3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[ol_Bombero-JC]

RDMueller wrote:


One thing I'm wondering is if anyone has build a shroud for this type of gen to quiet it down? I'm slowly reading through this thread and feel certain that this is discussed somewhere, but it'll take me a while to get through 900 pages!

Try this thread also -

Clicky

~

[jlaustin]

RDMueller wrote:

... Even though I bought it as an emergency genny, now I'm considering using it for camping as well. One thing I'm wondering is if anyone has build a shroud for this type of gen to quiet it down? I'm slowly reading through this thread and feel certain that this is discussed somewhere, but it'll take me a while to get through 900 pages! ...

"Somewhere" in those 900 pages you'll find plenty of ideas for shrouds! If you want to take the lazy way out, you can purchase a "SuperGen tent" here. Also, the Professor has an extensive video review of this product a ways back in the thread, too.

Regards,
John

[Old___Slow]

Welcome RDM. Your going to be in the dog house soon, if you stay on this thread, with many others.:) Some call the enclosures the 'dog house' ~ Please don't get the idea I pretend there is a Sound Engineer writing this post. Yes, you will find plenty of others who have a great deal of 'know how' on the subject of sound abatement for the genny.

Here is just one idea. About $35 in cost. Size of enclosure. 28" by 24" by 20" high. Build the frame using 1"x 2" material. Just like building the framing for a stick house. Cover each piece (Ends, sides, top) with the black sound board you will find at Lowe's or Home Depot in 4'x8'x1/2" sheets. On the start assy. end, cut a 4" by 4" opening, for air intake, near the breather. On the genhead end, cut another opening for air exhaust, 4" x 12" just below the fuel tank line. Later you might get crafty and add some bafffles for the air openings, off setting the openings, they say sound hates turning corners. While operating the gen, slid the cover (top) to the left
3 to 4" inches. When cover is closed, the gen will be weather protected. Use screw eyes on each piece and tie together with bungee cords. The five pieces will be nice and light and easy to transport. Should lower the noise about 10 dBA. Cheers. your neighbors will love you.

Your report of good success with the PowerMax 4400e goes along with others who have reported the same. Good quality.

[RDMueller]

I have a PowerMax XP4400E that I bought a few years ago as an emergency generator to have around the house. So far I haven't "used" it, although I do run it every few months and keep fresh gas in it so it'll be ready when I need it. For the price I paid, I'm very pleased with the unit and feel like it's really pretty well built.

Even though I bought it as an emergency genny, now I'm considering using it for camping as well. One thing I'm wondering is if anyone has build a shroud for this type of gen to quiet it down? I'm slowly reading through this thread and feel certain that this is discussed somewhere, but it'll take me a while to get through 900 pages!

Great forum! I know I'll learn a lot here.

[Old___Slow]

etex211 wrote:
I am new to this forum. I got here via a link to this thread from another forum. I've read about 50 pages of this thread and find it fascinating.

I have one question about the Champion generator. I see what appears to be the same generator under several different model numbers. I assume them to all be essentially the same thing, but I'm not sure. My biggest question is about generator output. Some of them say that they are 3500/4000 and some of them say that they are 3000/3500. Is there really a difference in output from one model to the next?

I do believe the answer to the question asked is and as far as I know after near four years on this thread, the 3000/3500 and the 3500/4000 models are the same. Same 196 cc engine and the same generator head. Same output of about 2600 to 2800 watts with a great surge limit for the A/C. After 4 years use of the Champion C46540 3500/4000w on a label, operation has been great. For less than $300 in cost, I would buy the same unit again. I'm looking to buy a Inverter generator, just need more buyer reviews of several different labels. We need to know if the new Champion 1500w Inverter x 2 will operate the 15,000 btu A/C's while they cycle on 90 degree plus days. Like for more than 30 minutes. Maybe some one will tell us they have several hundred hours of operatation @ 1500w usage with the new Champion Inverter. No engine problems and no output problems.

[greenrvgreen]

eTex--

Welcome!

Yes, there are two basic 3k Champion models (plus the other brands). You can find them here:

http://cpeauto.com/recreational.php

I have the 3500/4000, which is the older model, and I love it. It is a very good value for the money. Not as quiet as a Honda, but a fraction of the cost and of equal or better build quality.

[etex211]

I am new to this forum. I got here via a link to this thread from another forum. I've read about 50 pages of this thread and find it fascinating.

I have one question about the Champion generator. I see what appears to be the same generator under several different model numbers. I assume them to all be essentially the same thing, but I'm not sure. My biggest question is about generator output. Some of them say that they are 3500/4000 and some of them say that they are 3000/3500. Is there really a difference in output from one model to the next?

[toprudder]

professor95 wrote:
Now, isn't that interesting? I am only aware of a gasoline model - must be some ad copy goof? Or, there could be something in the works we do not know about. Northern is big on tri-fuel generators.

I suspect it is a goof on NT's part. They probably cut/pasted from another generator's info when they added this model to the website.

For that price, I would be REALLY interested in a tri-fuel model!

[professor95]

toprudder wrote:

professor95 wrote:
Northern Tool and Equipment is now carrying the Category 5 Champion 3,500 watt remote controlled, electric start generator. The only difference is the color scheme. This model is silver and black rather than the familiar yellow and black. You can review it here.

On edit: Is this gasoline or LPG?. It lists the wattage for both LP and NG, but then "fuel type" is listed as gasoline.

I did not see it listed on the Champion website.

Now, isn't that interesting? I am only aware of a gasoline model - must be some ad copy goof? Or, there could be something in the works we do not know about. Northern is big on tri-fuel generators.

When the hurricanes hit the Gulf Coast a few years back, Champion started distributing it's generators to that area under the "Category 5" (by Champion Power Equipment) name. It has, I think, caught on and now caries over to other markets.

When the 46538 came out, it had the Category 5 designation as shown here, while other similar updated designs of the products, like the 6500 shown here, continued to carry only the Champion name.

Now, what I have been led to believe and has become self-evident is that CPE distributors like Home Depot, Lowes, and now Northern Tool have the ability to specify or negotiate features for CPE generators sold in their stores. Currently, these models are a little different and are not all shown on the CPE web site.

It "looks like" Northern not only wanted some different features but a different color scheme along with the Category 5 marque. This is really not that new (the color change) as Ultra-Fab specified blue on their models beginning two years back. There were "rumors" a while back that Lowe's would be selling a KOBALT branded Champion generator painted blue, and Home Depot would have an orange HOMER - but to date that has not happened. Again - only rumors.

To the best of my knowledge, Champion does NOT sell their products under other brand names without specifying that they are Champion Power Equipment products - or now Champion GLOBAL power equipment according to their product labels.

I kinda' like the black and silver.

[toprudder]

professor95 wrote:
Northern Tool and Equipment is now carrying the Category 5 Champion 3,500 watt remote controlled, electric start generator. The only difference is the color scheme. This model is silver and black rather than the familiar yellow and black. You can review it here.

On edit: Is this gasoline or LPG?. It lists the wattage for both LP and NG, but then "fuel type" is listed as gasoline.

I did not see it listed on the Champion website.

[professor95]

blkfe wrote:
What, if any, mods need to be done to a Champion 4000/3500 to get it to run at 10,000 feet. My Friend lives in Leadville Colorado and wants to know. Are there different jets available or what?
Brad

Nothing from Champion.

But, you might want to try here for some different jets.

I do NOT know what size is needed or anyone that has actually done a 10,000 foot conversion. But, at least this is a place to get something different to try.

[blkfe]

What, if any, mods need to be done to a Champion 4000/3500 to get it to run at 10,000 feet. My Friend lives in Leadville Colorado and wants to know. Are there different jets available or what?
Brad

[professor95]

Northern Tool and Equipment is now carrying the Category 5 Champion 3,500 watt remote controlled, electric start generator. The only difference is the color scheme. This model is silver and black rather than the familiar yellow and black. You can review it here.

You will notice the new 2000/1700 watt CPE inverter is there too.

Orders may be placed on-line and picked up in a store with no shipping added to the price.

[professor95]

Harrygoodwrench wrote:


I do however have a question. My local Tractor Supply has Champion 5000 watt generators (#41115) on sale at a reasonable price ($449.) I was thinking about getting one for the house when power goes out.
Has any one heard anything about the reliability of these larger units? If as good as my 3500 I'd be tickled pink. 🙂

The 5,000; 6,500 and 7,200 watt units all use GX style engines and the same type of alternator construction as your 3,500.

I have a 13HP GX390 6,500 watt unit at home I run on LPG. It is now four seasons young.

Other than being considerably louder, mine has been just as dependable and easy to service as it's little brother.

[Harrygoodwrench]

Hi all,
I purchased my 3500W Champion about two years ago for my Adirondack camp after reading about all the satisfied posts here. I too am very happy with my gen sets performance.

I do however have a question. My local Tractor Supply has Champion 5000 watt generators (#41115) on sale at a reasonable price ($449.) I was thinking about getting one for the house when power goes out.
Has any one heard anything about the reliability of these larger units? If as good as my 3500 I'd be tickled pink. 🙂

My 3500W Champion unit stays at my camp so having a 5,000 watt at home would run most of what I'd need to be happy with no power.



Here is the unit on sale.


Tractor supply Champion 5,000 watt


Best in portable power, the Champion Power Equipment® Portable Gasoline Generator produces up to 6000 peak watts and 5000 constant running watts. The integrated control panel is easy to use so you can get a handle on the tough jobs around home or farm.

337cc Champion OHV 11 HP Engine
1 in. diameter tubular steel frame
120V/240V twist lock and two duplex receptacles
6.34 gallon fuel tank will run up to 10 hours at 50% load
8 in. wheel kit
2 year limited warranty
Whether you are looking to protect your family and possessions during a power outage, run a few tools or venture into the great outdoors, there's no better feeling than taking control of your power needs with a Champion™ generator. Portable generators are an affordable way to have power when you need it most. While being easy to start and use, they offer a premium combination of power, performance and value.

NOTE: This product is not available for sale in or shipment to California.

Brand: Champion Power Equipment®
Type: Portable Generator
Application: Portable and Emergency Power
Power Rating: 5000 W / 6000 W
Current Rating: 20.8 A / 20 A
Voltage Rating: 120/240 V
Engine: 337cc Champion OHV Engine / 11HP
Width: 21 in.
Total Length: 31-1/4 in.
Height: 22 in.
Product Weight: 189 lb.
Fuel Type: Gasoline
Fuel Capacity: 6.34 gal.
Run Time: 10 hrs. at 50% Load
Starting: Recoil
Wheel Kit: Yes
Warranty: 2 Year Limited Warranty / 90 days Commercial / Lifetime Free Technical Support


PS the champion 3500 watt is on sale for $279. thats a good price too.