Cheap tires + Speed = Blown tire

[Hammerboy]

Last year around this time I posted how everybody on the highway whether car or truck and trailer were blowing by me and I passed maybe 2 people over several hours on the road with my cruise set at 67 mph. Some here even criticized me for going 67 as to fast.

Today on the way home from a trip in Indiana I have my cruise set now at 65. Coming up from behind me on the highway and passing me is a 1/2 ton truck pulling a trailer that was 30 ish feet long and moving along at a good clip - 75 mph+. He no sooner pulls in front of me and a tire on the drivers side blows. I never seen an actual tire blow before but it was quite a site to see all kinds of **** in the air. It looked like a snow storm of white stuff which I'm not sure what it was other that maybe insulation from a laminated floor perhaps. He realized it right away and pulled off safely on the side of the road.

Any way this made me even more of a believer in maintaining a proper speed and I need to upgrade my tires soon.

Dan

[dodge_guy]

Lynnmor wrote:

dodge guy wrote:


You wouldn’t think so, but looking at my throttle position parameters on the tablet throttle opening and engine load are approx. 12% less at 75 as opposed to 65!

So you go faster with less throttle? How do you slow down?

Just trying to be funny, but your math doesn't take into consideration that the engine is taking 16% more gulps per minute. It also doesn't take into consideration that the fuel air ratio might be different to provide the needed horsepower to maintain the higher speed.

All I am trying to say is that it takes more power to push thru the air as speed increases. It takes fuel to make that horsepower and higher torque (which is just higher cylinder pressure from an increase of air and fuel).

That all makes sense, but the fact is when the engine is running at its peak torque that’s where it’s most efficient. When going slower the engine is lugging which means more throttle opening and more fuel being dumped in to try and maintain that momentum.

What matters most is that at 65-67 or so I get less mileage than at 75!

[Lynnmor]

dodge guy wrote:


You wouldn’t think so, but looking at my throttle position parameters on the tablet throttle opening and engine load are approx. 12% less at 75 as opposed to 65!

So you go faster with less throttle? How do you slow down?

Just trying to be funny, but your math doesn't take into consideration that the engine is taking 16% more gulps per minute. It also doesn't take into consideration that the fuel air ratio might be different to provide the needed horsepower to maintain the higher speed.

All I am trying to say is that it takes more power to push thru the air as speed increases. It takes fuel to make that horsepower and higher torque (which is just higher cylinder pressure from an increase of air and fuel).

[dodge_guy]

Lynnmor wrote:

dodge guy wrote:

With my trailer and truck I get better mileage at 75 than I do at 67. the reason is because the rpms are bit higher which puts the engine into a better spot in its power band.

Since more speed requires more horsepower, and more horsepower requires more fuel, I don't think that it is possible to improve fuel mileage by increasing speed.

You wouldn’t think so, but looking at my throttle position parameters on the tablet throttle opening and engine load are approx. 12% less at 75 as opposed to 65!

It is very easy to see that if the engine is at the rpm where it’s making the most torque it will not work as hard!

[Lynnmor]

dodge guy wrote:

With my trailer and truck I get better mileage at 75 than I do at 67. the reason is because the rpms are bit higher which puts the engine into a better spot in its power band.

Since more speed requires more horsepower, and more horsepower requires more fuel, I don't think that it is possible to improve fuel mileage by increasing speed.

[rhagfo]

Atlee wrote:
I completely agree. In the old days, almost all, if not all trailer tires were speed rated at 65 mph. So for me,who also drives at 62-63 range, I was near the max speed rating. Yet I saw many a person pulling the trailer at the speed limit of 65, which allows no margin of error. And by golly, it the speed limit on the interstate was 70 or more, they were going to pull their trailer 70 mph or more.

Speed creates heat, and under inflation creates heat, and heat is the biggest enemy of tires, and especially trailer tires. That's why so many TT tires failed before (including the so call "china-bombs). Way too many miles being pulled at above the rated speed limit of the tire, and way too many trailer tires not inflated to their max.

ChuckSteed wrote:
Everytime I read post about my tires are rated at 80 plus and i tow at 75 I cringe. Too fast folks and your costing yourself extra money on waste fuel. I’ll drive at 62 , get much better fuel mileage, and leave myself a safety margin should an issue arise.

Do you really believe that there was a BIG difference running a tie speed rated at 65, at 62 to 63 as opposed to running them at 65. Personally I like the fact that my LT tires are speed rated at 106 mph, so at 65 to 70 I am well within a safety margin.

[dodge_guy]

ChuckSteed wrote:
Everytime I read post about my tires are rated at 80 plus and i tow at 75 I cringe. Too fast folks and your costing yourself extra money on waste fuel. I’ll drive at 62 , get much better fuel mileage, and leave myself a safety margin should an issue arise.

With my trailer and truck I get better mileage at 75 than I do at 67. the reason is because the rpms are bit higher which puts the engine into a better spot in its power band. And when the combo is dialed in it tows rock solid. I have had to make an evasive maneuver a couple of times and the trailer always follows the TV.

[Atlee]

I completely agree. In the old days, almost all, if not all trailer tires were speed rated at 65 mph. So for me,who also drives at 62-63 range, I was near the max speed rating. Yet I saw many a person pulling the trailer at the speed limit of 65, which allows no margin of error. And by golly, it the speed limit on the interstate was 70 or more, they were going to pull their trailer 70 mph or more.

Speed creates heat, and under inflation creates heat, and heat is the biggest enemy of tires, and especially trailer tires. That's why so many TT tires failed before (including the so call "china-bombs). Way too many miles being pulled at above the rated speed limit of the tire, and way too many trailer tires not inflated to their max.

ChuckSteed wrote:
Everytime I read post about my tires are rated at 80 plus and i tow at 75 I cringe. Too fast folks and your costing yourself extra money on waste fuel. I’ll drive at 62 , get much better fuel mileage, and leave myself a safety margin should an issue arise.

[Atlee]

Right now, I'm trusting a Goodyear Endurance tire more than I ham a generic Chinese tire. I would not trust the old GY Marathon tire, since it was no better than a generic Chinese tire.

What I think about Chinese tires is this. Early on, China was flooding the American trailer market with cheap, quickly built junk tires, and that's where the "china bomb" term first came into being.

Think now, there are some Chinese tires that are now built to higher standards, and they are alright. I still suspect the Chinese puts out some junk tires marketed under some generic name.
These I wouldn't want on my trailer.

At one time, Carlisle and GY Marathon tires could absolutely be included in the "china-bomb" category. However, today I believe Carlisle with it's newest generation of TT tires, and GY with it's new generation Endurance tire have fixed their old problems, at least anecdotal evidence indicates that.

A decade or more ago when I first get into towing a travel trailer, various RV boards were full of horror stories about Carlisle and Marathon tires exploding. I haven't heard any stories to that effect concerning the new generation of Carlisle HD and the GY Endurance tires.

dodge guy wrote:

RobWNY wrote:

2oldman wrote:

Hammerboy wrote:
I don't know for a fact they were cheap Chinese tires. It was an assumption as it looked like a pretty new entry level trailer that was going way too fast in my opinion.

Reasonable assumption. Entry level trailer=entry level tires.

Jayco is using Goodyear Endurance tires. Even on their entry level trailers. My neighbor just bought a new single axle 20 foot trailer. It has the Goodyears on it. Neighbor said every Jayco he looked at had the Goodyear Endurance tires on them. Just because it's a newer entry level trailer, don't assume it has Chinese tires on it.

Just because it says Goodyear on them doesn't mean they are good quality! I wouldn't trust a Goodyear more than any other cheap tire.

[time2roll]

ChuckSteed wrote:
Everytime I read post about my tires are rated at 80 plus and i tow at 75 I cringe. Too fast folks and your costing yourself extra money on waste fuel. I’ll drive at 62 , get much better fuel mileage, and leave myself a safety margin should an issue arise.

I mentioned 80+ mph rating and likewise tow at 60/65 MPH max for both safety and fuel economy.

[pnichols]

mich800 wrote:
Safety margin has more to do with following distance and situational awareness. I average between 1-2k miles per week and I would say the proportion of bad fast drivers is the same as the proportion of slow bad drivers. Slow does not equal safe in much the same way fast does not equal unsafe.

A couple of Proverbs that may or may not be Old Chinese:

1) Lack of following distance and situational awareness when going fast is ALWAYS more dangerous than lack of following distance and situational awareness when going slow.

2) Challenging the Laws of Motion by going fast is ALWAYS more dangerous than challenging the Laws of Motion by going slow.

If we all drove a little slower in this country we all might live a little longer in this country ... for several reasons.

[Lynnmor]

mich800 wrote:

ChuckSteed wrote:
Everytime I read post about my tires are rated at 80 plus and i tow at 75 I cringe. Too fast folks and your costing yourself extra money on waste fuel. I’ll drive at 62 , get much better fuel mileage, and leave myself a safety margin should an issue arise.

Safety margin has more to do with following distance and situational awareness. I average between 1-2k miles per week and I would say the proportion of bad fast drivers is the same as the proportion of slow bad drivers. Slow does not equal safe in much the same way fast does not equal unsafe.

Of course the slow drivers will create a much smaller debris field, and since they might care about safety, they might have decent tires in the first place.

[mich800]

ChuckSteed wrote:
Everytime I read post about my tires are rated at 80 plus and i tow at 75 I cringe. Too fast folks and your costing yourself extra money on waste fuel. I’ll drive at 62 , get much better fuel mileage, and leave myself a safety margin should an issue arise.

Safety margin has more to do with following distance and situational awareness. I average between 1-2k miles per week and I would say the proportion of bad fast drivers is the same as the proportion of slow bad drivers. Slow does not equal safe in much the same way fast does not equal unsafe.

[CincyGus]

My daughter told me not long ago, one of the things she loves about going on a camping trip with the wife and I is that I make it feel like vacation from the start. We have a planned time to leave and we prepack the trailer as much as possible with the clothes and whatever we are bringing that isn't already there. We usually grocery shop a day or two prior to leaving so everything has time to cool in the frig prior to going on propane for the trip. When someone asks me what time it is while we are on one of these trips, I ask what day is it. Because if it isn't the day we need to come home, I'm not concerned with what time it is.

So my point in bringing all this up on a tire thread is slow it down a little, take your time. Check your tire pressures prior to leaving, drive at the speed limit, make sure your tires are not getting beaten by the sun when it's parked and stored and check their condition regularly as most of the tire issues I've had are age, improper pressure (When I was first starting out) and tire condition related. ANY one of those being wrong/bad and you add in excessive speed, your asking for a blowout and likely some damage to the underside of your camper.

Just my 2 cents! Happy Camping!

[spoon059]

As I sit at my site and watch people pull in and set up, I watch in amazement sometimes when I see people cranking on their X-Chocks. They are turning and grunting and standing on the wrench, forcing the X-chock into the tires. I have to wonder how much damage is occurring to the structure of the tire by the pressure.

All the grumbling about cheap Chinese tires... perhaps its the care and maintenance that is more important.

I've got my stock "China bombs" that are 3.5 years old and almost worn to the wear bars. I don't use X-chocks, I am VERY careful not to bang curbs on turns. I check tire pressure before every trip and check tire and hub temps at every fill up. They are D rated tires with 2500+ lbs of carrying capacity on a trailer rated to 9500 lbs. Never had an issue. I'll likely change tires this winter due to wear, not any other factor.

There is more to the equation than "China bomb" tires...

[ChuckSteed]

Everytime I read post about my tires are rated at 80 plus and i tow at 75 I cringe. Too fast folks and your costing yourself extra money on waste fuel. I’ll drive at 62 , get much better fuel mileage, and leave myself a safety margin should an issue arise.