Easy Start By Micro Air

[1L243]

I wanted to run my 13.5 Dometic AC on my generator but having only a 2000 watt Honda EUI, it was either buy a bigger generator or try the Easy Start from Micro Air.

I decided to go with the Easy Start. Installation was straight forward a youtube video was a great help.

After installation you have to go though a learning process for the Easy Start.

After the learning process I connected to my Honda 2000 and it ran the AC just fine. Prior to the Easy Start it would just trip the generator.

I tested amps at sartup prior to Easy start and it was around 32 amps. Now keep in mind this is just for a second when the compressor kicks on but enough to kick off the generator.

After Easy Start the start up amps are around 15 to 18 amps. It's so fast it's hard for the electrical monitor to record it.

The Honda has to be run on fast or run mode and not econo mode when using the AC .

For fun I thought I would see if the AC would run on my 2000 watt inverter and it did!

It was no different than running on the generator as far as the start up is concerned. Once the compressor kicks in the AC is running on about 12 amps.

I have a 500 watt solar system with 2000 watt Renogy inverter. My battery bank is 340 amp hours of lead acid.

I know I can't run the AC long on the battery bank that I now have but it will be interesting to see what happens when I'm dry camping in two weeks and see what the draw is on ac when solar is at it's peak of about 25 amps.

When ever I run a big appliance like microwave or coffee maker off my lead acid batteries my battery voltage drops to about 11.5 volts and it stays there until they appliance is turned off. Then the voltage creeps back up to the actual voltage. I understand this does not happen to Lithium batteries. It makes it difficult to monitor the battery voltage when under a heavy load.

So a big thumbs up to Easy Start by Micro Air

[3_tons]

“If you want to be able to boondock all year round and run at least one AC you will need that large battery bank 1200ah in lithium would cost you a bundle. Throw in 1500 watts of solar on the roof and some nice Victron electronics and you into a 25k+ solar system not counting labor.”

To some extent I somewhat agree, but (non-intuitively…), if one thinks about it in terms of power consumed vs power recovered ‘over time’ (considering peak and non-peak daylight harvest hours), then (assuming using LFP’s) it becomes more of a battery capacity (think, water well bladder-like) ‘balancing act’ of what goes in - vs what goes out over a time (i.e. usable battery capacity vs consumption vs harvest rate), whereby often a sufficient capacity reserve exist and restoration (if not even to FULL) is achieved before or by noontime while temps are still within a fairly comfortable range

Quite naturally this will vary with the vagaries of weather, one’s own rig, equipment, etc, but in this way I’ve found that quite often an assumed 1 to 1 direct ‘in vs out’ energy ratio is seldom a requirement…

Here’s just one admittedly anecdotal example using a 11kbtu air cond (9.5a, low fan), 660w solar, two 200a/hr LFP (load tested to an ‘actual’ 215a/hr per…), a 2/3rds air cond duty cycle, with a 2/3rds harvest rate, while assuming batteries starting out at say 90% SOC, this, for a single slide-out Truck Camper:

400a/hr LFP rated capacity, between (example only) 90% - 20% SOC = 280 usable a/hr range (yet from ‘actual LFP experience’, still a somewhat conservative number as voltage plateau remains fairly flat throughout discharge)…

95a (dc) air conditioner @ 2/3rds duty cycle = approx 57a/hrs (dc).

23.5a (dc) hourly adjusted harvest = a 33.5a/hrs hourly run deficit…

In view of the aforementioned ‘balancing act’, (just) 280 usable a/hrs / 33.5 a/hr deficit = an approx 8hrs run time (compressor cycling)…

Note however that over such hypothetical 8hr extended run time, harvest will not be static…

Conversely, a simple 1-to-1 energy ratio paradigm would suggest that a whopping 950w of solar might be required to maintain energy parity (in the longer view, not necessarily so!), and remember that shortly thereafter, sunrise charging will typically resume!…Point here is, depending on a few other multi-dimensioned variables, immediate energy parity is not always necessary, and can often be achieved both simply and passively - where the budget permits…Again, in this scenario it becomes obvious that LFP’s have the clear advantage - Just Saying 🙂

3 tons

[theoldwizard1]

fj12ryder wrote:

theoldwizard1 wrote:
The Micro-Air EasyStart works differently than most "hard start" add-on, which is why it actually works !

Just curious what the difference is between the Micro-Air EasyStart and the SoftStart by SoftStartRV.

I am NOT intimately familiar with EITHER design, but the most common "hard start" add-on are basically just a large(er) start capacitor.

The short (lots of hand waving) electrical engineering explanation is as follows. Electric motors make their most torque (mechanical power) are zero RPM, so it makes sense that this is where they draw the most current (electrical power). A start capacitor gives them an extra "shot" to get them started (they likely would not start at all without the start capacitor)

The problem is, a fully discharged capacitor "looks like" a dead short until it charges up (less than a second). That split second is enough to trip the breaker. The solution is to limit how fast the capacitor charges up (limit the amount of current it can draw). Once the capacitor is "full" it discharges starting the motor. This all happens within 1-2 seconds so you don't even notice it.

DIY soft starter

[1L243]

1L243 wrote:

1L243 wrote:

2oldman wrote:
My experience has been that a single 2000 will run it, but it's really working hard and LOUD. And if your converter kicks on it'll die. Best to get another and parallel them. Yes, you can parallel a 2200 with a 2000.

Your right I would not have anything on over a few hundred watts when running the AC. I can get by with a TV and some lights.

I have a automatic transfer switch so my Converter will only be on when connected to shore power when I switch over to Inverter power the Converter is disconnected.

When I installed my Progressive Dynamics four stage converter to the Automatic Transfer Switch the wiring called for removing the Converter from the panel and wiring into the Automatic Transfer Switch (ATS) directly. This removed the 15amp circuit breaker so I had to add a switch to my control panel so I could still turn off the Converter when needed. For example if I was to be on generator I would turn off the Converter. My batteries would still be getting charged from the Solar Charge Controller.

[1L243]

1L243 wrote:

2oldman wrote:
My experience has been that a single 2000 will run it, but it's really working hard and LOUD. And if your converter kicks on it'll die. Best to get another and parallel them. Yes, you can parallel a 2200 with a 2000.

Your right I would not have anything on over a few hundred watts when running the AC. I can get by with a TV and some lights.

I have a automatic transfer switch so my Converter will only be on when connected to shore power when I switch over to Inverter power the Converter is disconnected.

When I installed my Progressive Dynamics four stage converter to the Automatic Transfer Switch the wiring called for removing the Converter from the panel and wiring into the Automatic Transfer Switch (ATS) directly. This removed the 15amp circuit breaker. I had to install a 15amp fuse inside the ATS for the Converter. I added a switch to my control panel so I could still turn off the Converter when needed. For example if I was to be on generator I would turn off the Converter. My batteries would still be getting charged from the Solar Charge Controller.

[Lwiddis]

Your report is good reading. TY for posting.

[1L243]

3 tons wrote:
From my own perspective (of one who occasionally runs their air conditioner from the inverter), a few observations, but for background, my equipment:

400a/h LFP (formerly, 2 GC wet-cell), 2k watt PSW pass-thru Inverter, 660w solar, Coleman 11kbtu air conditioner w/soft-start, Honda 2200 (formerly, Honda 2000) - system incrementally ($$) upgraded over the years…

***************

Several Observations:

First off (retrospectively…), compared to wet-cells, voltage sag with LFP’s is uber brief and relatively insignificant in such that (in my view…) this sole characteristic ‘may’ even negate the need for a soft-start - However, this is not an ‘anti-soft-start’ argument, of which I believe is superior to a conventional start cap…FWIW these clever proprietary ‘black boxes’ have even replaced capacitors on modern 120v single-phase, home HVAC blower motors, which ‘electronically synthesize’ a far more efficient three phase current during motor start-ups accompanied with variable start-up frequency, negating the need for the old school capacitors previously used to help keep start-up current and voltage in phase…

So I’m somewhat impressed to know that your 2000w inverter (pass-thru or PSW type - I donno??) will run a 13.5kbtu air conditioner (i.e. via characteristically voltage sluggish wet-cells…) interesting - Kudos to the Easy-start!…

So for raw estimation purposes only:

Considering all loads, your fully charged 340a/h capacity wet-cells have an effective useable capacity of only about half that (170a/h), although supplemented with 500w of solar…

However, when using wet-cells, a lower limit of say 60% SOC (State of Charge) seems more practical due to the effects of voltage sag on the compressor motor (ugg!) and what’s now become a struggling inverter…Rising ambient temps will also play a roll increasing motor amperage as well…

A rough thumbnail sketch:

So assuming an air conditioner duty cycle of say 2/3rds, concurrent with say 2/3rds productive solar harvest, and a 40% battery DOD (Depth of Discharge) equaling say 136 usable battery a/hrs:

120a/hr (dc) air cond @ 2/3rds duty cycle = approx 80a/hrs (dc)

18a (dc) concurrent hourly harvest = 62a/hrs hourly run deficit = about 2hrs runtime (compressor cycling) to 124a/hrs consumed, with 12a/hrs in reserve before 60% SOC - 46a/hrs in reserve before 50% SOC…).

Here again, due to their much deeper depth of discharge and nearly stable voltage, LFP’s have a clear advantage via longer run times…

*************

Some Notes:

Initial camper cooldown period (depending on volume) may require a full duty cycle.

This example does not consider ‘other hour’ solar harvest.

Onboard Converter-charger (etc) disabled.

JMO Only,

3 tons

Thanks that is very useful information.

[1L243]

2oldman wrote:
My experience has been that a single 2000 will run it, but it's really working hard and LOUD. And if your converter kicks on it'll die. Best to get another and parallel them. Yes, you can parallel a 2200 with a 2000.

Your right I would not have anything on over a few hundred watts when running the AC. I can get by with a TV and some lights.

I have a automatic transfer switch so my Converter will only be on when connected to shore power when I switch over to Inverter power the Converter is disconnected.

Before I added the automatic transfer switch I use to shut off the breaker to the converter before turning on the Inverter.

[1L243]

Skibane wrote:
From Micro Air's website: "Generators with 80CC and smaller engines are not recommended with 13.5K BTU and larger compressors. All other loads must be off when operating this close to a generator’s limit."

I mention this because a lot of inverter generators in the 2KW size range use 80CC engines - Champion, Yamaha, Wen, Harbor Freight, etc.

The Honda EU2000i models use a 100CC engine.

The EU2200i models use a 120CC engine - a full 1/3rd larger than 80CC models.

I purchased my Easy Start from Hutch Mountain they had a great youtube video that was the exact same AC as mine and it was easy to follow the step by step instructions. Plus they were eager to respond to my inquiries and assure me my 2000 watt Honda woudl work fine.

[fj12ryder]

Latner wrote:

fj12ryder wrote:

theoldwizard1 wrote:
The Micro-Air EasyStart works differently than most "hard start" add-on, which is why it actually works !

Just curious what the difference is between the Micro-Air EasyStart and the SoftStart by SoftStartRV. Not interested in brand bashing by any means, but interested. It would seem they both do the same thing.

From my understanding, Micro-Air is the OG of soft starts, someone from the company went on their own and started SoftStart. There is a quality difference between the two, spend a little more on the original.

Thanks.

[1L243]

bob_nestor wrote:
From other postings I've seen where people have tested running their A/C off batteries and they are reporting that you can get about 1 hr of run time for each 200aH of battery.

I wonder how long it will be before RV manufacturers start offering an option of placing Lithium-Ion (or sodium) batteries in the generator bay, installing an inverter at least 2800W, wiring all the 110v outlets and appliances in the RV thru the inverter, and putting Soft Starts in the A/C. And with Lithium or sodium batteries, installing the second high-output alternator in the chassis in addition to as much solar as then can fit on the roof.

While recently researching for my next RV I found one that I liked which I thought could be built this way quite easily to match my camping style. (I'm not looking to run the A/C on batteries other then when I'm traveling, hence the second alternator. Plus future battery technology may improve well beyond where it is now.) I figured I could replace the generator with about 1200aH of Lithium batteries (pricey, but doable). When I contacted the manufacturer with my requested changes, they flatly refused - said the generator couldn't be eliminated and they'd never wire the A/C and microwave thru the inverter. Reluctantly crossed them off my list and moved to other manufacturers.

I see manufactures started to put small Solar systems with standard being 150 watts but but you can up grade to 300 watts. I also heard that EPA is going to make small gas generator illegal. still p300 watt solar is still pretty lite when it comes to solar and power demand.

When I did my system I determined I could get by with a 500 watt solar because I boondocks almost always in the summer. Since my battery banks of 340ah is lead acid only half of that is usable.

In the summer with my flagrant use of energy running a big screen TV, Satellite I am usually back up to 100% by 1pm. BUT throw in a cloudy day or one day of rain or low sun angle and I will be sucking off the generator. I do run my frige on propane when boodocking.

If you want to be able to boondock all year round and run at least one AC you will need that large battery bank 1200ah in lithium would cost you a bundle. Throw in 1500 watts of solar on the roof and some nice Victron electronics and you into a 25k+ solar system not counting labor. Now if I had a little piece of land somewhere where I could park when not traveling maybe the price would be worth it.

[3_tons]

From my own perspective (of one who occasionally runs their air conditioner from the inverter), a few observations, but for background, my equipment:

400a/h LFP (formerly, 2 GC wet-cell), 2k watt PSW pass-thru Inverter, 660w solar, Coleman 11kbtu air conditioner w/soft-start, Honda 2200 (formerly, Honda 2000) - system incrementally ($$) upgraded over the years…

***************

Several Observations:

First off (retrospectively…), compared to wet-cells, voltage sag with LFP’s is uber brief and relatively insignificant in such that (in my view…) this sole characteristic ‘may’ even negate the need for a soft-start - However, this is not an ‘anti-soft-start’ argument, of which I believe is superior to a conventional start cap…FWIW these clever proprietary ‘black boxes’ have even replaced capacitors on modern 120v single-phase, home HVAC blower motors, which ‘electronically synthesize’ a far more efficient three phase current during motor start-ups accompanied with variable start-up frequency, negating the need for the old school capacitors previously used to help keep start-up current and voltage in phase…

So I’m somewhat impressed to know that your 2000w inverter (pass-thru or PSW type - I donno??) will run a 13.5kbtu air conditioner (i.e. via characteristically voltage sluggish wet-cells…) interesting - Kudos to the Easy-start!…

So for raw estimation purposes only:

Considering all loads, your fully charged 340a/h capacity wet-cells have an effective useable capacity of only about half that (170a/h), although supplemented with 500w of solar…

However, when using wet-cells, a lower limit of say 60% SOC (State of Charge) seems more practical due to the effects of voltage sag on the compressor motor (ugg!) and what’s now become a struggling inverter…Rising ambient temps will also play a roll increasing motor amperage as well…

A rough thumbnail sketch:

So assuming an air conditioner duty cycle of say 2/3rds, concurrent with say 2/3rds productive solar harvest, and a 40% battery DOD (Depth of Discharge) equaling say 136 usable battery a/hrs:

120a (dc) air cond @ 2/3rds duty cycle = approx 80a/hrs (dc)

18a (dc) concurrent hourly harvest = 62a/hrs hourly run deficit = about 2hrs runtime (compressor cycling) to 124a/hrs consumed, with 12a/hrs in reserve before 60% SOC - 46a/hrs in reserve before 50% SOC…).

Here again, due to their much deeper depth of discharge and nearly stable voltage, LFP’s have a clear advantage via longer run times…

*************

Some Notes:

Initial camper cooldown period (depending on volume) may require a full duty cycle.

This example does not consider ‘other hour’ solar harvest.

Onboard Converter-charger (etc) disabled.

JMO Only,

3 tons

[Latner]

fj12ryder wrote:

theoldwizard1 wrote:
The Micro-Air EasyStart works differently than most "hard start" add-on, which is why it actually works !

Just curious what the difference is between the Micro-Air EasyStart and the SoftStart by SoftStartRV. Not interested in brand bashing by any means, but interested. It would seem they both do the same thing.

From my understanding, Micro-Air is the OG of soft starts, someone from the company went on their own and started SoftStart. There is a quality difference between the two, spend a little more on the original.

[fj12ryder]

theoldwizard1 wrote:
The Micro-Air EasyStart works differently than most "hard start" add-on, which is why it actually works !

Just curious what the difference is between the Micro-Air EasyStart and the SoftStart by SoftStartRV. Not interested in brand bashing by any means, but interested. It would seem they both do the same thing.

[theoldwizard1]

The Micro-Air EasyStart works differently than most "hard start" add-on, which is why it actually works !

[Microlite_Mike]

Skibane wrote:
From Micro Air's website: "Generators with 80CC and smaller engines are not recommended with 13.5K BTU and larger compressors. All other loads must be off when operating this close to a generator’s limit."

I mention this because a lot of inverter generators in the 2KW size range use 80CC engines - Champion, Yamaha, Wen, Harbor Freight, etc.

The Honda EU2000i models use a 100CC engine.

The EU2200i models use a 120CC engine - a full 1/3rd larger than 80CC models.

I have the Easy Start installed on my 13,500 btu A/C and power it with a Champion 2500 w Inverter generator. Does fine and will even start A/C when on 'Eco". Don't know what size engine in my 2500W Champion Inverter but I do know it's enough to run my A/C. Perhaps not for a 15,000 btu model though.

One thing worthy of note is that the A/C with Easy Start installed my A/C starts without the loud "jolt" even on shore power. Doesn't wake everyone in the TT when A/C cycles on in the middle of the night.