No brakes on trailer

BobsYourUncle wrote:
Nice you finally got it figured out!
Feel good doesn't it?
:)

Yes sir! Especially considering I had resolved to be ok with having to replace the entire braking system. :D

Thank you for all your help!

Nice you finally got it figured out!
Feel good doesn't it?
:)

Amazing update... Finally had the chance to go check on the camper (it's been raining for days here!) and, first plug into truck (after monkeying with the 7 pin connector last week), truck was completely happy! I hooked up and drove a bit and used brake controller - brakes on the trailer bit as they should. I am so relieved! The fact that RAM brake controllers have been recalled on years around mine and since the camper sat for a bit and since the previous owner didn't know much about it was the perfect storm for me to assume (yes, yes, I know, bad!) the worst and check all I could. What I've learned:

1. Sometimes the easiest solution is not the most obvious.
2. You guys are a wealth of knowledge and I'm thankful for you.
3. If a trailer has grounding issues, chances are position/brake/turn signals won't work so no need to chase that.
4. Truck will stop all 15,000 lbs if I ever lose brakes on trailer.
5. Wiring diagrams shared can come in handy, so thank you for sharing them!

Much appreciated again. I very much appreciate each and every answer and possible solution!

Lynnmor wrote:
Not going to respond to all that "stuff", but here is just one item:

Hairline heat cracks are normal in bonded linings and should not be cause for concern.

This can be found on page 16.

Oh WOW, their example illustrates what looks to me as some serious cracking. I would have freaked out and tossed those shoes if I saw that on mine. Now I know. Thanks for sharing.

Read page 12 about tire skid. They say adjust the controller to tire slide on dry pavement while traveling 20 mph then back off just enough to eliminate tire skid. I don't do that either.

Gdetrailer wrote:


It is why when a inspection mechanic told me that the found a crack in one of the brake shoes, I CHANGED ALL of the backing plates even though the brake lining was good on the other axles..

Not going to respond to all that "stuff", but here is just one item:

Hairline heat cracks are normal in bonded linings and should not be cause for concern.

This can be found on page 16.

cummins2014 wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:

cummins2014 wrote:


Are we talking commercial here, I have a feeling some responses are talking commercial ,and not recreational Rv's here ,especially this skidding tire thing .

PA treats ALL trailers 3,001 lbs AND ABOVE THE SAME AS COMMERCIAL TRAILERS FOR SAFETY INSPECTION INCLUDING RV TRAILERS AND ARE SUBJECT TO HAVING TO PASS ALL INSPECTION REQUIREMENTS FOR THE SAFETY EQUIPMENT OF THAT TRAILER.

Brakes MUST work (visual check and operational check), breakaway MUST work (visual and operational check), outside safety lighting MUST WORK, TIRES must pass min tread depth, frame MUST not be rusted out or damaged.

3,000 lbs and under do not have a electric brake requirement and do not need a annual safety inspection.

Just because it is a RV, you don't get a free hall pass on safety inspection.

Just curious. not required in the state of Utah. It was sounding a bit commercial .

In my state, all trailers are inspected when bought, mostly to check the VIN. After that, you load a Bobcat, mower, or other tools, you might get stopped for a roadside safety inspection. The RV is unlikely to be checked as long as you own it. So for a RV, the only one that pays a penalty for non-functional brakes is the one injured in the accident.
But the trailer brakes under that Bobcat work just like the ones under RV. Everything I know about repairing the one will work to troubleshoot the other.
Before I retired, and a few times after, I have been called to fix lights or brakes on a trailer. I get there the wiring is all poked, pulled loose disconnected, and crossed up. And most times I get paid more for fixing what I can find the owner tore up because he assumed, or just as bad, plugged in the 6 little LED "tester", the TV is good! That is dropping if not the anvil, at least a hammer on your foot.

Gdetrailer wrote:

cummins2014 wrote:


Are we talking commercial here, I have a feeling some responses are talking commercial ,and not recreational Rv's here ,especially this skidding tire thing .

PA treats ALL trailers 3,001 lbs AND ABOVE THE SAME AS COMMERCIAL TRAILERS FOR SAFETY INSPECTION INCLUDING RV TRAILERS AND ARE SUBJECT TO HAVING TO PASS ALL INSPECTION REQUIREMENTS FOR THE SAFETY EQUIPMENT OF THAT TRAILER.

Brakes MUST work (visual check and operational check), breakaway MUST work (visual and operational check), outside safety lighting MUST WORK, TIRES must pass min tread depth, frame MUST not be rusted out or damaged.

3,000 lbs and under do not have a electric brake requirement and do not need a annual safety inspection.

Just because it is a RV, you don't get a free hall pass on safety inspection.

Just curious. not required in the state of Utah. It was sounding a bit commercial .

cummins2014 wrote:


Are we talking commercial here, I have a feeling some responses are talking commercial ,and not recreational Rv's here ,especially this skidding tire thing .

PA treats ALL trailers 3,001 lbs AND ABOVE THE SAME AS COMMERCIAL TRAILERS FOR SAFETY INSPECTION INCLUDING RV TRAILERS AND ARE SUBJECT TO HAVING TO PASS ALL INSPECTION REQUIREMENTS FOR THE SAFETY EQUIPMENT OF THAT TRAILER.

Brakes MUST work (visual check and operational check), breakaway MUST work (visual and operational check), outside safety lighting MUST WORK, TIRES must pass min tread depth, frame MUST not be rusted out or damaged.

3,000 lbs and under do not have a electric brake requirement and do not need a annual safety inspection.

Just because it is a RV, you don't get a free hall pass on safety inspection.

Lynnmor wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:
Only pulling the trailer forwards or backwards will show just how good the brakes are working. In fact that IS one of the "tests" that my State Inspection mechanic does..

I've had trailers inspected in PA since 1977, and never once seen anyone do the pull test on brakes.

Inspection Mechanic can get audited, they have a check list of items they must check/test.. Most mechanics ignore doing their job and simply check off the boxes on their list..

Shop I go to, first item they do IS pull the pin and have me drive forward a couple of feet.

If they observe one or more tires not locking and skidding it is game over on the test and a fail on the inspection..

Turning tires do not count as a pass on the breakaway system.

They are to verify all lights work as they should.

They are to check tire condition/tread..

They are to pull one drum on each side and verify the brake lining is sufficient and condition is not cracked.

I am not sure just HOW anyone can fully access how good the braking system is working just by jacking a tire up, turning it by hand then pulling the pin..

Brake shoes and drum do wear and they do not wear the same on each drum.. So over time one or more brakes WILL need some adjustment, even the ones with auto adjusters will need some manual intervention once in a while.

PA inspection manual does not DIRECTLY say about lockup and skid but.. It states the following from HERE

Page 61..

"(c) Breakaway System - A trailer operated on a highway which is equipped with brakes or which has gross weight in excess of 3,000 pounds shall be equipped with a breakaway system which shall stop and hold the vehicle automatically upon breakaway from the towing vehicle."


The ONLY way to access that the breakaway and brakes are working and correctly adjusted IS TO PULL AHEAD UNDERLOAD.

Once again TURNING WHEELS WITH BREAKAWAY PIN PULLED DOES NOT COUNT AS A PASS here and yes, you can have fully functioning electrical part of the break away system but have a MECHANICAL issue preventing one or more brakes from fully engaging and locking.

Brakes can lockup when wheel is turned by hand but yet CAN turn when being pulled under load..

While the PA manual does not directly "describe" the exact method the mechanic should use, it IS clear that the brakes MUST function well enough to STOP AND HOLD the trailer.. Just because it stops turning by hand, it doesn't mean the brakes WILL stop and hold when under load.

Page 67 of same document states..

(d) Road Test - Perform a road test of a trailer over 3,000 pounds registered gross weight and reject if the vehicle is not capable of stopping within the maximum stopping distance prescribed in Table I or swerves so that any part leaves the 12 foot lane.

Yep, your inspection mechanic IS also supposed to do a road test..

And yes, PA treats ALL trailers including RVs the SAME as "commercial" trailers as far as inspection goes.. There is ZERO "exemptions" just because it is a RV trailer.. Somewhat working does not cut it and a good inspection mechanic will attempt to FIND any and all faults before signing off on the sticker.. It is their license on the line and if they pass something that isn't functioning well because they are to lazy to do their job, they will lose their license if they pass a substandard trailer.

And yes, I have run into some bad inspection mechanics that just slap stickers on. I don't go back to those as I WANT to find out if there is something I missed..

It is why when a inspection mechanic told me that the found a crack in one of the brake shoes, I CHANGED ALL of the backing plates even though the brake lining was good on the other axles..

You can do things well or do things half baked.. I like to error on the things done well side of life..

cummins2014 wrote:

Are we talking commercial here, I have a feeling some responses are talking commercial ,and not recreational Rv's here ,especially this skidding tire thing .

I'm not much smarter than a box of rocks, but have don't a lot of work with trailer lights and brakes over the years. Can somebody explain how the brakes know if they should be working for fun or profit?
From what I see the main difference is the probability of LEO checking the equipment.