Another Tire Question

[hohenwald48]

Wal-Mart is an attractive place to buy tires because of the ability to get warranty work anywhere in the US. My 225 75R/15 Westlake OEM tires are almost 3 years old, have between 20K and 30K miles on them and I put them under some strange loads when I had a leaf spring break. For those reason I'm looking at new tires soon.

Wal-Mart has Carlisle Trail USA's (made in the USA) in ST225 75/15 LRD (they don't make them in LRE) for $121 each and they have Carlisle Trail HD's (made in ???) in ST225 75/15 LRE for $64.50 each, almost half the Trail USA price.

My trailer is #7800 (including tongue weight of #900) so the LRD's are plenty capable enough. I just wanted even more spare capacity like I would get from the LRE's. However, they don't make the USA's in LRE.

Money is not the deciding factor but I don't see any reason to spend extra for no reason. I'm just wondering if anybody has experience with either of these tires and what you might think?

I don't want to start another LT vs ST thread, have no intention of getting 16" rims and can't find any ST tires (other than the Carlisle USA's) that are made in America. I also wonder if "Made in the USA" really matters.

Thoughts??

[sp8gold]

I went to Maxxis when I got tired of the Westlake problems. Happy so for.

[Tequila]

i went to carlisle after my stock goodyears had a blowout. so far pleased. I upgraded to class E fro D.

[arkieguide]

Years ago, I got in the habit of changing to LT tires when replacing other tires. it has worked well foe me so I will continue. Run tire pressure according to manuf. guide lines. Never seen any one over tired ? All tho i have seen some bad blowouts and even rims brake, crack down the middle.If I have any idea I will overload mt rig I go with Toyo tires.

[hohenwald48]

JIMNLIN wrote:

You sure don't need a load E tire at 2850 = 11450 lbs capacity on that size trailer. Trailers unlike our trucks can be over tired for best long term reliability.

I understood this post, plus your subsequent post quoting the article, to mean that you thought trailers could be over tired (ie: have too much tire) and I was asking what you thought were the problems associated with having too much tire.

Your last post seems to imply that me using LRE's inflated to 80 PSI is what you (and the article author) were advocating. Sorry, I guess I just misread your initial comments. Thanks.

[JIMNLIN]

Your question was "what are the downside problems related to an "over tired" trailer?"

Now you mention using 80 psi in a 15" ST E tire which is what he recommends if you read his tire blog.

[hohenwald48]

JIMNLIN,
Maybe I missed something but I don't see anything in the article that indicates I could expect a problem by running LRE's at 80 PSI? Thanks

[kcfissel]

Aren't they stamped as max 80PSI on the side wall? I wonder if additional pressure would stop some of the sway you experienced? I've read that higher pressure will minimize any sway from sidewall flex. I always run my tires at max sidewall PSI anyway. Thanks for the information. I think I'm getting ready to place an order for 4 of these Carlisle HD's in LR-E.

Yes, they are stamped 80 psi, but they are rock hard at 65psi due to the light weight of my trailer.
I think the sway is from the road surface when the trailer wants to follow the tracks of the 18 wheelers, and doesn't happen all the time. I ran 80psi for a few miles and didn't like the most harsh ride.

I think you will be very happy with the HDs, especially if your trailer is a bit heavier than mine.

[JIMNLIN]

Just curious, what are the downside problems related to an "over tired" trailer?

Tire experts and experienced trailer owners have found tires on a trailer work better long term when their ran at max sidewall pressures mostly to protect the tires carcass and tread belts from ply shearing as the tire side slips/ while backing or just pulling the trailer around a corner. At some point the tire has too much capacity to use max pressures.

Tireman9
one of our tire engineers also recommends max sidewall pressures says; from rvtiresafety.com his online tire blog;

"The manufacturers do not take into consideration the side to side unbalance, as to do so would require them to provide larger (more expensive) tires. The other thing RV industry does not take into consideration is the forces to the tire structure due to running close axle spacing. Engineering analysis shows that when turning corners the forces trying to tear the tire apart can be over 20% higher in multi-axle applications than with tires at the corners of the vehicle.
The only options for the trailer owner are to up-size the tires (if there is room) or up-rate and increase inflation (if a higher Load Range tire and stronger wheels are available). Lacking the above being sure to run the tire at the inflation shown on the sidewall (i.e. max) will slightly decrease but not eliminate the overload forces.
and
When not driving in a straight line there are special side loads on multi-axle trailers because the tires are fighting each other because they are not "pointed" to the center of the radius of the turn. These loads cause interior structural tearing. Sometimes 24% higher loads than those seen in tires on non-trailer application. Initially tearing is at the microscopic level but with time and repeated cycles these forces grow which can lead to small cracks at the belt edges as seen here at the arrows.
and
You can lower these forces by either decreasing the load 24% on the tire (probably not something you want to do or may not be able to do) or you can increase the inflation to stiffen the structure and decrease the slip-angle. In this case you could increase the tire inflation from the minimum inflation needed for the static load to the inflation associated with the max tire load as molded on the tire sidewall. "
and rvtiresafety.com

Spend some time on his website. He has some very good actual tire tech especially about tires used in a trailer position. Tireman9 isn't just another rv guy with a blog.

[coolbreeze01]

hohenwald48 wrote:

I'm leaning toward the Radial HD's in LRE or LRD. My rims can handle either. I would like something rated for more than 65MPH as it's often hard to stay below that threshold.

Just curious, what are the downside problems related to an "over tired" trailer?

I don't believe a trailer can be "over tired". I run load range E ST tires because I have more confidence in them than C or D. Of 7 various trailers I've owned, I haven't used a spare yet.

[hohenwald48]

JIMNLIN wrote:
Carlisle Trail USA's is a old tech bias ply tire and has one of the longest complaints record on NHTSA tire complaint website. Their better suited for a lawn service trailer that used around town at sub highway speeds.

Carlisle has a Radial Trail HD that is their newest and best tire for RV trailers that see lots of open road use at normal speeds.

You sure don't need a load E tire at 2850 = 11450 lbs capacity on that size trailer. Trailers unlike our trucks can be over tired for best long term reliability.

The D tire at 2540 = 10160 lb capacity which is way above your trailers 4000-4200 lb axle load requirements. All your trailer needs is a tire with 10-15 percent reserve capacity above axle ratings and can be ran at max pressures as Carlisle warranty specifies.

Thanks for the heads up about the Trail USA's. I agree that the LRE might be over kill. My axles are rated #4400 for a total of #8800. Of course, my actual axle loads are only in the #7000 range and I don't really see that changing as it includes a full tank of water and all my junk.

I'm leaning toward the Radial HD's in LRE or LRD. My rims can handle either. I would like something rated for more than 65MPH as it's often hard to stay below that threshold.

Just curious, what are the downside problems related to an "over tired" trailer?

[JIMNLIN]

Carlisle Trail USA's is a old tech bias ply tire and has one of the longest complaints record on NHTSA tire complaint website. Their better suited for a lawn service trailer that used around town at sub highway speeds.

Carlisle has a Radial Trail HD that is their newest and best tire for RV trailers that see lots of open road use at normal speeds.

You sure don't need a load E tire at 2850 = 11450 lbs capacity on that size trailer. Trailers unlike our trucks can be over tired for best long term reliability.

The D tire at 2540 = 10160 lb capacity which is way above your trailers 4000-4200 lb axle load requirements. All your trailer needs is a tire with 10-15 percent reserve capacity above axle ratings and can be ran at max pressures as Carlisle warranty specifies.

[Dog_Trainer]

If you go to an e rated tire and want to run the max pressure, maake sure your wheels are rated to take the pressure. I know my wheels are rated to run 65psi so e rated tire at 80 psi would be a no no.

[hohenwald48]

kcfissel wrote:
When I replaced my OE 205/75R15 LRC I put Carlisle 225/75R15 HD on my 26' Koala trailer, and run them @ 65 psi. My trailer is a lightweight trailer, and the tire dealer installed LRE instead of LRD as I ordered, but they were already installed so I kept them rather than reorder the LRD/s as we were ready to head west.
We put about 7500 miles on them, so far, to Albuquerque and back to SC.

Being as though they are 10 ply tires, and are a bit stiffer, I get a bit of sway due to the wear in the traffic lanes from the heavy trucks, but overall I'm pleased with them so far. I think it's a good choice in a tire.

Aren't they stamped as max 80PSI on the side wall? I wonder if additional pressure would stop some of the sway you experienced? I've read that higher pressure will minimize any sway from sidewall flex. I always run my tires at max sidewall PSI anyway. Thanks for the information. I think I'm getting ready to place an order for 4 of these Carlisle HD's in LR-E.

[3oaks]

From what I have read on other sources, I would not hesitate to go with the Carlisle HD tires. For ST trailer tires they may be equal to or even better than the Maxxis ST tires which are highly recommended among RV trailer towers.