lithium batteries

[F450]

Has anyone ever heard about using lithium batteries in a RV?

[PawPaw_n_Gram]

All I have to do is live long enough - and I'm sure we will have lithium in our rigs. I'm hoping 6 to 8 years from now.

[sjholt]

I for one would like you to document it here or send me the info as this could possibly be the last batteries I'll have to buy.
I looked over the site and couldn't find info on the BMS.

Thanks for the info.

[folivier]

Sorry, don't read this forum that frequently.
The system I'm presently installing are definitely not drop-in ready. These are 4 individual cells + a BMS that must be connected together. Not a big problem but does require some wiring skill and knowledge.
I'll be using my existing inverter to charge but may need to change out the voltage regulator for my engine alternator since my system will be so large it could fry my alternator. Even after all of that the total cost will be the same as AGM's. I'm replacing six 8D batteries.
I bought the cells and BMS from www.balqon.com
Sorry but I don't plan to document the install here since there are too many naysayers and I don't have the time or patience to deal with that.
This technology is still pretty much experimental for RV's. But if people don't jump in and test the waters then it won't become mainstream.

[RambleOnNW]

These lithium ions look good. 100AH each at 28 lbs, Group 31 size. Now if the price would drop in half from the $1300 it would be a go. Perhaps by the time the current 68AH 53lb Group 34 AGMs are at end of life.

[Dakzuki]

Redsky wrote:

Lithium batteries are expensive but comparatively light and compact for the power they can store. This has value in a jet or an electric care but zero value in an RV.

I beg to disagree. I have two AGMs in my RV and would love to have the additional capacity of Lithium Ion batteries. It's not just a matter of weight (which does matter in smaller RVs like mine) but a matter of volume. I can fit two batteries in my compartment....that's it. My two AGMs cost me $600. I'd gladly pay 2 grand for lithiums that fit in the same place (giving me much more capacity).

BTW, I am one of those Boeing engineering types that was knee deep in the battery thing. I work at Flight Test.

[ol_Bombero-JC]

westend wrote:

folivier wrote:
Lots of misinformation out there about LiFePO4 batteries. That's one of the problems. There are quite a few of live aboard boaters using them for a couple years now and really pleased with them. These are not the cobalt based batteries in the Boeing aircraft that had problems. These are actually newer technology and very safe.
It is possible to put together a LiFePO4 system of comparable AH for about the same cost as AGM batteries.

Please, tell us how we can get Lithium for the price of AGM!

Pliz do!..:@

.

[down_home]

Last year I posted about a small Retailer, Couple, at an RV Rally. They were selling them. One battery would replace four Deep Cycles 6 volts.
there are some running them evidently.

[Chuck_thehammer]

Me Again wrote:

Chuck_thehammer wrote:
and last year they grounded the 777 and 787 aircraft because!!!!!!! smoke...

and Tesla car fires...

and r/c lipo batteries has the came chemistry... a fire is a fire.

You missed Chevy Volt fires. And it is only the 787!

Chris

Thank You for the correction..

I keep forgetting Chevy makes the Volt. or the Volt is a car.

[Redsky]

The Tesla car was following a truck that had a piece of angle steel fall off and was projected up into the bottom of the Tesla with a force later calculated of more than 25 tons. The piece of metal pierced the shield around the batteries and pierced multiple batteries which then shorted out. The batteries then caught fire.

Had this happened to a standard car the gas tank would have been punctured and the car could have burst into flames and there would have been no survivors. Electric cars are the safest ones to be in with a crash and have the highest crash ratings of any cars on the road today.

Lithium batteries are expensive but comparatively light and compact for the power they can store. This has value in a jet or an electric care but zero value in an RV. Know of any light RV's? Even if the RV started out as light most are carrying around an extra 1000 lbs. or more of stuff. Saving 40 lbs. with a lithium battery is hardly cost effective.

Flooded and AGM and Gel types of batteries are mass produced by the millions and distributed by the truck load. No way a consumer lithium battery can compete on cost in the volumes they are produced and sold. If your RV has a vented battery compartment the flooded lead acid type are the best batteries to get. You can spend more but you will not get more in doing so.

[Me_Again]

Chuck_thehammer wrote:
and last year they grounded the 777 and 787 aircraft because!!!!!!! smoke...

and Tesla car fires...

and r/c lipo batteries has the came chemistry... a fire is a fire.

You missed Chevy Volt fires. And it is only the 787!

Chris

[Chuck_thehammer]

and last year they grounded the 777 and 787 aircraft because!!!!!!! smoke...

and Tesla car fires...

and r/c lipo batteries has the came chemistry... a fire is a fire.

[westend]

folivier wrote:
Lots of misinformation out there about LiFePO4 batteries. That's one of the problems. There are quite a few of live aboard boaters using them for a couple years now and really pleased with them. These are not the cobalt based batteries in the Boeing aircraft that had problems. These are actually newer technology and very safe.
It is possible to put together a LiFePO4 system of comparable AH for about the same cost as AGM batteries.

Please, tell us how we can get Lithium for the price of AGM!

[folivier]

Lots of misinformation out there about LiFePO4 batteries. That's one of the problems. There are quite a few of live aboard boaters using them for a couple years now and really pleased with them. These are not the cobalt based batteries in the Boeing aircraft that had problems. These are actually newer technology and very safe.
It is possible to put together a LiFePO4 system of comparable AH for about the same cost as AGM batteries.

[belfert]

Check out www.technomadia.com/lithium for an RVer that put in a fairly large lithium bank.

[atreis]

I looked into them a couple years ago as another way to save weight, but decided I just didn't want to spent that much money in order to gain ~100 lbs.

Advantages:
- MUCH less weight per AH
- Can be discharged to 20% charge without damaging the battery (meaning that 160 of those 200 AH are actually useful, as opposed to just 100 for a 200 AH lead-acid battery)
- Can be recharged 1000 or more times

Disadvantages:
- Limited maximum current draw (check rating on battery to see if it will work for you)
- Limited maximum charge current (check rating on battery)
- No Paukert Effect - when they're dead, they're really dead
- If discharged to shutoff, must be recharged within a (very) few days or they won't (ever) charge again
- COST!