Trouble with Poop Chute

[SteveG36]

2007 Keystone Raptor. Old but well maintained.

Was camping in Flagstaff so my kids could play in the show and as luck would have it we encountered an epic 3-day snow storm. It was cold outside but not the coldest I have had the trailer in (hovered right around 30-32 degrees). My trailer is winterized - although I realize that does not mean much.

I had a hook up but I did not leave the black tank open because I did not have a heating wire for the sewage pipe and figured since we were there just a few days, I would dump at the end.

One of the boy stayed back to “Use the facilities” while the rest of us went out to play in the snow and when we returned to the trailer it WREAKED of sewage. I mean it was bad. We immediately blamed it on our son who just “used the facilities” and wrote it off, but it was BAD and the smell was lingering.

A few minutes later I began to pack up the trailer to leave and I noticed a big yellow/brown ice-cycle hanging from the trailer to the ground underneath where the black dump pipe comes out of the sheathing that covers the bottom and water was still leaking down it. UGH!!!

This weekend I brought the trailer home, opened it up underneath to find the problem. The issue, I cannot find anything. All of the pipes look good. I filled the black tank until the light came on saying it was full with fresh water and there is NO leak that I can find. I even overfilled it a bit to see if it would leak. I don't want to over do it, but still no leak.

It is entirely possible that the tank filled up while we were in Flagstaff and before I dumped it but if something burst or broke I should see a leak now with a full tank and there is nothing. Additionally, There is no overflow on a black tank that I am aware of so I have ruled that out.

I am completely perplexed. What could have happened? I am afraid to seal everything back up because SOMETHING clearly happened to created that poop/peecicle.

Looking forward to your thoughts and expertise.

[valhalla360]

dougrainer wrote:
Really? You are an expert on just a weekend? There is usually very little water flushed when toilet is dumped. The S**t goes straight down and hits the bottom of the tank. Now, you are the expert. HOW MANY people used this on the weekend? YOU DON'T KNOW. THE TANKS HAVE VERY LITTLE SLOPE. So, everytime you dump the toilet the debris plops down on top the previous and without adequate water(GONE because the valve is open) the debris just stacks up. Sorry, after 43 years as a Tech I make good money getting rid of the Pyramids. Doug

Yes, done it often when weather is really cold and on a sewer site...never had an issue but then it gets lots of use under normal conditions between the really cold weekends.

On sewer, you should be using lots of water anyway but if it's only an occasional weekend, any start of a pyramid will break down before then next time.

The Pyramids are mostly folks who just leave the valve open all the time...often at permanent sites...there I agree, you are setting yourself up.

[pianotuna]

SteveG36,

If the repair doesn't last try some eternabond. It can even be applied under water.

[SteveG36]

So I figured out my issue.

I opened the bottom so I could see the tank and I very carefully filled up the black tank until it was full full (using an endoscopic camera). What I found is that the seam of the tank at the top where there top is glued or heat welded to the bottom part of the tank is leaking ever so slightly. Thinking about what occurred, I believe that I let the tank get too full and it froze/expanded and separated the seam a bit. The leak is very small so I am going to try a repair with some West Marine G/flex epoxy. I did a bunch of research of all the products people have used and it seems this one has done really well for others. The other thing I can do is monitor the tank a little bit better and not let it get filled to the point where it would leak (although if it were full while driving I assume w/sloshing it may still leak if I did not repair it.)

If this does not work I will replace the tank next spring completely when I have more time. Right now I am drying out the tank so that I can repair it this coming weekend.

I appreciate everyone's feedback, it was very helpful and gave me some things to look at while I was still perplexed.

[dougrainer]

valhalla360 wrote:

dougrainer wrote:
1. If you stated your post correctly. YOU NEVER LEAVE THE DUMP VALVES OPEN WHEN CAMPING. ESPECIALLY THE BLACK TANK. COLD or Hot weather
2. If you doubt this, look up POOP PYRAMID.

In warm weather or long term, I agree with your assessment.

For a quick weekend in really cold weather, I'll disagree (30F is not really cold weather).

One weekend isn't going to create the pyramid and assuming you otherwise let the tank fill and sit a bit between dumps, anything that does start with get taken care of by sitting in the half full tank.

The trade off in really cold weather (assuming you don't have heated tanks) is that things freeze and bust.

As far as the OP's issue, it's possible that things got pressurized if the vent tube slipped down towards the bottom of the tank. When the airspace warmed up during the day, the pressure had no where to go except to push water up vent tube. It overflows and runs back down the outside of the tube before dripping down and forming icicles. The waste water could also find it's way into the walls where a lovely aroma can develop.

Really? You are an expert on just a weekend? There is usually very little water flushed when toilet is dumped. The S**t goes straight down and hits the bottom of the tank. Now, you are the expert. HOW MANY people used this on the weekend? YOU DON'T KNOW. THE TANKS HAVE VERY LITTLE SLOPE. So, everytime you dump the toilet the debris plops down on top the previous and without adequate water(GONE because the valve is open) the debris just stacks up. Sorry, after 43 years as a Tech I make good money getting rid of the Pyramids. Doug

[valhalla360]

dougrainer wrote:
1. If you stated your post correctly. YOU NEVER LEAVE THE DUMP VALVES OPEN WHEN CAMPING. ESPECIALLY THE BLACK TANK. COLD or Hot weather
2. If you doubt this, look up POOP PYRAMID.

In warm weather or long term, I agree with your assessment.

For a quick weekend in really cold weather, I'll disagree (30F is not really cold weather).

One weekend isn't going to create the pyramid and assuming you otherwise let the tank fill and sit a bit between dumps, anything that does start with get taken care of by sitting in the half full tank.

The trade off in really cold weather (assuming you don't have heated tanks) is that things freeze and bust.

As far as the OP's issue, it's possible that things got pressurized if the vent tube slipped down towards the bottom of the tank. When the airspace warmed up during the day, the pressure had no where to go except to push water up vent tube. It overflows and runs back down the outside of the tube before dripping down and forming icicles. The waste water could also find it's way into the walls where a lovely aroma can develop.

[ScottG]

Was the roof vent covered in snow?

[groundhogy]

Possibilities:
-Your gate valves need service.
-you need to tighten, add gaskets, to your exit hoses. I have sometimes doubled up gaskets.
-if people don’t flush enough, the urine smell can rise up due to repeated coatings

[dougrainer]

1. If you stated your post correctly. YOU NEVER LEAVE THE DUMP VALVES OPEN WHEN CAMPING. ESPECIALLY THE BLACK TANK. COLD or Hot weather
2. If you doubt this, look up POOP PYRAMID.
3. Tanks, the down pipes are supposed to be sealed on top the tanks. As another posted, fill up the Black tank full and then slowly fill the rest of the tank THRU the toilet, until water comes up into the bowl. Once you do this, if the vent pipe or the toilet pipe and gasket are NOT sealed you will see water drip on the ground. No leakage, your system is OK.
4. IF you camp with the Black Valve OPEN, you will have a poop pyramid. THESE SMELL HORRIBLE.
5. Your relative did nothing to cause this problem.
6. If you have a Black Tank flush, this may be a leak area, but the fill test will confirm this. Doug

PS, tanks have NO overflow system

[opnspaces]

How full was the tank when you found the icicle? If the tank was only half full it takes things like the vent pipe out of the equation.

You're going to have to fill the tank fuller to test this. I would fill the tank to the top of the tank by looking down into the toilet while filling. Use low pressure from a hose so you don't get any splash back in the RV or in your face.
Let it sit for an hour.

If no leaks the problem is either the vent pipe seal or the toiled to tank gasket. Personally if I couldn't find a leak with the first test I would just pull the toilet and replace the gasket. It's a whole two nuts and unscrew the water line and the toilet is out. Remove the old foam gasket and put a new RV toilet gasket in place and reinstall the toilet.

If you really want to explore further after replacing the gasket then fill the tank until the water is up into the toilet bowl and see if you get any leaks.

Could the leak have been from an overflowed gray tank?

Also I would crawl under the trailer and look up around where the icicle was. Are you sure the icicle was waste and not stained water leaking down the walls from a roof leak?

[Grit_dog]

wa8yxm wrote:
It is absolute the tank filled with that much use on a trailer.

And there is a leak. may be where the pipes enter the tank may be the seal between toilet and pipe.

Lol, I love your certainty but question your process of deduction….

[RAS43]

It is possible that there is a leak at the connection between the tank and the vent pipe that goes up to the roof. Fill the tank full to check by filling with a hose thru the toilet so you can see when it is full. Be sure to have a shut off on the hose.

[wa8yxm]

It is absolute the tank filled with that much use on a trailer.

And there is a leak. may be where the pipes enter the tank may be the seal between toilet and pipe.