Tesla Battery Gossip cut n paste

[MEXICOWANDERER]

As Florida residents fled Hurricane Irma over the weekend, some Tesla owners got a little surprise from the auto maker to help them get out of the danger zone.

On Saturday, Tesla began pushing a software update that increased the battery capacity of some Model S sedans and Model X SUVs. All the cars that received the update belonged to those living in what emergency officials had identified as the evacuation area.

The real-time update extended the range of the cars by unlocking previously inaccessible battery power, meaning the vehicles could now go farther on a single charge. The change will not be permanent; Tesla said the temporary upgrade will be reversed on Sept. 16, presumably once the immediate danger has passed.

The decision reflects a key distinguishing feature of Tesla's business, one that could divide consumers as they think about the future of car ownership.

The Model S and Model X vehicles updated on Saturday were all built with a 75 kilowatt-hour battery. At full capacity, that's enough for a Model S to travel roughly 250 miles.

When those cars were first sold, Tesla gave customers the option of a lower-capacity battery at a more affordable price, and some decided to take the savings rather than purchase the full, 75-kWh battery.

But downsizing didn't mean replacing the big battery with a physically smaller one; it just meant using a bit of computer code to restrict how much of the battery the car could access. If they wanted, they could later have Tesla lift the software lock by paying an additional fee, which can run into the thousands of dollars.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

The issue with being unique is that they can issue a "Denial of Service" under the auspices of SAFETY. Not warranty. Service. Any and all service. Myself, I would not want to test the envelope. Tesla might be a very cranky company when it comes to hacking and accessing safety protocols.

[John___Angela]

Kayteg1 wrote:

John & Angela wrote:
.

You would think, but I think there would be the worry of warranty loss etc.

That never stop truck owners from chipping, redesigning MAPs, deleting CATs, EGRs and tons of other modifications.

Good point. I'm not sure how much they are able to remote monitor though.

[Kayteg1]

John & Angela wrote:
.

You would think, but I think there would be the worry of warranty loss etc.

That never stop truck owners from chipping, redesigning MAPs, deleting CATs, EGRs and tons of other modifications.

[John___Angela]

Kayteg1 wrote:
Personally I don't buy the theory that the batteries come with real higher capacity that software holds for extra pay.
This World has hackers who hack everything just for fun, so sooner or later one would get on the software.

Gppd morning.

You would think, but I think there would be the worry of warranty loss etc.

For what its worth, people doing the upgrade is reasonably common and yes they get greater range as advertised. Not sure if I misunderstood and that you were doubting if this actually happens. The tesla club forum is a pretty good source for this kind of thing. Nice bunch of folks and helpful with questions like this wether you are an owner or not.

[Kayteg1]

Personally I don't buy the theory that the batteries come with real higher capacity that software holds for extra pay.
This World has hackers who hack everything just for fun, so sooner or later one would get on the software.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

The challenge therefore is to find facts, direct from Tesla about two limits permitted from an identical battery. Not the emergency allowance - that is totally useless to make a determination here.

The same size battery pack. Pay an optional fee. Does paying the optional fee permit a deeper discharge of the otherwise identical battery pack? Is the battery pack divided, some cells held in stasis for for recovery and sale later by Tesla in "Replacement" battery packs? If the entire battery is involved, data about Tesla's DOD cycle life data? If the pack is divided, relevant data about stasis lifespan of the unused cells.

Some people could care less. That's perfectly OK as long as they do not try to suggest or imply answers to these questions unless they can back it up with facts. I do not have a clue about this - but I am willing to learn. The. Truth.

[wa8yxm]

I am sure they can provide very specific numbers if you are to ask them.

I have been following battery technology for some time so my info comes mostly from OTHER sites.. which in this case I actually trust more than Tesla.

And from some things I did .. many years ago (Physics class).

[Bumpyroad]

wa8yxm wrote:

MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
Bumpy has the right question. Why oh why would they leave a portion of the battery bank totally unused? And to suggest a shallower cycle has no effect on cycle life would border on the absurd. Or is lithium technology apart from the laws of this universe?

Even with LIthium Technology if you discharge DEEPLY it damages the battery and shorten's the overall life.

This is why TESLA set a discharge limit.. They decided in the Flordia case that a little shortening of battery life beats a big shorterning of owner's life and I agree with them.

The difference between LI and Lead Acid in this regard is the defination of DEEP DISCHARGE (or rather too deep) LI's can go lower than LA's but still too far shorten's the battery life.

enough smoke and mirrors. can/did Tesla provide any numbers/data? or are we just buying the claim?
bumpy

[wa8yxm]

MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
Bumpy has the right question. Why oh why would they leave a portion of the battery bank totally unused? And to suggest a shallower cycle has no effect on cycle life would border on the absurd. Or is lithium technology apart from the laws of this universe?

Even with LIthium Technology if you discharge DEEPLY it damages the battery and shorten's the overall life.

This is why TESLA set a discharge limit.. They decided in the Flordia case that a little shortening of battery life beats a big shorterning of owner's life and I agree with them.

The difference between LI and Lead Acid in this regard is the defination of DEEP DISCHARGE (or rather too deep) LI's can go lower than LA's but still too far shorten's the battery life.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

I have a phobia about knocking on doors and gates down here...

The gate opens...

[pnichols]

MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
My car uses expired dinosaurs.

Range is around 500 Km

Around 15 minutes to "recharge"

Can see 99.9% discharges for say 200,000 miles

Motive re-power for around a thousand dollars

Pollutes less than one of " 's" mansions

But I really could use a golf car to get around Las Penas.

I will switch to an electric car
The day after
I buy a gasoline toaster

David ... nice list above, but you forgot one item: If you never want your car to run low on it's expired dinosaur supply out somewhere on a lonely road, you can replenish it's supply in minutes from a simple container carried in the trunk ... instead of sitting in the hot sun (if it's shining) for hours while the solar panels you rolled out on the ground slooowwwly fill up a battery so you can be on your way - if you're still alive. 😞 and :B

[MEXICOWANDERER]

My car uses expired dinosaurs.

Range is around 500 Km

Around 15 minutes to "recharge"

Can see 99.9% discharges for say 200,000 miles

Motive re-power for around a thousand dollars

Pollutes less than one of " 's" mansions

But I really could use a golf car to get around Las Penas.

I will switch to an electric car
The day after
I buy a gasoline toaster

[John___Angela]

I still think a lot has to do with marketing. I want an electric vehicle and I have this much money and I need it to go 300 KM max. I can afford a S60 so I buy one. If my economic situation improves later I can upgrade to a 75. Or if my vehicle needs change later and I need a longer range I don't need to buy a whole new car. Just fork over X thousand dollars and I have the range I need. This works for us. Our car has a max range of 200 KM. We really only need it to do about 120 to 150. If there had been a 400 KM range version available at the time we would have paid exactly zero dollars more for it because...you know... we never need more than 150 KM of range. Even if we occasionally go on longer trips of 400 or 500 KM the fast charging infrastructure is fairly good in our area and I can afford the extra hour of charge time to get there. This hasn't really happened that much for us but I suppose it could. Buy what you need or what you like. Choices are good. I suspect that has a lot to do with the thought process behind the marketing for TESLA. And it seems to work as they have no problem selling S's.

On a side note, I think one of the reasons Teslas do and will continue to be more expensive is the facility of the supercharge network. For those on really long commutes or even long trips this is obviously a huge advantage. For us it would be again, buying something we don't need so paying a premium for this service wouldn't make sense...or least on our budget. This also may change over time as provinces and states are seeing the non tesla fast charge infrastructure grow with both private and public money so although I think Tesla will probably have an advantage here for the next decade the advantage will diminish. Remember, a Telsa can charge on any system by using adapters. A non Tesla can not access any Tesla charging facilities. Not a thing for us but I'm sure there are non EV owners driving past superchargers every day with envy in their eyes. 🙂

[MEXICOWANDERER]

Bumpy has the right question. Why oh why would they leave a portion of the battery bank totally unused? And to suggest a shallower cycle has no effect on cycle life would border on the absurd. Or is lithium technology apart from the laws of this universe?