brake controllers

[tempforce]

most new pickup trucks and hd vans can be purchased with the factory brake controllers.
now that the max brake and smart brake controllers are no longer in production.
is there any options for a brake controller that ties into the vehicles brake hydraulic system.
i know the electronic controllers have improved over the years.
but...
when driving, there is no comparison between the electronic and the hydraulic-electronic controllers.
i don't feel safe using the electronic controllers after using the hydraulic controller.
thanks for your inputs..

[tempforce]

Now that direct link, I would trust. As it is sensing brake pressure from the vehicle. Also using the vehicle to sense if the brakes have been applied with no system pressure. Allowing the system to use the trailers brakes if the tow vehicles brakes failed. That is a feature the max brakes and brake smart had. Integration with the vehicles systems is the best solution.
A decilerometer will only apply trailer brakes if it senses a slowing vehicle. Sometimes it could be too sensitive or at other times not sensitive enough, as road conditions change.
A integrated controller takes care of that issue.

[ctilsie242]

I paid a princely sum to get an OEM towing brake controller added to my truck. However, it is well worth it. The controller actually can detect when the trailer is starting to veer side by side and then pulse the trailer's brakes to stop that.

[Lynnmor]

DSteiner51 wrote:
The Prodigy was good but the Brakesmart, Maxbrake, etc was better. They were not old school but new school. The factory integrated now much uses the same technology. The Brakesmart did have a feature that I think should be on the factory units. The Brakesmart and Maxbrake were ahead of their time and cheapskates who would spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on fancy features would buy cheap junk that they relied on for safety.

I got laughed at for spending over $300 for a brake controller when others spent less then $100 and some less then $50. That is when I decided most people on RV.net really cared very little about safety but used that as an excuse to make their ignorant options carry some weight. Number 1 reason I left for a year+.

Well said, I have preached to deaf ears myself. Cheap and easy is King!

[DSteiner51]

The Prodigy was good but the Brakesmart, Maxbrake, etc was better. They were not old school but new school. The factory integrated now much uses the same technology. The Brakesmart did have a feature that I think should be on the factory units. The Brakesmart and Maxbrake were ahead of their time and cheapskates who would spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on fancy features would buy cheap junk that they relied on for safety.

I got laughed at for spending over $300 for a brake controller when others spent less then $100 and some less then $50. That is when I decided most people on RV.net really cared very little about safety but used that as an excuse to make their ignorant options carry some weight. Number 1 reason I left for a year+.

[LIKE2BUILD]

tempforce wrote:
i don't care how much people praise their electronic units. if you haven't used a brake smart, smart brake or factory controller you will never understand how dangerous those electronic units are.

I've never used an integrated hydraulically actuated brake controller.

But for 10 years I used my Prodigy with ZERO issues. The trailer brakes always felt seamless whether it was normal driving, stop and go traffic, or even panic stops. I never had a situation when I felt like the trailer brakes were ineffective or the truck was being pushed or jerked by poor braking behavior. I can't agree with your assessment that electronic units are dangerous. My experience tells me a quality proportional controller works just fine.

You seem to be on a soap box and your mind is made up that anything except and old-school controller is junk. Good luck.

KJ

[LIKE2BUILD]

tempforce wrote:
....
now that the max brake and smart brake controllers are no longer in production......is there any options for a brake controller that ties into the vehicles brake hydraulic system.
i know the electronic controllers have improved over the years.
but...i don't feel safe using the electronic controllers after using the hydraulic controller.

I used a Prodigy P2 on my previous truck for 10 years. It uses an accelerometer that senses your speed of deceleration and applies the trailer brakes proportionally. In all the years I used it the trailer braking was always smooth and reliable. I never felt the clunk and jerk you get from timer based controllers.

An added benefit is the Prodigy constantly monitors your brake system and shows when you have a problem. I bought my previous TT used and the truck I had at the time had a timer based controller. When I upgraded trucks I put in a Prodigy and soon started getting connection errors. When I dug into the problem I found bad connections at the trailer wheels. The old timer based controller never once indicated there were any issues.

I think you'll find the Prodigy is just about as close as you'll get to a hydraulically actuated brake controller.

KJ

[JBarca]

I agree, the master cylinder pressure is a global shift better. I have it in my F350

There is another option now though if you cannot or do not want to tie into the master cylinder.

DirectLink These guys Direct Link by Tuson

My son bought one for his 2500 Avalanche when he bought his TT. It plugs in the OBDII port. I was shocked at how smooth and simple that controller is. And it gives you other reads outs.

That is an "option" to give you the performance you are after if you want to mimic the OEM master cylinder type systems.

They are about $330 bucks. So far it has shown to be a really good controller.

Hope this helps

John

[BenK]

News flash...your cell phone employs a modern accelerometer...ditto personal pedometers, etc use solid state accelerometer chips

Old, old, old pendulum types were the best of it's time, but that time has come and gone...

On my windgenerator (am good up to 350KW) brake design (48" dia cast iron disc brake), found that hydraulic pressure sensors leaked too often, but that was the required spec

Moved to our industrial hydraulic sensors used in our steel rolling mill controls and found that they also leaked over time

[tempforce]

thats the problem, if the vehicle didn't come with the factory controller. it isn't available as a add on item. the pendulum electronic controllers are junk. even if they have a huge following. no i would not put a old style kelsey hayes unit on a vehicle with anti-lock brakes. having used a max brake system. it worked just like the factory controllers that are now available. leaving the aftermarket with the cheap unsafe electronic units. i don't care how much people praise their electronic units. if you haven't used a brake smart, smart brake or factory controller you will never understand how dangerous those electronic units are.

[jerseyjim]

Tap into a vehicles hydraulic brake system...you lose your warranty. MY experience with "aftermarket" electronic brake system has been positive. Sometimes quirky, but never a failure. My next pickup will definitely have the factory item. Makes sense.

[Lynnmor]

Now that the good controller companies have gone out of business, because people would only buy cheap, only the factory controllers work by responding to the drivers foot pressure. The after-market guess-work controllers are not something I would use.

There never was any kind of rule about connecting to the hydraulic system to add a real controller. Only if an old add-on controller required too much brake fluid to operate would there be a problem. The excellent controllers from Brakesmart and MaxBrake used a sensor that required no fluid. For those that complained about adding a simple tee, I guess they never replaced brake hoses, lines, master cylinders or wheel cylinders. Cheap and easy was the only thing that mattered.

[1320Fastback]

I would never attempt it on any vehicle with actual ABS brakes.

We still use Kelsey Hayes Hydraulic Brake Controllers in the 1st generation Cummins world as they are still the best way to stop a trailer smoothly,reliably time after time. Our trucks have basic abs on the rear axle only so we tap into the front brakes.

Of all the 1st gen owners I know of on separate user forums no one has ever heard of a failure. These units fell out of favor though at pressure from OEM and insurance companies. In Australia they are banned.

[ScottG]

I'm not sure what your asking. Do you want an aftermarket system because you don't think the factory units tie in?
If so you are mistaken. The factory units do indeed tie in and more importantly, they also tie in to the on-board electronics to work better and faster than ever. No aftermarket unit adjusts for when the anti lock system kicks in.
The factory system is a world apart from the old pressure sensing units.

[Lwiddis]

I haven't see an after market hydraulic brake adapter in years. Tap into your system and the manufacturer will successfully abandon you. A failure might be gross negligence on your part.