Solar or Generator??

Ramblin Recks wrote:
I do not know my actual energy needs right now, but the DW and I are conservative when it comes to water and power.

Get the Trimetric first, then use it to figure out your actual energy usage. Base all further decisions on that, including how many batteries you really need.

I have solar and do not bring a generator with me. Never need one. But my needs might be different than yours.

Need air conditioning? You will need a generator and the Yamaha 2400 will be marginal.
Also with generator you may need to upgrade the converter for $150-$225.

Otherwise I recommend 200w to 500w of solar. 250w and two batteries might just be fine. You will need an inverter to power 120v items. For microwave you need four batteries and 1800+ watts of sine wave inverter.

Full timer may need at least a small generator to get through all conditions. 2x or 4x GC2 alone should generally get you through a long weekend in mild weather. Solar just makes it a bit easier.

Simplygib wrote:
Get the Trimetric first, then use it to figure out your actual energy usage.

X2

My wife and I use 24Ah per day while in conserve mode. That's pretty much using our LED lights and quicky showers. Our 2 T-105's will keep things going for up to 5 days without any need for charging. Most of our camping is up in the mountains and/or in the shade so we don't need air conditioning and solar efficiency would be low.

Ramblin Recks wrote:
solar, I’m thinking this system is “set-it and forget-it”, once it is installed making it easy to keep the batteries charged… but only to charge batteries. I think I would need to buy 4 T-145s (or 105) for solar. Solar or Generator??

Most solar is set and forget, except for the occasional panel cleaning, connection inspection, and tilting the panels should you desire.

Battery charging IS solar's only job. When people ask me "What can you run with your solar?" I've pretty much resigned myself to giving a nonsense answer like, "Oh, it'll run the lights ok but not the microwave." Anything more than that just confuses them. You will need at least 4 batteries and a large inverter for heavy-draw items like the MW.

From my 10 years of experience (and power needs) I wouldn't be without a generator or two. Cloudy days are unavoidable, so, you either need generator backup, or cut your power use accordingly... sometimes drastically.

if you can only do one, get the generator

we full time, we have 505w of solar and a good size battery bank

Solar alone is Not enough for us

my recommendation get a less expensive generator like the champion 2000 inverter generator $599 or something else and spend rest on solar, you can add more panels later, IF needed

honda's and yammys are great, but the price could be more competitive

Being new to the solar world I would think a generator would a necessity as it always works whether the sun is out or raining...

I have been camping off the power grid for more than 5 years and we decided what we want to run using an Inverter and direct connected to the battery and have enough batteries to handle this. We planned our usage so that our battery bank would not drop below 12.0VDC the next morning around 8AM. Then we connect our shore power cable to the 2KW Honda generator and re-charge our battery using the on-board smart mode converter/charger unit. This is done with only three hours of generator run time which usually fits into the camp grounds that have generator run time restrictions in place.

With our usage of appliances we want to have on when camping off the power grid I am certain we will have to have to run our generator for at least a couple of hours each morning to get the battery bank beyond the boost mode high current charging. Then we use the SOLAR POWER to finish the 90% charge of the battery up to 4:30 each day to get us to the 90% charge state or greater.

Keep in mind just a couple of 120WATT SOLAR PANELS will only produce around 10AMPS of usable current to recharge your batteries with. It will take high sun for many hours during the day to accomplish this. In our case I have three GP24 Interstate batteries and when I start re-charging with my PD9260C converter/charger the batteries demand around 52-53 amps of 14.4VDC Boost voltage and this will re-charge my batteries in a quick three hour time frame.

We would be considered high usage with all the things we want to have ON.

The solar panels will get your batteries back up to 90% and better during a one day high SUN run but it may take 6-8 hours of high SUN to do it... You may or may not have that much high sun where you are camping. Then what are you going to do if you don't get your batteries back up to their 90% charge state. It becomes candles and flashlights after that and NO HDTV using the BATWING antenna....

This is why we became as successful as we can using the generator then when we add solar panels then it will enhance the use of the generator big time. I still will have my generator with me when camping off the power however...

just me...

Gots to always have working PLAN Bs

Roy Ken

2oldman wrote:
Battery charging IS solar's only job. When people ask me "What can you run with your solar?" I've pretty much resigned myself to giving a nonsense answer like, "Oh, it'll run the lights ok but not the microwave."

Maybe it's just perspective, but I haven't run a generator in the two years since I installed solar. So solar "runs" everything. It's a great multitasker. It powers things directly when the sun is out and keeps the "tank" full for use when it's not. The batteries are just there to ensure an uninterrupted supply and to provide a greater flow than is possible from the solar directly. I like to think of it like a stream running into a reservoir behind a dam and power plant. For me, solar powers lights, TV, toaster, coffee pot, vacuum, MW and more, but not AC.

RoyB wrote:
With our usage of appliances we want to have on when camping off the power grid I am certain we will have to have to run our generator for at least a couple of hours each morning to get the battery bank beyond the boost mode high current charging. Then we use the SOLAR POWER to finish the 90% charge of the battery up to 4:30 each day to get us to the 90% charge state or greater.

Roy Ken, you're in for a surprise when you get your panels up and running and after a little experimenting realize you need to run your generator very little or not at all.:) Are you going with 2 or 3 120-watt panels?

To the OP, from the description of your needs I would agree with smk.

It used to be that solar was as expensive as a gen so it was hard to afford both. You have to have a gen even if you get solar because the gen always works sunshine or not. So that meant no solar if you had to pick one or the other on a budget.

Now solar is much less expensive while gens still cost a bunch, so it is no longer one or the other. After you get the gen, you can get some useful solar for under $200 these days. eg a 150w panel for $160 (if you can pick it up yourself, no shipping) and a 20a controller for $30

12thgenusa wrote:

To the OP, from the description of your needs I would agree with smk.

SMK is right. And polite. When somebody starts with "...I don't know my energy needs, but..." my first intuitive reaction would be to say "so why don't you find it out first" :)...

Would also like to highlight the alternative that the OP might not have noticed at the end of SMK post - for a short trip you don't need solar or generator if you have enough batteries. Try not to run your 120V kitchen luxuries as if you were at home. Microwave, toaster, coffee maker etc draw most of your daily energy. If you can limit their use for 3 days, you can live off 250W solar almost indefinitely, and if you can avoid their use altogether, you won't need to install powerful inverter. TV and small electronics draw very little.

24 AH example in "conservation mode" is realistic. LED lights, water pumps, small electronics like laptop and DC circuits of propane fridge won't draw more than 20AH overnight (and in daytime your use is less). This is what flat mounted 100-160W panel collects on a good day.

On a dark day 160W panel would collect less than 15 AH, so this is when you need more batts to ride out the bad weather and then charge them again from solar, or go home next day, or just keep on camping - with 24 AH daily draw you can camp off 400-500 AH bank for 3 days without ANY source of energy.

Edit:
1) in case if solutions like "solar only" or "batteries only" sounded too simple - yes, it will work as described, but not for air conditioner. This is the only thing that you can't run without a generator.

2) For rough estimate of your energy needs you don't really need to buy an expensive Trimetric. I didn't buy it before planning my solar, and I doubt I will need it now. There is a Flowchart that Don Pianotuna links every time he reads posts like this (because search on the forum doesn't work and people are asking same things again and again).