Horrible Sway

[cktrow11]

I tried to find a previous post, but was unable to. Sorry if this is a common question/post.
I have a 2015 Hideout 31rbts. Dry weight is 8500# from the factory. I tow it with a 2011 Ford F250 6.7 Powerstroke and use a Husky weight distibution hitch with dual sway bars - all rated to handle it. When I pull it though, it sways horribly if I do over 50 MPH even with 2 sway bars tightened down. I haven't scaled it, but I believe I have our load evenly distributed. We are full timers for now while I move around with my job, so I don't pull often. When I do though it's long distances and makes it even longer having to do 50mph or less. I've only made 3 trips so far, but dread any future ones as the last one was a 3 day trip that never seemed to end.
Tonight I measured the trailer and the hitch to see if maybe the dealer didnt set up the hitch properly and the ball on the truck is actually 3" higher than the trailer measurement. Will being that high cause sway? Manufacturer directions say 1" higher. I'm going to lower it, but I don't leave this work spot until February so just trying to get some peace of mind between now and then.
Sorry for the long post, but thanks for any input. Just want to know if it's a setup issue, or if I should go trade off our brand new camper we thought would be so perfect.

[cktrow11]

Thanks for some of this recent feedback. I've pulled many trailers with my truck and driven semis, but this is only my 2nd TT I've towed. As I've mentioned the first was always smooth and easy and this is a PITA. This is some of the feedback I was looking for in the beginning - different things to look for besides my tongue weight. (Not saying that isn't important, but other issues will exist that I've never had to worry about before that I need to check/play around with). Thanks again and keep any new feedback coming. It will help me to find the best all around adjustments and hopefully help others in the same situation. 36' of trailer and around 10000 lbs plus my truck is a lot to have tossed around an interstate and I don't want to be the cause of the wreck.

[ktmrfs]

I have a outback 295RE, 35' over 9,000lbs. Had it set up and towed perfectly behind my 2004 2500HD CC/SB/4x4 silverado duramax with bilstein shocks and torklift stabil loads.

Then we bought a 2015 GMC sierra 2500HD CC/SB/4x4 duramax. virtually identical vehicle with the stable loads but factory shocks.

hooked it up, checked out the WD, etc. and took the outback out for a trial run thinking it would be just like the 04. NOPE. no sway but not as stable as the 04 setup when changing lanes, very noticeable difference. 04 wasn't sensitive to tire pressure in the TV. Adding the bilstein shocks to the 15 helped, then running tire pressure to 75lbs front and rear helped, and needed to tilt the hitch head down one more notch. Now it is the same.

So, what seems like the same tow vehicle can act differently and subtle changes can have a big effect.

[myredracer]

We tow using an F250 and have no sway or handling issues. None. But we got all the "right stuff" and have the WDH adjusted correctly to get it that way. WE have a shorter (29') an lighter (7K lbs) TT tho. Something is not set up correctly or rated correctly. As mentioned, there's a bunch of different things to look at. There's no one single thing that will fix it, it's a summation of various things.

The very first thing you need to do is go to a scale and calculate the truck's payload capacity and GVW, the TT's GVW and the TW. You could get a surprise on the truck's payload capacity and the TW. Don't make guesses, esp. at this point.

The Hideout 31rbts is 36' long and is getting to be a rather long TT. The GVWR would be 9770 lbs. The actual tongue weight will be something like 1250 - 1450 lbs based on GVWR. (Do not go by dry weight). Your receiver is probably rated 1200 lbs max (with WDH) and potentially could need upgrading. The WDH will add about 100 lbs. Your spring bars could be under-rated.

Don't know what options your F250 has? What is the wheelbase? (Supercab, crewcab, long box?) Superduty and/or 4WD? LRE LT tires? WDH brand & type? A superduty with stronger frame and supsension will help. 4WD is higher off the ground and takes away payload cap.

Run the TT tires at their sidewall max. (65 psi for LRD). Try 75 psi on front of truck and 80 psi on rear. Check tire pressure before each trip or leg of a trip.

Make sure the WDH is adjusted to restore the correct amount of weight back onto the steer axle as per your owner's manual. If your spring bars are undersized, this may not be possible. VERY important to get weight back onto the steer axle. You may need to adjust tilt angle of hitch head.

Trailer needs to be level to slightly nose down, never nose up. I've found nose down is quite a bit better.

I would use at least a Reese DC WDH. The self-centering action will likely be a good thing for your particular TT & TV. A Hensley or Propride would be good of course, but you should address any underlying root causes first. I installed HD Bilsteins shocks on our F250 which really helps. I also added shocks to our TT which also helps a lot. Have also installed Reese shims in the hitch head/shank and a Blue Ox immobilizer to remove play in the hitch head assembly.

Semi trucks can pass us all day long without sway. Can drive with one hand on the steering wheel at 60 mph on the interstate if I wanted to (I don't very often tho.) with ease. Driving around corners at up to 65 mph is easy with predictable and comfortable handling.

Good luck and please report back when you've made some progress.

[CampingN_C_]

Are you sure it's true sway? Not insulting your intelligence, just asking, here's why.
It took me a trip to Disney and back at around 60mph to finally figure out my issue. The whole rig became very unstable much above 60. I called it 'sway' because I felt like I was all over the road. In fact is wasn't a trailer issue at all but a hitch set up issue. I was running 1200lb spring bars assuming that was plenty. Only when I weighed it and saw I was at 1500lbs that I realized the problem. Purchased new bars and I've been fine since.
TT's 32ft and over can be a pain to dial in IMO. I think small issues become big issues when you're pulling 35ft behind the bumper.

[cktrow11]

dodge guy wrote:

The only problem is your still guessing on the loaded weight of the trailer. So even if you load to 800 lbs, the trailer may weigh 8300lbs. That's under 10% for tongue weight. You need a good baseline for your loaded for a trip trailer. Then you can load to trailer with the tongue on a scale to get to the 12.5% tongue weight figure!

Tongue weight needs to be 10-15%. 15% of my 8500lb dry weight is 1275 lbs. If my tongue weight is at 1200 lbs I'm good up to 12,000lb total weight which I know I'm not that heavy. Heaviest I will be based on what I have in there (I haul with my tanks empty) is 10,000 lbs. If I'm between 1,000-1,200 lbs I know I'm in the 10-15% range that is recommended. Is it a "guess"? Yes, but it's an educated guess.

[dodge_guy]

cktrow11 wrote:

Wishin wrote:

cktrow11 wrote:
Calmed down a bit from when I posted initially and came to my senses. I'm going to quit being cheap and just buy a scale for the tongue. I have a pretty accurate guess on total weight, so I'll make sure I'm at target tongue weight before I leave AND set up the hitch properly. Make sure it's all correct and then if I still have issues I'll contact Keystone and try and get them to chime in and figure out why.

I think this is a great plan. You really need an accurate tongue weight measurement at a minimum to know what to do. I agree with most others that a light tongue is likely your problem. Good luck!

I can only hope. Otherwise it's time to try a different hitch such as the propride to hopefully get a safe tow.

The only problem is your still guessing on the loaded weight of the trailer. So even if you load to 800 lbs, the trailer may weigh 8300lbs. That's under 10% for tongue weight. You need a good baseline for your loaded for a trip trailer. Then you can load to trailer with the tongue on a scale to get to the 12.5% tongue weight figure!

[badercubed]

I have a 2010 Hideout 30BHDS with a BlueOx. I store most 'heavy' things (hibachi, chairs, tents, tables, etc.) up front either in the pass-through, under the bed or next to the bed. I try and leave the bunkhouse void of anything too heavy. I found it tows the best with the hitch set up without the water tank full and then I fill fresh tank.

[cktrow11]

Wishin wrote:

cktrow11 wrote:
Calmed down a bit from when I posted initially and came to my senses. I'm going to quit being cheap and just buy a scale for the tongue. I have a pretty accurate guess on total weight, so I'll make sure I'm at target tongue weight before I leave AND set up the hitch properly. Make sure it's all correct and then if I still have issues I'll contact Keystone and try and get them to chime in and figure out why.

I think this is a great plan. You really need an accurate tongue weight measurement at a minimum to know what to do. I agree with most others that a light tongue is likely your problem. Good luck!

I can only hope. Otherwise it's time to try a different hitch such as the propride to hopefully get a safe tow.

[Wishin]

cktrow11 wrote:
Calmed down a bit from when I posted initially and came to my senses. I'm going to quit being cheap and just buy a scale for the tongue. I have a pretty accurate guess on total weight, so I'll make sure I'm at target tongue weight before I leave AND set up the hitch properly. Make sure it's all correct and then if I still have issues I'll contact Keystone and try and get them to chime in and figure out why.

I think this is a great plan. You really need an accurate tongue weight measurement at a minimum to know what to do. I agree with most others that a light tongue is likely your problem. Good luck!

[mkirsch]

06Fargo wrote:

coolbreeze01 wrote:
An easy test would be little tow without your weight distribution hooked up.

One job our TV has from time to time is towing a dump trailer at around 15,000lbs with no WD. Truck has rear self leveling air suspension so it doesn't "squat" and change the steering geometry as tongue and cargo weight changes.

Next time when you hook on the dump trailer, take a measurement of the height of your front fender well before you hook up.

Disable your auto-leveling, load up the dump trailer, and take a second measurement of that front fender well.

Activate your auto-leveling, let it do its thing, then take a THIRD measurement of that front fender well.

There will be very little difference in the height of that front fender well with the auto-leveling disabled vs. active. Both will be higher than unloaded.

All your auto-leveling is doing is making the rig LOOK better. It is doing nothing to "fix" your steering geometry.

Raising the rear does not push the front end back down. Only a WD hitch will do that.

It makes me wonder: If level is so darned important why don't they mount the axles rigidly to the frame? Then the truck would never be out of level no matter how much weight you put into it.

[BenK]

The problem with this is that there is no 'one size fits all'...not even for socks... :B

The variety of TV's, their differing suspension architectures, the
variety of trailer architectures, variety of WD Hitch systems and a
BIG ETC....all have different dials, knobs and variables to know of
and account/adjust for

Then the vast amounts of opinions...highly aligned to be out in left field
That all work for 'each' adviser but not necessarily for the OP's seeking
advice/solutions

First, decide if you, the OP, believe in the OEM's ratings or the ratings
system.

If no, then this is academic.

If yes, then gather 'YOUR' TV's ratings info and learn how that system
works

The TV should have the amount or percentage or etc weight WD'd from
the TV's rear axle over to its front axle...as per the OEM instructions

Some list amount of drop from un-hooked to the amount of weight moved (WD'd)



On the trailer side...the tongue weight should be in the 10%-15% of
the actual trailer weight. I recommend closer to 13%-15%. Again, dependent
on the whole setup.


I'm on the side of leveling the trailer and even prefer/recommend
pointed slightly down


All 'good' WD Hitch systems has anti-sway designed in. Then the add
on friction bars, cams, etc to further enhance the anti-sway metrics


Suggest looking at the whole setup and the above as a 'goal' with
many, many dials/knobs that adjust to the end game of controlling
sway (AKA whipping back and forth)

Pictures of your components and setup would be helpful

[noteven]

coolbreeze01 wrote:
An easy test would be little tow without your weight distribution hooked up.

One job our TV has from time to time is towing a dump trailer at around 15,000lbs with no WD. Truck has rear self leveling air suspension so it doesn't "squat" and change the steering geometry as tongue and cargo weight changes. The dump trailer tows steady as a rock when the material cargo is distributed properly. If a bit to much gets to the back if you aren't chirping at the person loading not to do that it will sway.

RV trailer with its big long rear overhang multiplies the effect of weight behind the axles rapidly... plus the wind

[coolbreeze01]

An easy test would be little tow without your weight distribution hooked up.

[mkirsch]

cktrow11 wrote:
Calmed down a bit from when I posted initially and came to my senses. I'm going to quit being cheap and just buy a scale for the tongue. I have a pretty accurate guess on total weight, so I'll make sure I'm at target tongue weight before I leave AND set up the hitch properly. Make sure it's all correct and then if I still have issues I'll contact Keystone and try and get them to chime in and figure out why.

There is no "correct," except what makes the trailer tow well.

10-15% is a RULE OF THUMB. Some trailers will tow well with 8%. Some need 18%. These are rare corner cases, but you get the point, right?

If not, I will make it again: Just because your sherline scale says you have 10.1% tongue weight, does not mean the trailer will tow well.