took the dealer $110 to figure out there was only one fog light in rear.

There is so much stuff on RVs, it's difficult to track down all the info--obviously the dealer didn't know the answer or wouldn't have spent $110 worth of time to figure it out.

Now, here is the way the world works:

1. Winnebago warranty issue. No, Mercedes warranty issue. No, appliance manufacturer issue. No, it's an adjustment and not a warranty issue. No, selling dealer should have shown you in walk-through. No, should have figured it out from reading manual, repair manual, CD, special bulletin, secret manuals.

2. If you had only bought the RV from your local dealer in the first place, it would have been perfect and you'd be their first priority--just like you were their first priority when they had the chance to follow-up on your initial interest. And just like you are a priority opportunity for them to show you why you should use/buy from them in the future and recommend them.

3. It's all your fault anyways. You failed to make enough effort to keep the local dealer informed of your interest in the RV. You failed to give the local dealer a chance to match a competing offer from a hungrier, more interested dealer, and demonstrate how quickly they could get that RV for you. It's your fault for not reading all the manuals and knowing all the details of the new-to-you RV like knowing switches are for missing items. It's your fault for not knowing the intricacies of manufacturer-dealer warranty relationships and expecting straightforward warranty service from any Winnebago dealer (don't drive beyond the towing range of the selling dealer). It's your fault for thinking a big manufacturer with lots of dealers would be a better service network. It's your fault for buying an RV and expecting things to work. It's your fault for thinking that you should not have to coordinate Winnebago, selling dealer, service dealer, extra monies, your priest, the kitchen sink, to get a working RV. It's your fault for not understanding that you should be willing to wait weeks or months to get things fixed. It's your fault for buying an RV.

4. Finally, it's especially your fault for posting on an RV forum and trying to share info. By now, you should have figured out that it's all your fault, or there's two sides to every story and the other side is in the right or is the victim.

5. By the way, why do I recall reading stories about folks who buy from a local dealer and still get no satisfaction?

[Dog_Folks]

"Some of the items I had listed were considered invalid (for instance, when I set my stereo to the "b" speakers, there is no sound.. that is because there are no "B" speakers in my RV... ok, I can accept that "

"They said they decided to pursue the fog lamp issue anyway and found out the Era only has one fog light, i.e. everything was working as designed. Ok, good to know."

Well, there are two "warranty" items of 8, noted that could have been fixed by reading the manual! Just sayin.....

[gdoug83]

Sprinters only have a driver side rear fog light. It's a European thing. It's in your Sprinter manual.

[trukeeper]

Just got my Era back from the dealer. Of the list of items to fix under warranty, they claimed to have fixed 3 of them (out of a total of about 8 items). Of those three, they only actually addressed 2 of the items. Total time they spent working on the two items they DID fix... about 5 minutes.. at most (tighten one screw and adjust one small latch). They simply lied on the paperwork about the third item (the actual problem was sealant got slopped onto the overhead vent, someone needed to get on the roof and clean it off..) the vent looks exactly as it did when I brought it in....clearly no one got up there and even attempted to clean it up. well, now I know at least one RV dealer in the Olathe/Kansas City area that I will never do any business with again. In simple terms, they are nothing but liars and thieves. How they stay in business is beyond me.

[John___Angela]

Bumpyroad wrote:

booster wrote:
All of this could be fixed in a very short time if the manufacturer said that all authorized dealers do any and all authorized warranty work, and get paid a fair rate for the work.

I know in the case of car warranty work, the manufacturer pays for way too few hours to do most repair work, according to my friend who was a Dodge mechanic. that is why they hated to do warranty work
bumpy

I fully agree. From my experience it is common for a warranty claim approval to be submitted asking for lets say 3 hours to do a job and be given only 2 hours. If the unit was purchased at that dealer it is also common that the dealer sucks up the extra hour to make it smooth for the customer. If not purchased at that dealer then the extra hour must be collected from the customer or a direct loss is taken by the dealer. This is the kind of thing that can put a dealer under if it gets out of control. Certified, qualified techs along with their benefits are not cheap and it has to come from somewhere. Service managers answer to bosses just like the rest of society and month end reports showing non billable hours is a great way to shorten the career.

JMHO

[booster]

Les Balty wrote:
Winnebago treats their dealers better than other manufacturers. There are a lot of folks in Ohio and Indiana that have no showroom or service department but sell their units dirt cheap without incurring the additional costs associated these dealer services. Don't buy from one of these online dealers and then expect your local guy to give you the red carpet treatment. There is a cost to providing customer service. These folks have families to feed and businesses to run too. It's my understanding that Winnebago's delivery charges are the same whether the dealer is in Texas or Forest City. I would recommend the meeting with the GM. If they don't sell the ERA product, they shouldn't have a problem with servicing it even if you bought at another dealer. He might get to sell you your next unit that way!

The point is that Winnebago may be treating the dealers OK by the non servicing dealers opinion, but they are not doing their other dealers right. Nor are they doing their customers right. As I stated earlier, Winnebago could fix all this very quickly. I think you would see the non-servicing dealers come in line very quickly if they were made to have service available to ALL buyers. They could farm it out, but that would get pretty spendy when they had non customers coming in to them for a change. Winnebago is allowing some of their dealers to abuse the others, which isn't right.

[Les_Balty]

Winnebago treats their dealers better than other manufacturers. There are a lot of folks in Ohio and Indiana that have no showroom or service department but sell their units dirt cheap without incurring the additional costs associated these dealer services. Don't buy from one of these online dealers and then expect your local guy to give you the red carpet treatment. There is a cost to providing customer service. These folks have families to feed and businesses to run too. It's my understanding that Winnebago's delivery charges are the same whether the dealer is in Texas or Forest City. I would recommend the meeting with the GM. If they don't sell the ERA product, they shouldn't have a problem with servicing it even if you bought at another dealer. He might get to sell you your next unit that way!

[Bumpyroad]

fog light on the rear???
bumpy