Are lithium batteries worth the cost?

[Avid_Fox]

I can carry two group 29s in my AF1150.

Are they worth it?

[c_traveler2]

Avid Fox wrote:
I can carry two group 29s in my AF1150.

Are they worth it?

Yes they are worth if you need power and don't want to run your generator. I have 3 each 100Ah BattleBorn Batteries along with 480 watts of solar. I use Renogy DCC50S 12V 50A DC-DC On-Board Battery Charger with MPPT to manage the 12Vdc to dc side and solar input (MPPT). I need this kind of power (storage) due to the fact I've a 12Vdc compressor refrigerator as my biggest load.

[otrfun]

Siletzspey wrote:
. . . At ~13.6VDC from my 45A-capable Progressive Dynamics converter/charger with very short 4AWG wiring, my 100Ah x 2 BattleBorns at 50% SOC choose to pull ~4A total. At 13.6VDC, their thirst for current is minimal . . .

Interesting. We have the same PD 45a converter and get a steady 20-25a of charge current at 13.6v charging our 200ah LifePo4 pack from 10-90% SOC. Get 45a charging at 14.4v from 10-95% SOC.

[toddb]

The victron BMV-712 has a relay that can be used in charge mode, requires a pair of wires go to the PD charge converter. This is how I have mine installed, it will turn on and off the charger depending on state of charge...no float.

[time2roll]

FWC wrote:
Maybe third time will be a charm for Progressive Dynamics?

This is why Elon is so successful. He goes right to the solution. Engineer the product direct to the needed parameters. No hundred year legacy to adapt.

[FWC]

Maybe third time will be a charm for Progressive Dynamics?

[time2roll]

I have heard the PD two voltage lithium converter is already out. Still too high IMO.

[otrfun]

Durb wrote:

FWC wrote:

BFL13 wrote:

Durb wrote:
I installed a 100AH Battle Born battery and Progressive Dynamics Lithium Convertor in my trailer. No maintenance, no removing the battery during the winter, no battery tender during the off season. I don't obsess about SOC and all the other stuff in this thread. I just ignore the battery and expect to do so for the next ten years. So far, the battery meets all my needs. So, for me, the lithium conversion was worth it.

If that means you are leaving it plugged in for long periods of time doing 14.4-14.6 after it has been fully charged, AFAIK, that would be against Battle Born's guidelines.

Some say to isolate that PD Li converter from the LFPs soon after the batts are fully charged. You still want the converter on in the RV.

That PD Li converter might have been a big mistake in their rush to have something to sell with "Li" written on it.

Agreed, I have no idea why progressive dynamics thought a constant 14.6V output would be a good fit for a lithium battery. You want to shut this off after the battery is charged, or better yet just use their regular converter, which is better suited to lithium.

Let me get this straight. Progressive Dynamics, a leader, designed a convertor for lithium batteries that isn't as good for lithium batteries as their non lithium convertor? What if I just unplug the convertor between trips, say three weeks? I do disconnect the battery during the off season. I wonder why Battle Born sells my exact charger for use with their batteries.

Yes, Battleborn may "recommend" the Progressive Dynamic single-stage 14.6v Lithium charger, but they qualified that recommendation when I called them a year ago. They "suggested" the PD Lithium single-stage 14.6v converter/charger not be connected to their battery for more than 2 weeks *if* it wasn't being used/discharged during that time. In other words, don't float the BB with this particular converter/charger for more than 2 weeks.

BTW, PD is fully aware of BB's position on this. They told me a year ago they were working on releasing a 2 stage lithium converter/charger line that would float at 13.6-13.8v.

[StirCrazy]

Dodgemahal wrote:

StirCrazy wrote:

Dodgemahal wrote:


Not putting a DC to DC charger in the system carries the risk of two things. Discharged lithiums can pull max current from your (non smart) alternator which will burn it up and possibly cause a fire. Ending up on the side of the road is a big possibility.

Lets clear this one up before it starts spreading as fact.

The only way this is going to happen is is some one took the fuse out of your charging line for your 7 way. Or if some person who didnt have a clue installed there own because it want a factory option and didnt put a fuse in.

I think most of this stems from the youtub video of a guy hooking a li pack directly to an altnator with large wires and started it up using an electric motor. no fuse now voltage loss and yes it did start stuf burning.

having said that I still would encourage the use of a LFP compatable DC to DC charger and proper wiring to provide the LFP battery its best charging.

Steve

Steve

Well you just reiterated what I was mentioning. The proper way to charge Lithiums (with the truck charging system)is with a DC to DC charger and not unregulated with a smart or dumb alternator. Because the lithium battery will absorb a lot of amps if you offer it up. Not sure what you cleared up though. Facts are what we both stated. So thank you. 🙂

what I cleared up is that in reality if you have LFP batteries hooked to your charging system you will most likely be fine. the smaller fused charging line will only let so much go and it wont be enough to blow your altanator, and most likely not even enough to pop the fuse. is a DC to DC better, ya I would recomend them no matter what type of battery you have as a truck altanator throws out what it throws out... designed for a starting battery but it isnt dialed in for deep cycle, agm or LFP. it will work as the values are close enough but not optimal.

so realy unless your factory vehicle has been messed with you have no worries while you are waiting for a proper charger to install.

Steve

[FWC]

Durb wrote:

Let me get this straight. Progressive Dynamics, a leader, designed a convertor for lithium batteries that isn't as good for lithium batteries as their non lithium convertor? What if I just unplug the convertor between trips, say three weeks? I do disconnect the battery during the off season.

That is correct. It is not going to destroy your battery, but at minimum I wouldn't leave it on while you are not actively using the camper. LiFePO4 batteries don't need to be float charged at all, and certainly don't want to be float charged at the very top of their voltage range.

Being a 'leader' an industry that is not exactly known for its technical prowess doesn't count for much.

[Durb]

FWC wrote:

BFL13 wrote:

Durb wrote:
I installed a 100AH Battle Born battery and Progressive Dynamics Lithium Convertor in my trailer. No maintenance, no removing the battery during the winter, no battery tender during the off season. I don't obsess about SOC and all the other stuff in this thread. I just ignore the battery and expect to do so for the next ten years. So far, the battery meets all my needs. So, for me, the lithium conversion was worth it.

If that means you are leaving it plugged in for long periods of time doing 14.4-14.6 after it has been fully charged, AFAIK, that would be against Battle Born's guidelines.

Some say to isolate that PD Li converter from the LFPs soon after the batts are fully charged. You still want the converter on in the RV.

That PD Li converter might have been a big mistake in their rush to have something to sell with "Li" written on it.

Agreed, I have no idea why progressive dynamics thought a constant 14.6V output would be a good fit for a lithium battery. You want to shut this off after the battery is charged, or better yet just use their regular converter, which is better suited to lithium.

Let me get this straight. Progressive Dynamics, a leader, designed a convertor for lithium batteries that isn't as good for lithium batteries as their non lithium convertor? What if I just unplug the convertor between trips, say three weeks? I do disconnect the battery during the off season. I wonder why Battle Born sells my exact charger for use with their batteries.

[time2roll]

I would far prefer 14.3 with short absorption and drop to 13.3 volts for immediate storage or continuous normal use. Holding LFP at 100% is again applying lead-acid charging parameters to a different battery. Change is hard.

[jaycocreek]

Battleborn wrote:
If you are storing your rv and wish to have it plugged in, we would recommend a float voltage of 13.6 volts. If you have a higher voltage applied in float(such as 14.6) then we would recommend that this be no longer than 3 weeks at a time.

[FWC]

BFL13 wrote:

Durb wrote:
I installed a 100AH Battle Born battery and Progressive Dynamics Lithium Convertor in my trailer. No maintenance, no removing the battery during the winter, no battery tender during the off season. I don't obsess about SOC and all the other stuff in this thread. I just ignore the battery and expect to do so for the next ten years. So far, the battery meets all my needs. So, for me, the lithium conversion was worth it.

If that means you are leaving it plugged in for long periods of time doing 14.4-14.6 after it has been fully charged, AFAIK, that would be against Battle Born's guidelines.

Some say to isolate that PD Li converter from the LFPs soon after the batts are fully charged. You still want the converter on in the RV.

That PD Li converter might have been a big mistake in their rush to have something to sell with "Li" written on it.

Agreed, I have no idea why progressive dynamics thought a constant 14.6V output would be a good fit for a lithium battery. You want to shut this off after the battery is charged, or better yet just use their regular converter, which is better suited to lithium.

[BFL13]

Durb wrote:
I installed a 100AH Battle Born battery and Progressive Dynamics Lithium Convertor in my trailer. No maintenance, no removing the battery during the winter, no battery tender during the off season. I don't obsess about SOC and all the other stuff in this thread. I just ignore the battery and expect to do so for the next ten years. So far, the battery meets all my needs. So, for me, the lithium conversion was worth it.

If that means you are leaving it plugged in for long periods of time doing 14.4-14.6 after it has been fully charged, AFAIK, that would be against Battle Born's guidelines.

Some say to isolate that PD Li converter from the LFPs soon after the batts are fully charged. You still want the converter on in the RV.

That PD Li converter might have been a big mistake in their rush to have something to sell with "Li" written on it.