Adding air bags: can that increase payload capacity?

[DesertDogs]

Does adding airbags to a pickup truck tow vehicle increase the payload capacity of the truck?

For example, take a pickup with 3500 lbs. of payload capacity. If one were to add air bags to such a pickup, could that realistically increase the payload capacity from 3500 lbs. to 4000 lbs.?

Also, does adding airbags improve ride quality in the truck?

We're thinking of going with a 2019 3/4 ton RAM or 1 ton RAM as our every day driver and also as a tow vehicle for a fairly short 5th wheel.

I'm trying to decide which would be the best route to follow when buying a truck that will serve mostly as a daily driver, with occasional use to tow a 5th wheel.

3/4 ton with air bags added?
1 ton without air bags?
1 ton with air bags added?

Or....???

[Cummins12V98]

"No. Air bags and other mods add to the stability but do nothing for load capacity."

Sounds like a fair statement on paper. BUT please explain how my Factory Rear Air Ride can support a SAE rated 9,750# with two thin full length springs per side???


Me thinks YES air bags can increase a standard sprung trucks capacity on PAPER.

[Cummins12V98]

RAM 3500 LONGBED with Factory Rear Air Ride and AISIN. Oh yea don't forget the pucks and B&W hitch. "GOLDEN"

I have the above but with hips, rides GREAT empty or with 6,000# pushing down on it!!!

[Me_Again]

JIMNLIN wrote:

Short bed trucks will have a bit more payload than a long bed when both have the same cab/engine/tranny/etc configurations.

The 2019 RAM towing chart I linked above does not support that statement.

[JIMNLIN]

DesertDogs wrote:
Do the long bed versions of 1 ton pickups typically have higher payload capacity than the short bed trucks do?

I've seen some 2019 RAM 3500 short bed trucks with around 4,100 lbs payload capacity - wondering it the long beds might add a bit more?

Short bed trucks will have a bit more payload than a long bed when both have the same cab/engine/tranny/etc configurations.

There is no 350/3500 SRW that has enough RAWR to carry 4100 lbs in the bed. That 4100 lbs is a gvwr based payload and will overload the truck 7000 lb- 7230 lb RAWR when its all placed in the bed. RAWR is the lessor of a wheel...tire... or rear spring pack rating.

A one ton SRW (any brand) empty rear axle may weigh in the 3300-3500 lb range. Using the Rams 7000 RAWR = around 3500 lbs in the bed payload.
If your looking to carry 4000 lbs in the bed in any one ton SRW your gonna' need to mod the trucks rear suspension and upgrade to 19.5 " tires and wheels as truck camper owners have.

[Me_Again]

DesertDogs wrote:
Do the long bed versions of 1 ton pickups typically have higher payload capacity than the short bed trucks do?

I've seen some 2019 RAM 3500 short bed trucks with around 4,100 lbs payload capacity - wondering it the long beds might add a bit more?

https://www.tfltruck.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/2019-ram-hd-towing-chart.pdf

For 2019 SB CC 4x4 GVWR is 11,800 and LB is 12,300. You want to get the optional Aisin transmission. It takes away a bit of CC.

For a LB you could go with the Andersen aluminum hitch and save a hundred pounds.

Again the real question is the 2600 dry pin weight that they say is an average. What is the actual starting point of the one you are buying. Washer, dryer, and/or generator?????

[MFL]

As to payload, the trucks that are weighed down with options, will have the least. Towing a FW is more about the RAWR/tire rating, due to most of the carried weight being on the rear axle/rear tires.

Jerry

[DesertDogs]

Do the long bed versions of 1 ton pickups typically have higher payload capacity than the short bed trucks do?

I've seen some 2019 RAM 3500 short bed trucks with around 4,100 lbs payload capacity - wondering it the long beds might add a bit more?

[valhalla360]

rhagfo wrote:

36' 5er is not really short, and the one the OP is looking at has a GVWR of 16,000#, the only thing that will help you stick with a 3500 SRW is that this 5er has a payload of 3,600#.

320 GK Specs
GVWR : 16,000
Dry Weight : 12,400*
Cargo Carrying : 3,600
Hitch Weight : 2,600 (21% of dry)

Starting from dry weight if you only add 2,000# of stuff now the 5er's GVW is 14,400# X 21% = 3,024, I would expect the pin percentage to be more like 23% to 25% so up to 3,600# just for the 5er on the TV.
Best be looking at the 3500, and might even consider a DRW.

I missed the signature...yeah, that's neither short nor light weight.

He's in 1 ton range with that trailer. If he's buying new, no point in trying to buy a 3/4 ton and then upgrading it.

The real question is if he should be looking at dually...3600lb just for the pin weight but then add in a couple hundred for the hitch, plus wife and anything else in the truck...he could easily be loading more than 4000lb as the truck payload.

[DesertDogs]

Me Again wrote:

DesertDogs wrote:

Spot-on, thank you.

I will need a minimum of 4,000 lbs. payload from the truck, to cover the pin weight of the 5th wheel and the passengers (2 people, 2 dogs) in the truck. Definitely need a one-ton SRW with 4000 lbs. payload, at minimum. And avoid carrying much fresh/grey water while traveling.

5th wheel will only be used for an occasional trip, not FT, so no need for it to be heavily loaded.

Since the vast majority of use of the truck will be as our daily driver, we do not wish to have a DRW truck.

A 5th wheel will not put enough weigh on the front axle to allow 4K of carrying capacity and very few SRW 350/3500 actually have that much CC. It is the RGAWR you need to worry about. Do you plan on a washer/dryer and a generator? If so you will need a duallie. If these items are not on your list and the trailer really has close to the 2600 dry pin weight, then with careful loading you will get by with a 350/3500.

My 16K Bighorn has a 2435 lb dry pin weight, no W/D and no generator. A Demco picture frame and a B&W manual slider. Here are my loaded weights.
Front-----5120
Drivers---6620
Sub Truck-11740
Trailer---12780
GCW-------24520

Trucks RGAWR is 7K, dry camping and moving fresh water to the 2 grey and black tank would put more weight on the rear axle of the truck.

I started with less dry pin weight and talked to Heartland to verify that their dry pin weight was accurate.

You did not I believe state if you want a SB or LB truck. That is in play also, as slider hitches are heavier.

I my case I had the truck first and wanted to more up from our 29" 5th wheel to something in the 34-36' length. I found that there were a lot of trailers that I would not be able to tow.

I would really want to know the actual dry pin weight of the trailer you are considering before buying it.

Oh yes, the weight of the hitch, as well. What would a good, non-sliding hitch weigh? (Assuming a long bed truck.)

I have seen some 2019 RAM 1 ton SRW trucks that have 4100 lbs of payload capacity. But you're right, not a lot of them have that much.

[Me_Again]

DesertDogs wrote:

Spot-on, thank you.

I will need a minimum of 4,000 lbs. payload from the truck, to cover the pin weight of the 5th wheel and the passengers (2 people, 2 dogs) in the truck. Definitely need a one-ton SRW with 4000 lbs. payload, at minimum. And avoid carrying much fresh/grey water while traveling.

5th wheel will only be used for an occasional trip, not FT, so no need for it to be heavily loaded.

Since the vast majority of use of the truck will be as our daily driver, we do not wish to have a DRW truck.

A 5th wheel will not put enough weigh on the front axle to allow 4K of carrying capacity and very few SRW 350/3500 actually have that much CC. It is the RGAWR you need to worry about. Do you plan on a washer/dryer and a generator? If so you will need a duallie. If these items are not on your list and the trailer really has close to the 2600 dry pin weight, then with careful loading you will get by with a 350/3500.

My 16K Bighorn has a 2435 lb dry pin weight, no W/D and no generator. A Demco picture frame and a B&W manual slider. Here are my loaded weights.
Front-----5120
Drivers---6620
Sub Truck-11740
Trailer---12780
GCW-------24520

Trucks RGAWR is 7K, dry camping and moving fresh water to the 2 grey and black tank would put more weight on the rear axle of the truck.

I started with less dry pin weight and talked to Heartland to verify that their dry pin weight was accurate.

You did not I believe state if you want a SB or LB truck. That is in play also, as slider hitches are heavier.

I my case I had the truck first and wanted to more up from our 29" 5th wheel to something in the 34-36' length. I found that there were a lot of trailers that I would not be able to tow.

I would really want to know the actual dry pin weight of the trailer you are considering before buying it.

[ktmrfs]

DesertDogs wrote:
OK... thank you. I've been hearing and reading conflicting views on this subject.

Sounds like I will need to go with a 1 ton. And perhaps add bags for extra stability?

don't necessarily need to go to a "1 ton" This year GM finally decided to buck the system and classify the 2500's in the same class (3?) as 1 tons, so the 2500HD Duramax SRW has a GVWR of 11,500ish, very close to the 3500 SRW instead of the old class limit of 10,000.

I suspect Ford and Dodge will follow suite in short order.

[DesertDogs]

rhagfo wrote:

MFL wrote:
While many 3/4 ton trucks can handle nearly the same load as a 1 ton SRW, by using after market devices to level the load, it is best to just get the 3500 to start with, if needed, when buying new. In your case, the FW you are considering, on your profile, you need the 3500.

Jerry

X2
36' 5er is not really short, and the one the OP is looking at has a GVWR of 16,000#, the only thing that will help you stick with a 3500 SRW is that this 5er has a payload of 3,600#.

320 GK Specs
GVWR : 16,000
Dry Weight : 12,400*
Cargo Carrying : 3,600
Hitch Weight : 2,600 (21% of dry)

Starting from dry weight if you only add 2,000# of stuff now the 5er's GVW is 14,400# X 21% = 3,024, I would expect the pin percentage to be more like 23% to 25% so up to 3,600# just for the 5er on the TV.
Best be looking at the 3500, and might even consider a DRW.

Spot-on, thank you.

I will need a minimum of 4,000 lbs. payload from the truck, to cover the pin weight of the 5th wheel and the passengers (2 people, 2 dogs) in the truck. Definitely need a one-ton SRW with 4000 lbs. payload, at minimum. And avoid carrying much fresh/grey water while traveling.

5th wheel will only be used for an occasional trip, not FT, so no need for it to be heavily loaded.

Since the vast majority of use of the truck will be as our daily driver, we do not wish to have a DRW truck.

[2112]

Grit dog wrote:

2112 wrote:

Grit dog wrote:

2112 wrote:
Actually, airbags subtract payload by the amount of the weight of the airbags and compressor. You are adding weight to the vehicle.

Set of bags weighs about as much as 2 gallons of milk and a case of beer. Compressor is like adding a seedless watermelon to the payload. Lol

Was I wrong in my reply? The OPs question was will it increase his payload. The answer is NO. It will decrease his payload by the weight of 2 gallons of milk, a case of beer and a seedless melon

But it's the overtly literal way in which you stated it, that inferred that the dead weight added by the bags may actually be of any real world concern.
Although, looking at your sig pic, maybe pulling that 5ver with a F150 you are concerned about every gallon of milk and case of beer adding more weight. Shoot, better start weighing the wife's purse and make sure if you've accounted for healthy bowel movements of all passengers before embarking on a trip!

And this is exactly why I left this forum. I'll go away again.

[noteven]

In the little pickup world what you want to do is load your rear axle to sticker max by taking weight off the steer axle so as not to exceed door sticker GVW.

[MFL]

Wow... reading this latest page, involving milk/beer/water melon, and now bowel movements, could cause one to puke, to even further wt loss.

Funny, haven't seen much for serious WP around for quite a while. I'm thinking some have a better understanding of the newer trucks, or maybe just moved on/passed on??

Jerry